Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Vivandiere?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Vivandiere?

    Gents:

    Anyone have any input or comment regarding the attendance of vivandiere at an EFUBU or a campaigning event in an historically accurate non-combatant role?

    Thanks for any response.....

    CPL Rich Libicer
    1st NM Vols
    "Kit Carson's Own"
    Rich Libicer
    Fugi's Brown Water Mess

    6th North Carolina - 150th First Manassas, July 2011
    4th Texas Dismounted, Co. C - 150th Valverde, February 2012
    6th Mississippi Adjunct - 150th Shiloh, April 2012
    4th Texas Dismounted, Co. C - 150th Glorieta Pass, May 2012
    21st Arkansas Adjunct - 150th Prairie Grove, December 2012
    5th Confederate, Co. C - 150th Chickamauga, September 2013
    Haitus...... Until Now


  • #2
    Re: Vivandiere?

    Hallo!

    Vivandiere and cantiniere type posts are usually lightning rods for problematic posts.

    IF the impression matches the unit, time, place, and circumstance(s) of an actual vivandiere or cantiniere present at the scenario that the EBUFU is depicting, it should not be an issue.

    Curt
    Moderator Mess
    Curt Schmidt
    In gleichem Schritt und Tritt, Curt Schmidt

    -Hard and sharp as flint...secret, and self-contained, and solitary as an oyster.
    -Haplogroup R1b M343 (Subclade R1b1a2 M269)
    -Pointless Folksy Wisdom Mess, Oblio Lodge #1
    -Vastly Ignorant
    -Often incorrect, technically, historically, factually.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Vivandiere?

      I'll echo Curt and add that I've done some research on my own into this subject and find that vivandieres were never part of the official army establishment, that some volunteer units that started with vivandiers soon sent them home (the 39th NY, "Garibaldi Guards" being a great example), and that many tales of the exploits of vivandiers on the field are clearly apocryphal (e.g., Annie Etheridge at 2nd Bull Run), or conflate "vivandiere" with laundress or nurse. I'm pretty sure that no one participating on this forum has a problem with any impression that can actually be documented, but so far no one has stepped up to the plate to argue for vivandieres, anytime or anywhere.
      Michael A. Schaffner

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Vivandiere?

        Seems pretty simple. If one was at the historic time and place being depicted and was part of the specific situation being recreated, one should be there. If not, then not. Which is what Curt said. That about sums it up.

        Hank Trent
        hanktrent@gmail.com
        Hank Trent

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Vivandiere?

          The previous comments by Curt, Mike and Hank pretty much sum up my view on the subject. When you look deep down inside, if you're really trying to justify an impression in order to be inclusive rather than to improve and add historical dimension to a given event, then maybe it better be left alone.

          Paul McKee
          Paul McKee

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Vivandiere?

            I'll go one step further: the person portraying the viv needs to be *extremely* accurate in material culture, knowledge, and bearing, too... on top of the documenting to military unit, time, and location.
            Regards,
            Elizabeth Clark

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Vivandiere?

              Thanks to everyone for their great responses.....Good information. I am looking for an accurate historical portrayal, not just a viv for a viv's sake. So, plenty to think about and research!

              Rich Libicer
              Rich Libicer
              Fugi's Brown Water Mess

              6th North Carolina - 150th First Manassas, July 2011
              4th Texas Dismounted, Co. C - 150th Valverde, February 2012
              6th Mississippi Adjunct - 150th Shiloh, April 2012
              4th Texas Dismounted, Co. C - 150th Glorieta Pass, May 2012
              21st Arkansas Adjunct - 150th Prairie Grove, December 2012
              5th Confederate, Co. C - 150th Chickamauga, September 2013
              Haitus...... Until Now

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Vivandiere?

                I came across a mention of a viv in the "Gone for a Soldier: The Civil War Memoirs of Private Alfred Bellard"
                Pvt. Bellard served in the 5th New Jersey Infantry from 1861 until his discharge in August 1864. After being wounded at Chancellorsville, he mentions a viv in the field hospital-

                One of the men died at this hospital who had been shot through the breast and was held by a vivandiere of one of the regts. in her lap, until he was dead.
                pg. 219

                There is also an original drawing done in color by Pvt. Bellard in the book I have of the viv. She's wearing what seems like a blue frock coat, red trousers with a yellow stripe down the side, some sort of slouch hat with a huge big feather in it, and her hair is cut short like a man's. If I can find some way to scan my book, I'll post the image here.
                Kenny Pavia
                24th Missouri Infantry

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Vivandiere?

                  Thanks Kenny. I'd be interested in seeing that image.

                  Rich Libicer
                  1st NMVI
                  "Kit Carson's Own"
                  Rich Libicer
                  Fugi's Brown Water Mess

                  6th North Carolina - 150th First Manassas, July 2011
                  4th Texas Dismounted, Co. C - 150th Valverde, February 2012
                  6th Mississippi Adjunct - 150th Shiloh, April 2012
                  4th Texas Dismounted, Co. C - 150th Glorieta Pass, May 2012
                  21st Arkansas Adjunct - 150th Prairie Grove, December 2012
                  5th Confederate, Co. C - 150th Chickamauga, September 2013
                  Haitus...... Until Now

                  Comment

                  Working...
                  X