Where Does THIS END of the Hobby Need to Improve MOST?

[PvtShot]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Gents,

1.) More organization on OUR end of the hobby.
- Seems like a new mess, unit, sub-unit, group, etc... pops up every week. Why?
- This would be an easy way to increase the quality control and help get everyone on the same page or even chapter for that matter...
- This would also help get more numbers to the EBUFU events and could also help in getting a large presence of "US" at the National events...
- This would also help to recruit new like-minded individuals as it would be less-confusing to know who, where, what to join...

2.) Be nice to eachother and learn some tolerance...
- There seems to really be some serious animosity among some of the groups out there and it really seems quite childish at times...
- There are so few of "US" out there, why can't we work together?

3.) More diverse scenarios at some of the EBUFU

4.) Getting large numbers together for the big national events, and figure out the best way to show the "others" how it should be done...
- I think this is the best way to "sell" OUR end of the hobby to the mainstreamer's on the fence...

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

I agree with the need to drill more, or at least study drill when we're not with others. I agree even more with the idea of reading more, especially the wonderful original sources that we find increasingly available on-line.

But my own particular wish is that people knew more about how the armies of the time were actually organized and run. Think how much easier first person would be if you could answer these questions for your various impressions at different points during the war:

*How much do I get paid? What's my clothing allowance and what does it cost to go over it if I draw, for example, an extra pair of pants?
*What's my money worth today, as opposed to last year? How do I send it home and is that worth doing?
*How much did I get for my bounty? How much is still outstanding? Who gets the balance if I'm killed?
*What happens to my stuff if I get killed -- not just the stuff in my pockets, but my clothes and equipment?
*If I get wounded, where will they send me, what happens to my stuff, and how do I get paid when I'm in the hospital?
*Same question if I'm captured -- is the exchange cartel still going? If I go to a camp, do I still get paid?
*How much is my state paying my family? If they're not paying them, what else might they be doing to help out?
*What are my chances of getting promoted? What other ways do I have of making extra money in the army?
*How do I get a furlough? What are my chances of swinging an "extra-duty" position in the rear?
*What's the difference between clothing, "camp and garrison equipage," and ordnance, and what does it cost me if I lose any of that stuff?
*Along those lines, when can I expect to stand inspection again, and what's going to happen if I'm missing any of my gear?
*How do I get new clothes? Who draws it, and do I have to sign for it?
*How often can I expect to do guard, fatigue, or detached service? Who keeps track of those things?
*What's an "Assistant Commissary of Subsistence" or does the Quartermaster take care of that?
*What does the adjutant have to do with the sergeant major and the first sergeants?
*When do I report for sick call, and who keeps track of that?

I could go on (and do -- I realize!), but these aren't terribly difficult to find out, and knowing these mundane aspects of army life would give everyone plenty of material for realistic conversations and complaints (not to mention a better understanding of the day-to-day mechanics of the armies we purport to represent). It would be even better if we could discuss the details of farming or 19th century crafts, but seems to me this isn't a bad place to start.

[estephenson]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Drill Drill drill, and more drill. Dress parade. Basic rifle maintenance. I recently got a complement on my "new" rifle ping, even though it is 20+ years old. Every rifle should be clean.

[tinman1863]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

I think that the most recurring theme or opinion is attitude, and I agree. After twenty years in the hobby, I am considering letting go of everything that I have and quitting. Back in the day, this was more about getting together with friends and having a good time. The last couple of events that I did, it was more of a round table discussion on thread counts and documentation and the such which is not a bad thing but it does drive people away when there is nothing else to do. Let's face it, there are not that many people willing to make big events happen and that's sad when one thinks back to the '90s when you had the large Franklin event and so on. What was being done differently then? Can it make a come back? I really hope that we didn't drive the lifestyle and hobby into extinction. Like I said, I haven't been to a large scale event in a long time, so if my comments are misplaced, forgive me. These are just observations.

[Hank Trent]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Back in the day, this was more about getting together with friends and having a good time. The last couple of events that I did, it was more of a round table discussion on thread counts and documentation and the such which is not a bad thing but it does drive people away when there is nothing else to do.

What's funny is that my experience at the last military event I went to was just the opposite. If this thread had been started five or ten years ago, you would have heard an ear-full from me, but now I don't know what to say, because I'm seeing this end of the hobby on a quick upward curve.

The last military event I attended was Backwaters, and it was the first time I'd been in a military camp that seemed like a military camp for the whole event. No, it wasn't perfect and it never will be, and I contributed as much if not more than anyone to make it not perfect, but it took my breath away. It was like a time machine. It was what I'd always imagined reenacting could be. Maybe I was just lucky to be assigned to the right place, but it seemed to be the same everywhere in Federal camp. I'd only ever seen that kind of cohesiveness and application of research when participating as a civilian, not that that's saying much, since civilian is what I usually do and I don't get to many all-military events.

It's the incredible detailed touches of research that are actually applied during the event, that impress me. Yeah, there are the mainstreamers who just want to socialize, and the hardkewls who just want to talk stitches, but then there are reenactors who just get out there and do their best to reenact the past, and that's what I call "this end of the hobby."

Just two random examples:
--Little sticks were randomly dropping out of a tree at night, to our surprise. We were a German and two Americans. The German in his accent suggested it was a "poltergeist, a mischevious ghost." We Americans reacted sorta like, "Huh, that's interesting, hadn't heard of that." It was like stepping out of a time machine. I was watching the English language change as immigrants brought their own culture to the melting pot--in addition to all the other military-history things going on.

--Before the event, I'd been reading about torpedoes left in the road for unsuspecting Yankees to run into and be killed, and Sherman had threatened to make prisoners ride ahead on wagons to clear the roads to detonate them. It was a new bit of trivia for me, but something men at that time and place would surely have been aware of when traveling unknown roads. During the march, the CS prisoners were being marched ahead of the column. One Federal soldier near me said to another, "Why are the prisoners marching up there?" The other answered, "Probably because of the torpedoes." Again, like stepping out of a time machine. Wow.

It was like that, just over and over again. If there's any direction to go, I think that's it: More details, more complexity, more application of research. It's challenging, but I'd rather feel like I'm a 21st century person struggling to keep up with the living history around me (which is how I felt at Backwaters), than be bored wondering when we're going to quit with the socializing and stitches and actually start reenacting.

Oh, and leave the cameras at home. They add nothing--in fact they take away from all the effort--and they don't capture what's great about events anyway.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[Busterbuttonboy]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Brushing up on recent, and quality, quantitative and social histories of the war.

[flattop32355]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Caveat: I'm a Fence Jumper. I move from side to side of the Mainstream/CPH fence at will and as desired.

Two items:

1) Every single reenactor at this level should know the bugle calls: Infantry should know theirs, cavalry and artillery should know theirs, and we should all have a working knowledge of at least "that ain't our call". Knowing the calls is so basic, it shouldn't even need to be me mentioned. It does.

2) Every single reenactor is an "expert" in some matter of the period that interests him/her. We may not know every iota of information about the subject, but we know a comparatively good amount about it, often more than the average person, even at "this end" of the hobby. So share the wealth. Post a two paragraph (or more) thread about it for all to see. None of it is original, so who cares if someone else wrote about it five years ago? Their take on it may well be a bit different, so it still adds to the overall knowledge of the whole. While, for example, not everyone cares about the details of all the possible pen nibs available at the time (sorry, Schnapps) or how and why to shoe a horse, it's still interesting to read about it and see how it applies to and affects my own impression. We complain about no new research....become a contributor.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

While, for example, not everyone cares about the details of all the possible pen nibs available at the time (sorry, Schnapps) or how and why to shoe a horse, it's still interesting to read about it and see how it applies to and affects my own impression. We complain about no new research....become a contributor.

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/showthread.php?9874-2007-School-of-the-Clerk

I have a lot more information to post, but I tend to reserve it for people who appear to care.

[Hardtack Herring]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

This end of the Hobby needs to....

1.Stop camping way back in the sticks out of site of the public.

2. Create a new shorter public demonstration that is brief and to the point (One that does not drag on with great detail on uniforms and other things that only we find interesting). A demonstration that holds the attention of the public for 100% of the time.

3. Attend more mainstream events if not to participate in the battles but to make a strong public presence. Conduct several public demonstrations at set times. Camp up in the front where the public is bound to see us.

4. Unity among like minded organizations in the East and the West.

5. Tolerance and patience towards the mainstream side of the hobby.

[OldState]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

I second all of Mr Herring's sentiments. I also fail to see how things like EFUBU do much to promote and grow this end of the hobby. I always felt the primary object of my participation in this hobby should be the education of the public and helping the hobby grow. What better way to honor the men who fought then to give the public the absolute most accurate depiction of what CW soldiers looked like and how they lived. I think the living histories are some of the best opportunities to recruit new people and participating in "main-stream" events is the best way to convert people to the authentic side.

[BenjaminLDavis]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Sing.
Simply that.
Before there was the internet, before television, even before radio, people sang together. And they all knew the words.
I aim that last barb at myself. Learn the words.
Singing round the campfire ~ sometimes forgotten. But an essential part of who they were.

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Stop being Elitist, My Unit does events to help raise money for preservation. Yes it could be labeled "Ham and Yam", "Mainstream", etc, but we have raised over 100,000 dollars in the last 8 years. Bet not many Units can say that. We also enjoy doing Campaigner Events, but we are not so wrapped up in ourselves, to rule out the preservation type of events.

[OldKingCrow]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

We complain about no new research....become a contributor.

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/...l-of-the-Clerk

I have a lot more information to post, but I tend to reserve it for people who appear to care.

I have typed and posted byte after byte of primary material here and elsewhere, from a variety of perspectives and sources. For the longest time I wouldn't even post my own words and posted almost exclusively in primary quotes. I know from personal responses in the field and the times I was able to put up support where it lacked, many appreciated the effort.

After being harangued about it by mods, I won't post another primary reference in an open thread ever again.


CJ Rideout
Tampa, Florida

[GrumpyDave]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

Camping skills. Folks need to learn to work together in the field so they can survive rain and cooler temperatures. For 6 years it rained at every event I attended. Yes, it did and I AM NOT DEAD.(I hear it's some sort of record. I have also been asked to go to African Nations to solve their drought problems.) Have we become so homophobic, we can't get with other folks so we can pick a campsite that's sheltered as it can be for the circumstances, erect proper shelter, help each other stay dry or dry out, and spoon so we can stay warm on a night where the temperatures go below 40 degrees? It's not fun reading things like the wholde Confederate side melted away at Fredericksburg or, most of the men needed pick up truck rides to get where ever. The boys of 186x, weather they came from the city or the country, ended up in a situation where they spent so much time together; and new each other very very well, you can read inumerable accounts of how they worked together to get through this or that situation. If you know something tht helps, teach it to someone else. Before you attend an event, get in shape, get your health as well as you can and stay until the event is over. YOU owe that to the organizers for all of the hard work they put in to trying to give you an authentic experience. Show up, stay for 36 hours and deal with it, you won't die.

Common sense. At times applying simple common sense to a situation, "There's no historical documentation for ..." is your best bet. If it's comfortable and it makes your life easier in the field, the boys of 186x surely thought of it first.

Sometimes, from the things I read on internet boards it would seem common sense is dead, units NCO's are all dead, or, unit leadership and NCO's are so unapproachable with simple questions from their memebership, unit members have to ask easily answered questions on internet boards. the only folks who can fix that is the afformentioned folks.

There's nothing worse at an event than an NCO or an Officer that doesn't know his job. Enough said.


Retired cat herder, currently residing at the old soldiers home,

[Hank Trent]

Re: Where does THIS END of the hobby need to improve MOST?

I second all of Mr Herring's sentiments. I also fail to see how things like EFUBU do much to promote and grow this end of the hobby. I always felt the primary object of my participation in this hobby should be the education of the public and helping the hobby grow.

Got to say I disagree. I'd hate to see this end of the hobby become the reenacting equivalent of a multi-level marketing scheme, where the goal is not to create real value, but to recruit more members.

If there were no EBUFU events, what would we tell mainstreamers or the public, who asked what they'd get to do if they joined our hobby? If the answer would be, attend events just like this to recruit more reenactors and educate more people like you, then there'd be no more "this end" of the hobby. That would also mean no higher level for the public who wanted more education (which is how I got into reenacting originally).

The public would get the 10-minute sound bite, but if they wanted to spend the money and the time to get the clothes and the knowledge, so they could learn more through living history than they saw at mainstream events, the answer would have to be well, sorry, "we're not for people like you," as a museum docent once told me when I was too interested in the history he was telling about. This end of the hobby should be for people like that, because if we don't do it, who will?

High-quality EBUFU events are what this end of the hobby is all about. If "we" can only get a dozen or so military reenactors to attend what promises to be one of the most educational and logistically challenging EBUFU events in recent memory, "we" don't need to be encouraging "us" to waste effort attending more mainstream events. If we want our end of the hobby to remain, "we" need to fill up the schedule supporting each other first, then support mainstream events in the extra time when nothing else is happening.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com