Department of Alabama Jacket

[JerseySkilletLicker]

Friends,

Presented for your approval:

The Department of Alabama jacket is an under-represented garment that saw issuance beginning around the time of the Atlanta Campaign through the war's conclusion. This exacting reproduction is constructed of Family Heirloom Weaver's jean. The collar trim is a copy of the original material- blue wool on a brown cotton warp. Features slash pocket on the left breast, five hand-worked buttonholes, and topstitched in logwood thread. Five correct wooden dish buttons will be used as well. This jacket is ideal for later-war scenario events, particularly for Western CS impressions.
$185 plus S&H





Also in stock; Trimmed Commutation Jackets; a new batch of civilian shirts (pictures coming) and the knit bottom shirt run continues!

[markj]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Hi Joe,

Thanks for the update. Just one little problem: Your personal e-mail address apparently isn't working. I just sent you a note and it bounced. Do you have an alternate e-mail address?

Inquiring minds want to know,

Mark Jaeger

[JerseySkilletLicker]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Mark,
Ahhh...the wonderful world of Microsoft Outlook, somtimes messages bounce for no reason at all. You can always call, my alternate email is:
winger6049@aol.com

[Yellowhammer]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Joe,

Just curious as to your documentation for the usage of "Department of Alabama" jackets on the Atlanta Campaign. It has been my understanding that these jackets were issued later than that.

I double-checked "A SURVEY OF CONFEDERATE CENTRAL GOVERNMENT
QUARTERMASTER ISSUE JACKETS" and here is what Les Jensen has to say on the subject:

"The last group of jackets to be covered here are all associated with units of the Army of Tennessee that were assigned to Richard Taylor's Department of Alabama after the abortive Nashville campaign. Taylor noted the efforts to resupply these troops in his memoirs as occurring in February, 1865."

I'm not saying the Atlanta Campaign dating is incorrect (I'm not familiar enough with the AoT supply system to do that.) but was curious as to the discrepency.

[Gallo de Cielo]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

John and all,

This post may have been up for a day or two but I've been kept away from the computer for a few days.

My wife and child both had to undergo surgery late last week so it may take me a bit to get some specific information up here but let me preface that discussion with the following points.

One, although Marse Jensen's fantastic study is a valuable tool, it is certainly dated. Relying soley on that work as THE authority in CS uniforms is, in my opinion, no longer the only valid option. To explore a bit within the few paragraphs devoted to this type of jacket within the "Confederate Issue Jackets" treatise, there honestly is quite a bit of ambiguity. First and foremost is the Donald/McDonald jacket which Jensen concludes was "most likely" issued to the McDonald in New Orleans near the war's end. There is no solid evidence to support that claim any more than there is to say that the jacket actually belonged to the pre-Vicksburg J.M. Donald. Thus, although the confusion regarding the name causes some havoc with positively IDing the jacket to an owner, the very real eventuality exists that the first of these jackets could have been issued in the days prior to the fall of Vicksburg. Cockrell's Missourians were certainly in the vicinity which leaves that door open.

Two, I can't recall the gentleman's name, I want to say Rich Saathoff, but I could be incorrect. At any rate, he has an image with a date stamp of 1863 of a soldier wearing what looks to be a Dept of Alabama jacket.

Three, although I don't have a physical copy of the OR's at hand, I do recall reading through an inspection report filed on the eve of the 1864 Nashville campaign citing issuance of many items, ranging from shoes, uniforms, and accoutrements. Tragically the inspector did not elaborate to the length of "10 Mystery Jackets, 10 Columbus Depot Jackets, 10 Department of Alabama jackets" etc. Inconvient? Yes. But at the very least it shows that uniforms (although the general destitution of the men even at the onset of the camapaign shows that it was a case of too little, too late) were reaching the fighting men. Clearly these garments could have come from a variety of depots and distribution points but it leaves open the very real possibility that at least a portion of that supply came in the form of what we now refer to as Department of Alabama jackets.

To be clear, I'm not countering a supposition with further suppositions but rather illustrating that a great deal, particularly from this late point in the CS side of the war, remains unknown and may forever be that way. With that said, men were drawn from that department before the campaign who could have very realistically been wearing that type of jacket and the Army of Tennessee, both before and after the ill-fated campaign would have drawn from that area too.

Certainly this is a fascinating issue that really sits as a "tip of the iceburg" sort of question regarding CS uniforms in general. It's my opinion, but too often we blindly and unwaiveringly cling to now decades-old theories and hypotheses in this realm of scholarship. Future discussions of equal interest might center along the lines of the "Mystery" jacket, the two "types" of Columbus jackets and what point in the war each is "correct" for, or Atlanta manufactured items. Indeed, with Columbus Depot items showing up in manifests for ANV issuances and Richmond rifle muskets seeing service as far west as Prarie Grove, Arkansas, the old, pre-set "knowns" are continually being challenged.

To conclude- photographic evidence would suggest that jackets meeting the criteria of what we now refer to as Department of Alabama Jackets exists poiting to issuance as early as 1863, surviving clothing issuances leave open the possibility that at least a portion of Hood's troops were issued items from that manufactury en route to Nashville, and finally, I would argue Taylor's POST-WAR account is a fairly thin foundation to posit that "then and only" then were Dept of Bamy jackets issued to the Army of Tennessee. Indeed, I would put more stock in some of the issue items documented in the OR's and CSR's being of the above mentioned pattern rather than a few general, sweeping statements written years after the fact by an army commander who would have had no use for knowning what exactly those uniforms looked like, just so long as his men were provided for. Really, Taylor gives little-to-no true insight- no description, no dept of origin, nothing beyond the documented fact that the army was in a dreadful state of supply and morale and that efforts were undertaken to alter those conditions as best as was possible. The fact that Missourians, Louisianians, and Mississippians in the infantry, artillery, and cavalry are attributed to the surviving garments of this type suggests that issuance was very widespread. This, combined with production figures that Jensen himself sites furthers my belief that it is incorrect to say with any remote degree of certainty that Department of Alabma jackets were only a very late-war issue item.

My two cents in my present sleep deprived state.

I look forward to extending this discussion.

Fred Baker

[JerseySkilletLicker]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

My apologies to Fred in that I forgot to mention in the initial post above that he is the maker of this jacket.
Thanks,
Joe

[Yellowhammer]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Fred,

Thank you for the exhaustive post. Sadly, I missed the opportunity to discuss this with you in May but Joe Hoffman was kind enough to point me in your direction when I recently asked a similar question.

I agree that new information is surfacing all the time but until someone takes the time to publish it, Jensen is still the best we have as a general work.

Allow me to address your points with a few comments and questions.

Point One- This is true. Jensen's notes are quite clear that the Donald/McDonald jacket's identification is conjectural (as is the 31st Mississippi example in the Virginia Historical society). However, the Dolan and Beck jackets have more solid provenance and do indicate issuance to late war troops serving in Alabama.

Point Two- This arguement is less compelling. Identifying garments from images can be problematic. For example, the J.Q. Marr jacket is quite similar to an RD III (Jensen's typology) in overall appearance, button count, features, etc... but dates from 1861. If one were to go merely on a photograph, one could surmise that the RDIII was available at 1861.

Point Three- I completely agree with you here. I agree it is a distinct possibility tha the AoT could have drawn supplies from a number of depots and supply sources in Alabama would not be out of the question.

Regarding the Dept of Alabama jacket, I think there is strong evidence to support Jensen's conclusions as to their usage. Further, I agree with you that there is evidence that they could have been issued to the AoT on the tragic Nashville campaign. However, I think the Vicksburg/Atlanta hypothesis requires a bit more research before it can be confidently endorsed by reenactors/living historians.

In summary, I completely agree that much more research needs to be done. I am personally fascinated with the CS four-button jacket of the type issued to TV Brooke and have been researching this garments for four years in hopes of finding something new. I sincerely hope that others are looking into Tait contracts (requests and actual deliveries), the Dept of Alabama jackets, and the Mobile/Mystery jackets.

That said, I wish you luck in your continued research. I have long been interested in Alabama troops and would love for someone to prove, or at least indicate, a wider usage for those very interesting jackets.

Warmest Regards,

[roundshot]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

There is at least one Department of Alabama shell documented as being worn at Nashville by the son of Louisianian Truman Seymore (killed at Gaines's Mill). It does not, however, have the typical blue jeans collar and has high quality Louisiana buttons instead of wood. Otherwise, it is identical. It resides in the Confederate Memorial Hall museum in New Orleans. There is also another example at the same site attributed to one of Walthall's Mississippi brigade I believe, but I am not aware of usage dates. Speaking of New Orleans, another superb specimen of the DOA shell is in the Louisiana State Museum, aka "The Cabildo." This one was worn by a member of the 23rd La. Consolidated, one of the Mobile garrison at war's end.

Other pics of the DOA shell can be seen in the "Portraits of Conflict" volume on Mississippi.

One additional thought, quite a number of solid cast "I" buttons have been found at Spring Hill & Nashville which were probably on Columbus jackets.This is just FYI.

Bob Williams
Reilly's NC Btty.

[Yellowhammer]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Bob,

Interesting post. The provenance of these garments certainly supports the contention that they may have been issued prior to/during the Nashville Campaign and seems to further cement Jensen's hypothesis that they were issued to troops in Richard Taylor's Dept late in the war.

[hardeeflag]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Bob,

Interesting post. The provenance of these garments certainly supports the contention that they may have been issued prior to/during the Nashville Campaign and seems to further cement Jensen's hypothesis that they were issued to troops in Richard Taylor's Dept late in the war.

I can't remember where I got this CDV image but it was several years ago. It is of a cavalry man wearing a "Dept. of Al." Jacket. on the back it indicates it was taken in Macon, GA. Unfortunatly it is not dated but I beleive it dates before the comencment of the Atlanta Campaign.

[Cpt Boone]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

There is at least one Department of Alabama shell documented as being worn at Nashville by the son of Louisianian Truman Seymore (killed at Gaines's Mill). It does not, however, have the typical blue jeans collar and has high quality Louisiana buttons instead of wood. Otherwise, it is identical. It resides in the Confederate Memorial Hall museum in New Orleans.

Bob,

I have examined several uniforms at Confederate Memorial Hall and am very familiar with this jacket. It is attributed to Col. Issac Gurdon Seymore but it is felt that it actually belonged to his son, a captain. My source at the museum is going to get me the correct name. This jacket does not look like any Dept. of AL Jackets. It is constructed like some officer jackets having a seperate cuff piece and Federal officer cuff buttons. I don't have my photo's in front of me but it may be a private purchase shell jacket as the trousers match the jacket and both now look a light brown color. I believe it does have a front pocket similar to Dolan's.

I have examined Dolan's jacket several times and found another jacket that is remarkably similar. It is the Confederate Artillery Jacket located in the Pink Palace Museum in Memphis, TN. It is of similar construction as the Dolan jacket, has a five button front (if memory serves) with brass Louisiana buttons, has a similar style pocket on the front but is on the right breast as opposed to Dolan's left breast. The major difference is that the cuffs and collar are faced in red. By looking at the attachment of the facing color, it appears to be a post-manufacture attachement. Through the moth/wear holes you can see that the jacket was originally not faced at all to include the collar. All the jean parts are of the same color. The museum does not have much information on this uniform so it is difficult to find out much about it. But with the similarities it has with the Dolan jacket, I suspect it may be from the same manufacturer. Also, the jean cloth on both are similar whereas the Seymore jacket is completely different.

I hope this helps.

[roundshot]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Thanks for the info, Tim. Externally at least, Seymour's jacket looked like a DOA to me. It does have a 5 button and the slash pocket, but it's been many years since I've seen (only on display). The color is now a nice brown.If you can, get your source at the Confederate Hall to check the provenance of the Mississippi jacket. Last I remembered, it was on a poorly lit bottom shelf.

Bob Williams
Reilly's NC Btty

[Cpt Boone]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Bob,

Can you be more specific as to the Mississippi Jacket? I don't remember one being attributed to Mississippi. I'm not saying there isn't one, just the only ones I have examined are of Louisiana origin. A description would help. Cheers.

[Cpt Boone]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

Bob,

The Seymore jacket probably belongs to Cpt. William J. Seymore, 30th LA. Inf. I believe Terry Jones edited a diary by him. On the Mississippi Jacket is it the on belonging to Maryvin (sp?) of the Madison Light Artillery? It is missing an arm and has VA buttons on it. Hope this helps.

[roundshot]

Re: Department of Alabama Jacket

I honestly don't remember. But there was another what I took to be a DOA jacket attributed to one of Walthall's brigade, the Thirty-something Miss. It wasn't well displayed. It wasn't the Madison Arty coat.

Bob Williams
Reilly's Btty