Announcement: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

[D F Smith Historic]

Hello All,


In an effort to put my customers, past, present and future minds at rest.

Due to the recent and re-occurring thread regarding Boiled Linsed Oil Based Paint and Oil Cloth, and the un reasonable fear it has caused.

Please read the following regarding Painted Cloth and Oil Cloth items made by Trans-Mississippi Depot Company.

Since 1994 Trans Mississippi Depot Co. has been utilizing Period Paint and Oil Cloth recipes and Varnishes and Emulsions that are Boiled Linseed Oil Based.

I have NEVER in the 14 years I have worked with Boiled Linseed Oil, had any spontaneous combustion issues or health issues arise from the aprox 2,000-3,000 painted cloth or oil cloth products that I have produced and sold.

Point 1) The Boiled Linseed Oil I use is 100% Natural and Food Safe first and foremost.

Point 2) I only use thickeners that are food safe and period (Chalk or Alumn)

Point 3) ALL the Painted Cloth and Oil Cloth I make is dried for a week and hung to cure for a minimum of 3 weeks (depending on humidity), To make it safe to use.

(Curing is the process that makes a Linseed based paint or emulsion dry through all layers and stable and non self combusting.)

Point 4) No Painted or Oil Cloth item is EVER sent out unless it is TOTALLY SAFE for the customer.


If anyone has any questions or issues about the items I produce concerning the period paint and emulsions I use. PLEASE CALL ME (928) 649-1395

Thank you

Don S

[Marylander in Grey]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Here Here,
In the 20 plus years in the hobby I have never seen or heard of anyone dieing or being injured from the stuff. MSDS is a great program and I want to advise most of the preserved prepared foods we buy at the store are full of carcinogens and unhealthy chemicals even though the FDA says otherwise. So shall we quit eating?
On a another point considering the amount of surviving original haversacks, knapsacks mess covers ect... that have not combusted after all these years I find it difficult to consider it an unsafe product.
Perhaps if you are so concearned about your personal safety perhaps you find another hobby or go towards a more progressive crowd.

[Brad Malone]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Greetings All,

I just want to second what Don is saying about the Boiled Linseed oil paint. I have not worked with period paints as long as he has, but In all my years I have never had any problems (Health or Fire) with the stuff. The key to it all is, as Don said, “drying time”. I have heard all of the horror stories of how the soldiers knapsacks spontaniuosly combusted while in the railcars. The equipment being issued to the troops was probably still dripping wet with the paint, and was bailed together like wet green hay. I know that neither Don or any other vendor would put their customers in harm. I know I won't.

Now from a professional point of view

In my full time job I have been a Firefighter for twelve years, and I have had my share of fires from oil soaked rags. The key word there was “oil soaked”. These fires were from careless workers who did not let the rags dry before placing them in a trash can or bucket. I am also a Haz-Mat technician and I have learned that all things can harm your health, in quantities. Look up the hazards of Flouride which is used in toothpaste. If you read that you would never want to brush your teeth again. It is very deadly.

Just my two cents,

Brad Malone

[BarryDusel]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

This is a matter of how correct one wants to be. How much one wants to put into their impression. I opt to be correct and I've done it with comfort .
I have no overwhelming fear of anything from the 18th/19th century because there's no need to.
After being a full time firefighter, (it was my career!) . Retiring as a Captain in 2007. Overall being in the fire service for 32 plus years . I'll say I never ever had a fire caused by any cloth painted with a linseed oil based paint . As Brad said earlier . My experience too is that I've experienced more then a few fires caused by rags soaked in oils, and other unknown chemicals . More often too caused by improper disposal and handling .Then again none of my own personal items painted with linseed oil based paints ever combusted spontaneously. It's important to remember that in the last 100 years we have learned much about using it, disposing of it , etc. As to the brooha I would say that when it does happen. It's sensationalized by the media and idiot fire officers who want to exhibit their expertise as to cause and origin . Finally, take what the NFPA and it's minions say about anything and relieze that those committees making up NFPA opinions, standards and policies are has beens and never will bes. There are also folks on those committees from companies who have a vested interest in promoting new products to replace old ones . They will stop at nothing to debase another product . To all with a concern about linseed oil based painted materials. I say there's no fire danger . Unless one is a idiot and even a idiot will find it hard to create spontaneous combustion in a material painted / properly prepared with period finishes. On the other subject of health . I can only say I know quite a few old retired folks who were painters in their working years. In the day when they used lamp black mixed with linseed oil to make their own paints or added lead to improve their product . These folks were exposed to a whole lot more of the products then any consumer ever will. Like Brad too, I'am still a Haz Mat Tech and I'm more worried about the chemicals in our 21st century Ersatz food stuffs then linseed oil finished items.
In the end I guess it's a matter of personal preference though . Education and experience showed me that there's nothing to fear .

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Hallo!

Linseed and tung oil dry by polymerization (molecular alignment in chain-like structures) and auto-oxidation, not by evaporation. The oxidation is an exothermic reaction that is accelerated as the temperature increases.
Rags wet with linseed oil are considered a fire hazard because they provide a large surface area for the oxidation of the oil. If the rate of heat build-up exceeds the rate of heat dissipation, it can become sufficiently hot to cause spontaneous combustion (fuel plus oxygen plus heat).
Rags in an enclosed container reduces heat dissipation.

In February of this year the fire at Albuquerque, NM's El Rey Theater-Golden West Saloon was ignited by the spontaneous combustion of linseed oil soaked rags left in a plastic container.

There is no exothermic reation producing heat once the linseed oil is dry.

Curt

[J.H.Berger]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Gentlemen, as for the self combustion- well it is simply obvious that is only dangerous if you do not take care of certain things like letting the rags dry properly. The good painted item vendors haversacks etc. are dried thoroughly anyway so I simply do not understand why anybody is afraid that his haversack will start fire!
The heatlth thing, well your officials seem to be as crazy as ours, forbiding everything that might under certain circumstances if all bad things come together cause whatever. So if you eat 40-50 haversacks the poisonous chemicals in there might cause you harm. Well I fear eating that many will most likely cause the most harm. I am just remembering that foolish invention of some sutlers to offer their US beltplates filled with rosin instead of lead( solder with 2 parts tin and 1 part lead is what the Ord. Manual. requires).So which reenactor is eating his beltplate filling so that it might cause him health problems!!!?????
I think it is more dangerous to live in a large city and breathe all the smoke from the cars etc. than having an oil painted haversack at you side with your foodstuff wrapped in a rag or whatever.

[Mcouioui]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

I agree, And no smoke, no eat, no sex, no drive, no TV...
Its real dangerous for your health. ;)

[C.R. Henderson]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

WHAT!!! We cant have common sense clogging up these boards!!!:wink_smil Don, that was well put. I've no quims or quaffs about boiled linseed oil at all. I even use it on my reproduction furniture and have never had a problem with it- even the rags- because they're hung out to dry (and I usually forget about them and leave them hanging out on the fence... I might ought to throw them away...

[DougCooper]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Just to be safe, I store all my Don Smith knapsacks, haversacks, extra linseed oil and nuclear waste in a bunker about 100 yards behind my house....;)

Seriously, Don proves that doing it the original way is both authentic and safe. I have never received anything that was not properly dried. I am impressed with the durability as well - the finish is excellent.

As for bailing before drying, I had a chance to examine a pile of original knapsacks a couple of years ago. There were about 10 of them that had obviously been bailed together forever until the new owners had pried a few off the top. It was safe to say these had not been dried completely before being packed, just as Don says below.

[Prodical Reb]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Don,
Nicely put. I was just using boiled linseed oil on some gunstocks today as I have done for years and hand tool handles and nothing has ever happpppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp pppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp ppppppppppppppppppp ..............;)



St Peter says ROTHFHAO- "The poor soul just keeled over dead. I warned all of those fools through the EPA and other like agencies that if they used boiled linseed oil to much they would die!"

[D F Smith Historic]

Re: Trans-Mississippi Depot Co Linseed Paint and Oil Cloth

Hi All,

Thank you for you responses to my initial post. I was surprised to have so much support.

My main reason for posting the facts about the period paints and finishes I use was as mentiond at the top, was due to the re-occurring and misleading scare tactic used by one particular vendor.

Who, would seem to rather twist the truth to benefit themselves, unreasonably scaring folks. By producing the resulting annual hysteria regarding linseed oil.

To the point that good folks sell off their period painted cloth items based solely on misleading information (This has happened recently for the first time I knew about).

The information seems to be purposely put up by that vendor to mislead and legitimize that vendor’s use of non period Latex paint, while casting aspersions on others who use period paint responsibly and properly.

It is interesting to note by that vendors logic posting the particular information they have, and the resulting hysteria from it. That people who take Flaxseed oil as a supplement, should either be dead of cancer or are spontaneously combusting (both assumptions are of course ludicrous)

Flaxseed is where Linseed oil comes from.

NOTE: The Flaxseed produces both Flaxseed Oil (cold pressed) & Linseed Oil ( Pressed and heated) in the case of the food grade 100% natural stuff I and others use.

I normally have not commented on this issue regarding the safe linseed based paints I and others use for the past several years, preferring to keep to my work & let it run off my back.

Things have gone way too far, to a point where unknowing folks are being purposely scared into a particular line of thinking. I will not simply stand by any longer.

I feel a duty to my customers, the authentic community & to help inform folks about the period paint & emulsions that I and others use in the hobby today, are TOTALLY SAFE, and to defend their use using fact.


As mentioned in my original post, Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions or concerns about the period paint & emulsions I use

All the best

Don S