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Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

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  • #46
    Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

    Originally posted by moarkcav View Post
    Do you have any information or pictures of the saddles and tack that were on the ship?

    Thanks,

    Chris Talburt
    Chris,

    As of now, there is one lonely saddle on display. It was necessarily sewn back together by hand with 100% cotton thread back in 1993-94. This is before I hired on, so I take great delight in the fact that the stirrups were sewn on backwards. People generally do not notice it, so there is a little Easter Egg for you if ever visit. Otherwise, they did a magnificent job.

    The saddle is devoid of any maker’s marks, but this plainly is not an East Coast saddle. Featuring both a high horn and a high back, it looks like an English saddle gone wrong. Those in the know have suggested a possible Mexican origin, and it seems plausible given that the Sante Fe Trail is just down the road.

    In any case, this is not a McClellan, though sadly most of our guests deem it so. Admittedly, these are the same folks who staunchly deny shaped footwear, even though we are holding evidence to the contrary two inches from their face. But I digress.

    About two years ago, we pulled a box from the freezer we believed contained a single pulling harness. We were amazed to find instead, four harnesses and another full saddle. It took the better part of a year --and some tremendous guidance from an Amish saddle maker -- to organize and then re-stitch all the pieces properly.

    Currently they are soaking in a preservative-- The PEG Matt mentioned earlier-- that will replace the missing oils in the leather and allow us to display them. In all likelihood, we are at least another year away from finishing them. Still, I had a lot of close up time sewing those bad boys together, and never found a makers mark of note on any of them.

    Most of that information apparently is on the wooden boxes the items were shipped in. Logically, there is a greater priority put on preserving the items themselves, rather than the boxes they came in. So it may be a while before we have all the manufacture companies documented or can tell you exactly how many saddles –or tack-- were truly on board.

    Here is a factoid we discovered that I really like, though I'm not sure how valuable it is to you. It looks more and more likely that all the harnesses were machine sewn. We kept finding areas where the original needle was unable to punch through the leather, suddenly jumped a section of about 2-3 inches and then finally punched back through again. There was no order or design to this, as we would find the mistakes in various locations and varying lengths. In all four cases, each harness showed obvious signs of being hastily made and mass-produced.

    If you look at the collection as a whole, you see this great of mixture of hand made and mass produced items. Some things like our nails and screws are all obviously handmade quality items. But, here we see harness making the transition to a machined good, and a shoddy one at that. Or at the very least, this particular shipment on one boat in 1856 made the transition.

    And to me, those missed stitches are akin to time travel. Observing the nuances of a few inanimate objects, you can see the actions and decisions of people long since gone. How would the harness have faired, being so poorly made, and what was the end result for the poor guy who bought it?

    I think that aspect of the collection is generally missed by a lot of the folks who come to the museum. They mostly want to see the pretty dishes and buttons. If you really look at even the most mundane artifact on our boat, it’s going to tell an amazing story. You just have to let it. The 150 year old lard for example, is quite the conversationalist.

    Again, I digress.

    I'm going to be at the museum on Monday, so I'll peek at the artifact records while I'm there. If I find anything pertinent, I’ll send you a pm. I'll see what I can do about getting pictures as well, since I'm sure we have some archived in the office computer. My apologies for the dissertation here, I’m one of those passionate history geeks.

    Best Regards,
    Rick Gath
    First Sibley Mess
    New Madrid Guards
    WIG

    [SIZE="2"][COLOR="Red"]Honorary Jonah for Life[/COLOR][/SIZE]

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

      Oh my God, when I saw these boots and shoes I stopped my breath.
      Oh man I fear I will have to travel to Kansas some day!!!The pictures of the shoes and boots and the remarkable condition left me slobbering:p:)
      If only I could go so "easily"as you can abroad!
      Jan H.Berger
      Hornist

      German Mess
      http://germanmess.de/

      www.lederarsenal.com


      "Und setzet ihr nicht das Leben ein, nie wird euch das Leben gewonnen sein."( Friedrich Schiller)

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

        Art,

        I have a pic of the shirt that provides much more detail than what I can post here and I just can't tell if the tab button comes through the top of the "bib flap." Maybe Mr. Gath could look at it in a few days and post here. This shirt is now in the spot where the "border ruffian" shirt was once laying. Facing the display, it's the burgundy shirt on the left. The one on the right has the nice pleated look placket.
        Matt Woodburn
        Retired Big Bug
        WIG/GHTI
        Hiram Lodge #7, F&AM, Franklin, TN
        "There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

          Thanks Matt,

          I'm guessing that it does, but its only a guess. How else would the front of the collar stay attached to the front of the shirt. Maybe Mr. Gath can let me know. Thanks again for posting the pix, I cant stop looking at them. How cool would it have been the unearth that treasure in a corn field!
          Art Stone
          13th N.J.V.
          Co."K"
          " Rally, Boys Rally"
          Last order from Cpt. H.C. Irish at Antietam

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

            If you'll think back to your own childhood, you'll remember when fish hooks came in containers very much like those match cylinders, and they aren't all that uncommon in antique stores today. Yes, they do look like oversized needle cases, and are often labeled as such for around two dollars. Charles Heath
            I think both you and I posted something about this a few years ago and I think I had mentioned the ones on the Arabia. That's what I've been carrying matches in for years.


            I've heard some people say that you should really have cast iron ears for the bail on boilers. While I did see cast iron ears on a boiler in another museum, all the ones I saw at the Arabia were of tin. Some were plain and simply curved. Others had a stamped groove around the hole through which the bail wire went. The ears were all riveted to the body of the boiler. Some photos are below. What do you think about that?
            Cunningham has been making boilers, etc. for quite a while with sheet ears, not cast. He didn't make it to the Arabia Museum until last year.

            I've heard people debate about what pocket knives should look like. That some knives look too modern. So what did they look like?
            I've posted pics of period knives on here before. (You can ask Dan Houde about them, I sent him 5 or 6 pages worth of pictures).They came from the Russel & Irwin Hardware catalogue of 1865. I've also posted pictures of what period shovels, axes, hatchets, can openers, civilian hobnails for shoes & boots and a few other items that people always argue about. Somehow it either gets lost in the shuffle or it gets ingnored. I think most of this stuff was lost in or was posted before the board change.
            Rick Bailey
            Melodian Banjoist from Allendale and Founder of Waffle Schnapps.

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

              Rick,

              The Russell and Irwin catalog is a great eye opener and resource for sure! And Dave told me a guy named Dan who makes antique pocket knives was at the museum a week or so before me looking over the knives. Dan Houde came to my mind immediately.

              These photos cover axe and hatchet head styles, and handle styles. Some of their hatchets have straight handles, while others have the same curve you'd find in a hardware store or Home Depot today. Notice the nail puller in the blade edge of one hatchet, while another has a short claw style nail puller. There is a hammer head on the back of one of the hatchet styles. I've thrown in a couple saw handles as well.
              Attached Files
              Matt Woodburn
              Retired Big Bug
              WIG/GHTI
              Hiram Lodge #7, F&AM, Franklin, TN
              "There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                We can do a comparison...
                Attached Files
                Rick Bailey
                Melodian Banjoist from Allendale and Founder of Waffle Schnapps.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                  Originally posted by Arthur Stone View Post
                  Thanks Matt,

                  I'm guessing that it does, but its only a guess. How else would the front of the collar stay attached to the front of the shirt. Maybe Mr. Gath can let me know. Thanks again for posting the pix, I cant stop looking at them. How cool would it have been the unearth that treasure in a corn field!
                  Art and Matt,

                  You are correct in the function of the shirt, but there is no physical proof remaining. If you look at the shirt again you will notice there are almost no buttonholes visible, save for the one on the collar itself. The buttons are sitting close to where they were originally. Still, when Flo Hawley repaired it, there was a need to obscure the corresponding holes.

                  This particular shirt is in pretty rough shape-- you probably can't see it, but there is mesh holding the area across the stomach together-- and it may be that she had to fold the material under to give it any kind of strength. Whatever the reason, those holes just are not there.

                  Almost all of the shirts we have preserved have this problem, and the same is true with the long underwear. Water just plays hell with fabric, even protein based material like wool. As a result, we only have five or six shirts done that are display worthy. And even then they have little flaws like the missing holes.

                  As for making a reproduction, Jay Stevens, a member of this very forum, made a fine reproduction of a similar shirt a year ago. He may be able to tell you where he purchased the wool and give you some guidance.

                  Hope this helps.

                  Best Regards,
                  Rick Gath
                  First Sibley Mess
                  New Madrid Guards
                  WIG

                  [SIZE="2"][COLOR="Red"]Honorary Jonah for Life[/COLOR][/SIZE]

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                    Rick & Matt,

                    Thanks for the post and the information. I thought it looked like there was material missing on the shirt. The way it's is on display it just doesn't look like the bib would close the right way, leaving an opening in the shirt. Also on top of the shoulders it looks like there was material added. I'll be in G-Burg this weekend and go to" Needles n Thread" to see what wool they have. Hopefully they'll have a burgundy colored wool. Thanks, Art
                    Art Stone
                    13th N.J.V.
                    Co."K"
                    " Rally, Boys Rally"
                    Last order from Cpt. H.C. Irish at Antietam

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                      Mr. Gath,

                      I too am interested in the saddle... is there a possibility you might have a picture of it? If so that would be grand!
                      Dios, libertad y Tejas,
                      Scott McMahon
                      Pyramid #593
                      Grand Lodge of Texas A.F.&A.M.

                      "It was not unusual, on the march from the Rio Grande, to behold the most decided evidences of terror and apprehension among the Mexican inhabitants, and more particularly whenever they caught sight of the Texas rangers..."

                      John S. Jenkins- History of the War Between the United States and Mexico

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                        Here are a few more shots of the treasures. The first shot is essense of coffee tins and some tinned fruit cans. All the others are general shots of many things to give a little perspective of the vastness of this collection. Enjoy!
                        Attached Files
                        Matt Woodburn
                        Retired Big Bug
                        WIG/GHTI
                        Hiram Lodge #7, F&AM, Franklin, TN
                        "There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                          Stinks it's a museum and not a store. I would love to walk in there and be able to say...

                          "let me get a couple pair of them boots, maybe some shoes, toss in a few packs of those matches, a sack of buttons, a few hats.....um, I'll take that nice shirt over there, actually do you gift wrap? It's for a buddy of mine down in Florida, he's into shirts. Ah, what the hell, throw in that shelf of tinware. Yea, fill the coffee pot with pocket knives before you bag it. What's that? Yea, paper please."

                          All joking aside, this is definitely on the list of places to visit before I die. Thank you Matt and everyone else who posted pictures. It's truly amazing to see this much stuff survived and is able to be conserved and displayed for all to view.

                          Is there a 'tourist season' out there or, I guess what I'm asking, is there a better time of year to visit than others?

                          Thanks again for all the pics and info!!!
                          Bill Lomas

                          [B][SIZE="4"][FONT="Century Gothic"][COLOR="SeaGreen"]E. J. Thomas Mercantile[/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE][/B]
                          [FONT="Century Gothic"]P.O. Box 332
                          Hatboro, PA 19040
                          [URL="http://www.ejtmercantile.com"]www.ejtmercantile.com[/URL]
                          [email]info@ejtmercantile.com[/email][/FONT]

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                          • #58
                            For those of you awaiting more info on the saddle, I am still "efforting” the request.

                            There is nothing in the artifact record pointing to a manufacturer nor any Maker’s mark visible on the saddle itself.

                            As I feared, the pertinant information is likely on the box the saddle was shipped in. There is no telling where that box even is, so it may be some time before we can nail down anything concrete.

                            I am going back to the museum this weekend to take some pictures for those who have been asking for them. If anyone needs a photo of something not covered by Mr. Woodburn’s excellent work – Though I cannot imagine what that might be—contact me before Saturday and I’ll see what I can do.

                            Best Regards,
                            Last edited by Steamboat Willie; 05-14-2008, 10:06 PM. Reason: Failed to write coherent sentences.
                            Rick Gath
                            First Sibley Mess
                            New Madrid Guards
                            WIG

                            [SIZE="2"][COLOR="Red"]Honorary Jonah for Life[/COLOR][/SIZE]

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                              Rick,

                              I forgot to get pics of the light weight stamped tin spoons. Very cool. And what about the brownish shirt with the brass buttons that was where the burgundy shirt on the left is now? Would have loved to see that shirt and what buttons are on it, how attached, etc. Those two would make for some great conversation once posted.
                              Matt Woodburn
                              Retired Big Bug
                              WIG/GHTI
                              Hiram Lodge #7, F&AM, Franklin, TN
                              "There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Steamboat Arabia - Everything you want to know!

                                Matt,

                                The “Brownish “shirt actually started its life as a green shirt with alternating light and dark stripes. If my research is correct the buttons are Federal Naval Officer buttons-- Eagles holding anchors-- and of the 30 or so buttons, only three are functional. Pretty cool shirt. I will make a point to photograph it as well as the spoons.

                                I have been thrilled to see such interest in the Arabia as it is something I spent a fair piece of my adult life working on. I am more than happy to continue to help folks with any specifics or requests they may have. Still, I understand my interpretations and photos are going to be unsatisfying. At the end of the day, people just have to see this stuff with their own eyes.

                                Getting to Kansas City is probably a haul for many people, and gas prices aren’t helping. Even if you make it to the museum, the good stuff is behind glass, which itself has been obliterated by some kid with a runny nose. It’s a major bummer, I know.

                                I am curious what the interest level would be in having a special “non-snot” backroom tour of the museum.

                                It is possible for me to organize a viewing of the artifacts out of the cases, and away from the public. You would be able to photograph, measure, and in many cases hold the artifacts themselves. I’m talking any artifact, anywhere in the museum, even those in storage or seldom displayed. The cost would be merely the entrance fee for the museum.

                                The caveat of course is I need this to be a one-time group activity. The more the artifacts are moved, the greater our preservation dilemma. And to be quite honest, it’s a ton of work to organize and set up, so it’s also easier on me to bring everything out once. Still, it’s something I enjoy immensely, and would like to do again before I leave the museum entirely. The devil is in the details, but we can get to those if there is a big enough response.

                                So, is there interest in doing an event of this type?
                                Rick Gath
                                First Sibley Mess
                                New Madrid Guards
                                WIG

                                [SIZE="2"][COLOR="Red"]Honorary Jonah for Life[/COLOR][/SIZE]

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