What happened after...

[Elaine Kessinger]

On another forum, the question was posed... were there instances of soldiers retaining their uniforms and re-purpose-ing them for civilian use once their time in service was done?

Well... how did they handle the clothing issue of returning thousands of soldiers (sailors) into civilian life?

It was noted that it was so common for Southern men to wear their uniform home that mandates to cover military buttons had to be issued.

I know the official rules say that the uniforms of enlisted men (in the Federal army/navy) are property of the Government, and therefore not the soldier's (sailor's) to take home... but how was that *really* handled when they were discharged and disbanded? Many seemed to have packed away uniforms in trunks at home, that later were donated to museums, collections, get sold on ebay, & etc.

I was curious.. that can get dangerous. :p

[Dan Wambaugh]

Re: What happened after...

Elaine,

If I recall correctly, uniforms were drawn against an annual allowance as part of a soldier's pay, so it would have been considered the soldier's property as he had drawn it against his uniform allowance for the year. So a discharging soldier would likely retain all his present equipment, and if he had not drawn his full compliment of clothing and equipment up to the point of his discharge, he would even be refunded the portion of his allowance still owed to him pro rated to that day, or if he had overdrawn his account the balance would have been deducted from his final pay out.

Ordnance department property (weapons and leather accouterments) would have been a different story. These were 100% property of the government. (In fact, one of the jobs of the provost marshal after a battle was to collect firearms from the battlefield, and arrest any civilians spotted collecting weapons, as these were 100% government property.) Most soldiers were given the option of purchasing their service weapon at the end of the war, sometimes for a fraction of what the government had paid for the item. After all, the US government was about to find itself with millions of surplus firearms and cannons (not to mention those captured from the surrendering Confederates), so it was to their benefit to sell off as many as they could to the veterans.

I hope this clears things up a bit.

[tenfed1861]

Re: What happened after...

There are a number of photos taken after the war showing men wearing their old uniforms.I believe it was a common site at the early days of GAR for men to wear thier old uniforms.At the 50th anniversery of Gettysburg,there are photos showing the men wearing their unforms.One photo shows an old Union vet with a knapsack,canteen,and haversack.Were those his items,probably.It seems that alot of soldiers would save thier uniforms to wear at reviews,reunions,and maybe just to bring out for the kids to play in.It would be very miuch like today when someone gets out of the service.Save the jacket to wear when it's cool.Keep wearing the brogans,shirts,drawers,hats until they are worn out...

[Elaine Kessinger]

Re: What happened after...

@ Mr. W.- May I quote your posting on the Sewing Academy forum where the question was originally asked, please? And, yes thanks, it's much more clear to me now. :-)

@Mr. S.- photos of the gents having the uniforms available at reunions was what led me to believe I was not quite understanding "the rules" correctly. :-p

[BarryDusel]

Re: What happened after...

Off the issue of uniforms. My Great Great Grandfather purchased his saddle and tack, his Carbine, and horse when he mustered out in 1865.

[David Fox]

Re: What happened after...

A chief reason enlisted Civil War field uniforms of either side are more relatively scarce than officers' is because so many of the EMs simply wore what they were last issued home and then wore it out plowing, etc. Vast stocks of obsolete and obsolescent clothing is always being sold-off by the government or put to other governmental uses: think of American Indians wearing M1858 Hardee hats in the 1880s and WW I German prisoners tricked-out in blue Union 4-button blouses with a large "PW" painted on the back. When I was a kid I wore out a WW II leather A2 aviator's jacket, now worth hundreds. Vietnam era field uniform bits were common poor man's attire for years after that war. It has all but disappeared. Just bought a book on Vietnam "collectables", forsooth. The stuff in my duffle bag in the basement is now valuable, God help us! The Spanish-American War campaign hat covered the heads of miners and loggers for decades after 1898. I have photos of my grandfather hunting and fishing in the 1920s looking like a 1918 Doughboy, down to the puttees. Throughout the '80s and '90s common hunting attire here in the N.C. mountains was Cold War camo. Such green camo is now growing relatively scarce on the street. Look about you: now men, and sometimes women, parade into my courtroom daily wearing the various generations of more current desert camo. The evolving cloth military history of field uniforms in this country has ever been observable (and worn out) on the streets of this country. Somewhere tucked into Federal law is a provision making the wearing of such illegal, but it's a law forever observed in the breach.

[Doughboy]

Re: What happened after...

This has been pointed out before but I bring it up as it is somewhat pertinent to this thread:

"Even when integrated into fairly progressive camps, black soldiers were often treated badly and sometimes went for long periods without proper clothing. There were also reports of blacks receiving old Civil War uniforms and being forced to sleep outside in pitched tents instead of warmer, sturdier barracks. Some were forced to eat outside in the winter months, while others went without a change of clothes for months at a time. Not all black soldiers suffered treatment like this, however, as those who were lucky enough to train at newly erected National Army cantonments lived in comfortable barracks and had sanitary latrines, hot food, and plenty of clothes. "

Fighting for Respect: African-American Soldiers in WWI
by Jami Bryan, Managing Editor, On Point
Article originally appeared in On Point, an Army Historical Foundation publication

[Dan Wambaugh]

Re: What happened after...

Elaine,

Certainly, I would have no problem with you re-posting my comments. Thank you for asking!

[Union Navy]

Re: What happened after...

The navy uniforms given to enlisted when they joined were supplied by the navy. All other uniforms were either purchased by the sailor or (usually) made by sailors themselves from cloth they pruchased. Sailors accoasionally wore their uniform after mustering out. I remember reading a story of a fellow who wore his frock after leaving the service (not usual civilian attire at all). The war was not over, and he was asked about the deisrability of joining the navy. He discouraged the asker in the strongest terms and rode on. But the questioner noticed that the former sailor was still proudly wearing his uniform.

All arms and accoutrements were the property of the navy and the ship. They were returned to storage or handed off to the next watch at the end of the sailor's watch.

[jarednichols]

Re: What happened after...

One of my favorite quotes comes from John Sergeant Wise (1846-1913) author of "End of an Era", a Cadet of Virginia Military Institute who fought at the Battle of New Market, and after the war a law student at the University of Virginia and a member of Beta Theta Pi fraternity. He remembered at the end of the war he had nothing left but his “tattered Confederate uniform and a good constitution.” “October found me a student at the University of Virginia. The old place more resembled a camp than a college. Conversations and thoughts partook still of a decidedly military flavor." (from The Beta Theta Pi Magazine) Wise might have been overstating his state of dress because in "End of an Era" he states that after leaving the AoT he returned home and the only clothes left for him were "boys clothing" which he tried on but found himself decidely uncomfortable in. From my own observation many military veterans have this same problem when they return homebecause taking off the uniform can be a hard thing to do and why so many combat vets wear bits and pieces of their uniforms even years after service.

[Becky Morgan]

Re: What happened after...

This might be a tad obvious too, but remember that the CW vets had been gone four years. With hand-me-downs a fact of life in most households except for the wealthiest, if there were other boys at home growing into the clothing he'd left behind, it was no doubt worn, and worn out, long before he got back. There's also the thought that a man who enlisted at 17 or 18 may not have been done growing when he left, and what he left behind wasn't apt to be long enough in sleeves and legs. Finally, especially in the South, the odds that home had been pillaged or destroyed made hanging onto the uniform clothes a good idea.

[mtvernon]

Re: What happened after...

I don't know how my great-great-grandfather felt about his uniform, but family accounts place it in the cellar of his son's home in Nebraska. My grandfather remembered it being there and thoroughly ravaged by time and moths. Although he retained it, I've always wondered how he and the family regarded it. Was it, for a time, regarded with pride? Was it just a usable garment for certain functions? I'd love to know. More than that, I'd love to have it.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: What happened after...

Hallo!

Moderator hat on...

We have drifted past AC Forum standards here several times. Espcially for the "Authentcity" folder. "Anecdotal" and Post War references, while maybe a "tradition" or "antecedent" of what actually happened during the War, is not necessarily what did happen.

For example, my grandmother may had taken turpentine drops on a cracker as a cure for worms, because her mother learned it from her mother who was alive during the Civil War...

Please keep things researched and documented to the "War."

Thanks...

Curt

[GreencoatCross]

Re: What happened after...

While I cannot prove it, I have been thinking that the man in the attached photo could be wearing a second-hand military garment. I purchased this on eBay last year thinking he could be a U.S. Sharpshooter but I have not found any enlisted men on the rolls who were close to the age this man appears to be. The back mark is Philadelphia, PA so he could really be anyone. Some interesting things I noticed about the coat:

- The visible edge of the skirt is rounded
- The button side body/skirt seam is separating.
- Civilian pattern rubber buttons on the body, eagle rubber buttons on the cuffs.
- Some of the buttonhole stitching is frayed or missing.
- Collar trim has been removed.
- Cuff trim is frayed and looks "picked at."

Again, I don't know if this is a soldier or a civilian but it's been suggested by some that he was a teamster or served in some other support role due to his age and deteriorated appearance of his coat. Another collector intimated that it's likely late war or slightly post-war due to the type of fringe on the chair but I can't confirm this either. No idea! :confused_

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: What happened after...

While I cannot prove it, I have been thinking that the man in the attached photo could be wearing a second-hand military garment. I purchased this on eBay last year thinking he could be a U.S. Sharpshooter but I have not found any enlisted men on the rolls who were close to the age this man appears to be. The back mark is Philadelphia, PA so he could really be anyone. Some interesting things I noticed about the coat:

- The visible edge of the skirt is rounded
- The button side body/skirt seam is separating.
- Civilian pattern rubber buttons on the body, eagle rubber buttons on the cuffs.
- Some of the buttonhole stitching is frayed or missing.
- Collar trim has been removed.
- Cuff trim is frayed and looks "picked at."

Again, I don't know if this is a soldier or a civilian but it's been suggested by some that he was a teamster or served in some other support role due to his age and deteriorated appearance of his coat. Another collector intimated that it's likely late war or slightly post-war due to the type of fringe on the chair but I can't confirm this either. No idea! :confused_

Brian

Great photo! I think the bottom of the skirt is not rounded, but rather it is curled making it look that way.