Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

[NYCivilWar]

Hello All,

Nothing turned up of much help using the old search function, so I'll pose these questions here

First, I am looking for documentation of Federal Overcoat alterations. I am interested in written documentation, but am more interested in photographic evidence. Either period photos, or modern photos of original overcoats. An old thread that provided one example of a modification: http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/...tered+overcoat
There is an example of a Federal soldier in an altered overcoat on pg. 155 of the Federal Echoes of Glory. The coat is missing the cape, and there are additional--and quite large-- exterior pockets added to the coat. Any other images of this nature are what I'm interested in.

Second, and correct me if I am wrong, overcoats were turned in in the springtime. Would a soldier get his exact coat back in the fall? Or were they distributed at will in the fall?

Third, When the overcoats were turned in, where did they go? And when they were turned in with alterations where they fixed, discarded or what?

Fourth, although alterations to the coats were made, was this really allowed since the coats were government property?

Any info would be much appreciated.

Thanks,
Kyle M. Stetz

[CJSchumacher]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

This is from a post I started on another forum four years ago. While looking through, in addition to the un-ending amount of amazing things going on in this photo, pay attention to the black soldier in Detail H. He's got what you're looking for.

Now...this is one we've all seen, but I just started looking at this photo in detail and it has so many unbelievable assets to it. The picture is from the LOC collection, Call No. LC-B811- 2646, [Johnsonville, Tenn. Camp of Tennessee Colored Battery].

What sets this picture apart is not just that its colored artillery troops wearing mounted overcoats and mounted service jackets, but also the railroad junction, boxcars, 5 bronze guns w/ limbers, 5 caissons w/ limbers, the saddles, harness, and tack piled on each to stay out of the MUD!, living quarters, and corral. An absolutely amazing amount of pictorial wealth.

Here are some interesting details of the following attachments:

A: Detail of men on the lower right all apparently wearing mounted pattern overcoats
B: Detail of man in A with an artillery sword - question is NCO, chief of piece or section, guard??
C: Another detail from A showing two men both wearing spurs and note the pieced cape on the gentleman on the right
D: Detail of 12lb. bronze gun showing stacked harness and tack, including valise and drivers' saddles, TWO nosebags, collars, traces, etc.
E: Detail of caisson showing valise and drivers' saddles, hames, collars, traces, etc.
F: Detail of 12lb. bronze gun, but note drivers' saddle on top of limber with POMMEL HOLSTERS, whip, and saddle blanket over the cantle!! Also, note the tarp on the limber and another nosebag hanging to the ground.
G: Detail of white officer with what appears to be a enlisted mounted pattern overcoat and also wearing guantlets
H: Detail of soldier with pocket modifications to his mounted overcoat and what appears to be an artillery sword protruding from under said coat, also note the bump that is probably the hilt on his left side.
I: Corral in the background
J. Detail of corral with roofed structure built next to gate, note horses in the corral

All in all, just an unbelievable image of a colored artillery unit serving in muddy Tennessee in 1864. And I highlight nosebags because they are always cool to see considering how common an item of issue they were, yet how rare they are to find these days...though there are probably more, i know of only two in existence, both of which I've examined. They just issued them up after the war until they ran out and were eventually replaced with a later pattern.

Edit: I've added the photo detail I referenced from the attachments below. Its nice because these guys are all in mounted pattern overcoats, which adds to the mix.

[Will Eichler]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Kyle,

Two bits to help. I hope someone here can help you with a pic from the Kurtz auction last November. One of the items for sale was an enlistedman's foot overcoat with pockets added. I can't remember if there were other modification off the top of my head.

The second is in reference to what was done. I just acquired a copy of a book of letters from Johannes Van Lente of the 25th MI. The book is self published by his descendant and is rather hard to find but I now have a source. One of his letters home was actually more of a note. He enclosed the note with his overcoat. He wrote:

Dear Parents,
With this I am sending you my overcoat. Be so good and wash it out well and if something is torn fix it, so that when I write about getting it back, that I can get it again. Such a thing is so heavy to carry and I couldn't find it in my heart to throw it away. Thus when I write about it, be so good and send it again. We are all well and are in good spirits. Greetings to everyone.
Your son,
John van Lente

He referred to this note in a letter written on August 14, 1863 and the editor of the volume believes it was sent about the same time.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Will

[NYCivilWar]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Will,

I completely forgot that I had saved the Kurtz auction SA Overcoat, on my computer. I'll try and attach it to this post. Ok, so there's one!

Thanks for the letter excerpt as well.

-Kyle M. Stetz

[CompanyWag]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

I have an original infantry enlisted man's overcoat in my collection that has been modified in several ways. Two pockets have been added to the front near the waistline, an additional front closure button has been added to the front to make the coat close lower at the waist (six buttons total), and the cape has been removed. A small cuff (or cape) button has been sewn to the back at the base of the collar. With the presence of that button, I theorize that the removed cape was made to be buttoned on or off as needed by the soldier. This coat was originally published in the issue of the Mudsill's "Company-Wag" that had the article I wrote about modified clothing.

When I researched that article, I recall encountering a reference of an Indiana soldier removing the cape from his overcoat and lining it with gum blanket material so that he could wear it reversed in the rain.

I would be happy to post photographs of my original, but I am currently out of town.

Hope this helps add to the discussion.

Paul McKee

[Citizen_Soldier]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Greetings,
There is at least one federal overcoat in the collection of The State Historical Society of Iowa that features slash pockets inset into each side of the breast panels, much like the image posted earlier in this thread.

Darrek Orwig

[rmilstead]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

In EOG - Union (pp155 - "Special Support Corps") is a picture of members of the 15th New York Engineers dated May 1, 1863 which shows a fellow with what is likely an foot services overcoat that has had the cape removed and what appears to be a pocket added in front. I have seen other "standard" photos (i.e. those used in multiple publications ) where the cape has been removed but can't seem to find any of them at the moment. Anyway I believe that this may have been a fairly usual alteration. I have an original mounted service overcoat where this has been done but it is not known if the cape was removed during the war or afterwards.

Dick Milstead
Hardaway's Alabama Battery
Company of Military Historians.

[lukegilly13]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

I'm appologizing ahead of time because I do not remember the source of this image or who it is in it....but since it is what you're looking for i'll post anyway in hopes that someone will ID it for me....
Notice the exterior pockets.

[NYCivilWar]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Luke,

Thanks for the image, that's exactly the type of photo I'm looking for.

Keep 'em coming!

Thanks again,
Kyle M. Stetz

[lukegilly13]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Glad you liked it. I have more do to my fascination with overcoats of the period. This is a USCT fellow...alright, it's debatable whether or not this is a "greatcoat" however it does appear to have a cape to me:

This was taken from a post entitled "Black soldiers in full campaign gear". There are plenty of overcoat images.
http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/...highlight=USCT

[NYCivilWar]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Luke,

I found that photo last night on the LOC and tried to attach it to my post, but couldn't get it to work. There is also a soldier in a similar altered greatcoat in a Dutch Gap image. Search the LOC or Selected CW Images for "James River, Va. View of the completed Dutch Gap canal" and the image should come up.

-Kyle M. Stetz

[unclefrank]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

I did a pocket install an an old Jarnigan Mounted coat I had defarbed as much as possible. Very confortable.

[prestontoprail]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

For all you great coat lovers out there, one of my favorite images featuring the garment. Can't see any alterations, but it is neat none-the-less if you haven't seen it before.

[NYCivilWar]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Preston,

That is a great image. I think that image appeared in an issue of Military Images a while back. I am always surprised at how young these guys look.

-Kyle M. Stetz

[prestontoprail]

Re: Altered Federal Overcoat Documentation

Yeah, it is an interesting photograph. Their accoutrement are on the proper side with the breast plate and "US" buckle in perspective. However, the bayonet is on the reversed side indicating that it is a reverse frame. So I can't really figure out how that works. They do look extremely young, almost musician age.

Also, this is a snapshot from the infamous photo of the "federals" awaiting transportation at Chattanooga (although some will debate they are confederates as it has often been mislabeled). However, I notice that in this and many other photos some soldiers would turn down the collars. Just a neat detail I'd like to see around more. And what amazing hat hair!