My Frock Coats Buttons

[Raven]

I just recently recieved a Richmond grey frock coat from my mother in Richmond grey. I was exicited and all when I got it until I noticed something horrible on them. The buttons. They're "CSA" buttons. Now I was just remembering a buddy of mine telling me that these buttons were never used during the war. Another bubby of mine told that these were rare but yes they did use them. Were these "CSA" buttons ever used during the war or are they just another product of farbyness?

[9thKyCoC]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Sir,

If memory serves me correctly, "CSA" buttons were rarely used and when they were, it was late in the war. Block letter buttons that signify a soldiers branch of service, ("I" for Infantry, "C" for Cavalry and "A" for Artillery") and some state buttons were the most common during the war.

Respectfully,

Pvt. Kirk

[rogue]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

You can easily replace your CSA buttons by using the Federal eagle button. Many original coats worn by Confederates have the eagle buttons, often referred to as "army" buttons by the wearers.
Steve Sullivan

[FranklinGuardsNYSM]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Does the make of said coat cite the original example from which it was copied as having CSA buttons?

[Jimmayo]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

CSA buttons were used in various styles but they are not common. They got their reputation because for many years they were the only CS button available and everybody used them. Those that are dug are found in early to late war sites. Better choice would be eagle buttons or what ever the original coat had if you are sure the buttons on the coat are the original buttons.

[MD_Independent]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Information regarding the coat's history (what original coat was copied to create the repro. coat), usage (was said original coat used by a specific soldier and/or unit), and the vendor who produced the repro. would be helpful if this discussion is to go further. Thanks.

Bill Birney
Columbia Rifles
(at least as soon as I pay my dues again... It's January already!)

[BrandonEnglish]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

While researching uniform construction, content, etc etc at the M.O.C. the curator and I got into a lengthy discussion about buttons on Confederate uniforms. He basically concluded to me that for Confederate uniforms the commonality and usage if it had to be ranked would be (1 being the most common):

1. Federal Eagle Buttons "army buttons"
2. State Seal Buttons (VA, MD, etc)
3. Block I, A, C, buttons

But of course I agree with everyone else if the frock coat is based on an original what did the original have?

[lukegilly13]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Strange that wooden or bone doesn't show up on that list....
Perhaps they are less durable and do not survive as well (during the war...i.e. they were lost/broken and replaced by the soldier, or they have decayed since).

[Andrew Kasmar]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Hi,

While there are originals with wood buttons, there are lot more (at least that I have seen) with eagles, state, or block buttons. The button type would also have alot to do with the theater of war you are portraying.

Andrew

[BrandonEnglish]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Strange that wooden or bone doesn't show up on that list....
Perhaps they are less durable and do not survive as well (during the war...i.e. they were lost/broken and replaced by the soldier, or they have decayed since).

There is also this to take into consideration, with the laws after the war, how many guys took off their state seal buttons and what not because they couldn't legally wear them and threw bone, wood, cloth covered buttons on there? I certainly didn't look at every jacket in the MOC but the majority do have brass of some sort instead of the "natural" buttons.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

Hallo!

"General service" "CSA" buttons are found dug and non-dug, and range from
very nice three piece stamped English made ones to more "crude" solid CS made castings.

An issue with CS uniform buttons is the question as to whether the buttons
are extant to the uniform and not a post War replacements. Such as readded to replace those removed after the War for sentiment or for say
1890's or 1900's veteran functions.
IMHO, it is always good to try to look to the sewing on buttons to try to assess whether they are "original" to the garment.

Sometimes it is easy such as finding post War button back mark.

Yes, at any rate, as shared... "CSA" general service buttons became the "kiss of death" due to their being universally used in reenacting at one time.

Curt

(Remembering the indignation of Texas Brigade members who, arriving back in Texas in 1865, were met at the boat, by US Colored Troops with scissors to remove their buttons.)

[Tom Ezell]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

There have been a goodly number of CSA buttons dug in some of the late War camps in the Trans-Mississippi, documented some years ago in Fred Adolphus' article in Military Collector & Historian on uniforms from the Houston Clothing Depot.

Post-war, it was illegal to display Confederate symbols -- to include identifiable Confederate States uniform buttons -- in public. Since their old uniform jackets were some of the few clothing items many veterans had, they replaced the buttons with generic civilian buttons, or covered the old Confederate buttons with cloth. A good number of original uniforms still display these cloth-covered buttons.

Bottom line, your CSA buttons are probably no worse than the "Richmond Gray" cloth for the coat.

[Jimmayo]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

While researching uniform construction, content, etc etc at the M.O.C. the curator and I got into a lengthy discussion about buttons on Confederate uniforms. He basically concluded to me that for Confederate uniforms the commonality and usage if it had to be ranked would be (1 being the most common):

1. Federal Eagle Buttons "army buttons"
2. State Seal Buttons (VA, MD, etc)
3. Block I, A, C, buttons

I would have to agree with the number 1 choice for the duration of the war. However the time period would have to be taken into consideration for the commonality of 2 and 3. From mid war on the recovery of dug buttons would indicate that the block buttons became more common than state buttons. From my experience around Petersburg hunting areas from Five Forks to the Howlett Line, about 3 or 4 block buttons are dug for every state button. SC buttons seem to be the most prevelant followed by NC sunbursts in these areas. Maryland buttons are somewhat scarce but I did dig my one and only near Hatchers Run.

[Raven]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

The federal eagle buttons and the the wood buttons were my first choices. I thought it would look more authentic if I mix and match the buttons to give a "replaced" look.

[Jimmayo]

Re: My Frock Coats Buttons

The federal eagle buttons and the the wood buttons were my first choices. I thought it would look more authentic if I mix and match the buttons to give a "replaced" look.

Sooo, you would have mixed and matched buttons on a new coat?

Does this seem logical?