English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

[Devildog0311]

I was looking through EOG: Arms and Equipment of the Union and stumbled across a picture, on page 8, of the 78th Pennsylvania Infantry. There is a soldier on the very bottom row, in the center wearing an English snake buckle belt. I don't think it was common. I cannot find the picture online, so those of you who have that book take a look and let me hear some input on that. How common was it for a Federal soldier to wear a snake belt?

Best Regards,

[Duvall Leatherwork]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

Justin,

Check out Paul Johnson's Cartridge box book...he has a few great photos of Fed's wearing entire sets of english gear! According to his book, "the state of Massachusetts had purchased some 3,000 sets of English accoutrements"...Feds with english gear is rare, but it did occur, and there are photos to prove it!

Nick Duvall
Duvall Leatherwork
314 Wyoming Ave
Kingston, PA 18704
(570)283-9297
duvall_leatherwork@hotmail.com

https://www.duvallleatherwork.com

[c.irelan]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

If you look at the pic's taken on lookout mtn you will see them spread throught out but not in mass. I was told once that kit's were issued to the pice in full meaning if you had an enfield you got an english set but I have never found any documentation on that but I haven't looked very hard either but an educated guess leads me to say it aint so.

[Joe Walker]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

The 6th and 44th Mass was fully equiped with English accoutrements including the (snake) bucke belts. Thre was a great article in North/South Trader magazine by Howie Madaus back in May/June 1983 with photos. Oddly enough, today I looked over a Ross English cart box with black shoulder belt still attached.

joe Walker

[erik]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

The more interesting thing is the orientation of the buckle. While it is agreed that English accoutrements were issued in greater or lesser amounts, the fact that this soldier wears a belt of English origin but Federal issue cap box and apparent Federal Cartridge box sling does little justice to the all or nothing argument.
What is interesting here is the orientation of the snake. The buckle is intended to fasten from the right (male) to the left (female) by hooking up, that is the open end of thje snake head hooking up. This soldier is wearing it reversed.
As there are no obvious orientations such as the letters US to show "green side up" and he appears to be very young, maybe nobody knew what to tell him. Then again, he was issued it by people who did not know the proper way or did not care how it was meant to be used. It worked and nothing fell off during the climb.
Of more interest to accuracy is the backing which is the correct Enfield teardrop leather shape unlike the common short or flat backing to the buckle produced by most leather reproductions.
Excellent observation. I have looked at this photograph many times and did not note this. Sometimes we stand too far so that we cannot see the trees for the forest.

Erik Simundson

[Mark Susnis]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

check out this image that was on Ebay about a year ago...no unit ID given

Mark Susnis

[Duvall Leatherwork]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

Mark,

WOW...That's a great photo!!! He is wearing an American style scabbard, with English accoutrements! Thanks for sharing...

Nick Duvall
Duvall Leatherwork
314 Wyoming Ave
Kingston, PA 18704
(570)283-9297
duvall_leatherwork@hotmail.com

https://www.duvallleatherwork.com

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

Mark & Nick,
Heck Yeah! What's more...
He's totin' a Lorenz to go with all that Brit gear!!!!

[Duvall Leatherwork]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

John,

Good eye...I totally overlooked that one!!! Well, that would explain the American style bayonet scabbard!! The scabbard was separate to accommodate the Lornez bayonet! This is a great example of, "Never say Never" with CW gear!!!


Nick Duvall
Duvall Leatherwork
314 Wyoming Ave
Kingston, PA 18704
(570)283-9297
duvall_leatherwork@hotmail.com

https://www.duvallleatherwork.com

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

Hallo!

IMHO...
Never throw away a perfectly good belt and buckle just to get a "matching" rifle. :)

Curt

[Mark Susnis]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

Here's some more...The CDV was up for bid on Ebay. Check out this image from Mike Medhurst's awesome Civil War images site..SGT John Emery with an English snake buckle

http://mikemedhurst.com/Image_pages/08044Veteran.html

Regards,
Mark Susnis

[Mark Susnis]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

here's the attached CDV that was on Ebay..

Mark Susnis

[Garrett Silliman]

Re: English Snake Belt on Union Soldier

I was looking through EOG: Arms and Equipment of the Union and stumbled across a picture, on page 8, of the 78th Pennsylvania Infantry. There is a soldier on the very bottom row, in the center wearing an English snake buckle belt. I don't think it was common. I cannot find the picture online, so those of you who have that book take a look and let me hear some input on that. How common was it for a Federal soldier to wear a snake belt?

Best Regards,

Another interesting english note on that photo are a few guys who are apparently wearing english boxes. If you look closely at some of the gents they seem to have very narrow box belts sans eagle plates. This may be an indication of english c-box use with 1.5" belts. I love that photo - great variety of jackets, hats accoutrements.