Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

[LibertyHallVols]

What would you consider to be the max dimensions for a credible reproduction of a Hardee hat?

Crown Height = ?
Brim Width = ?

Thanks,

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

Hallo!

General Orders No. 3 dated March 24, 1858 specified a brim width of 3 1/4 inches, height of crown 6 1/4 inches.

I don't seem to have the specs for the "1861."

That being said...

Here are the dimensions of four originals:

1. Brim: 3", height 5 3/4"
2. Brim: 3", height 5 5/8"
3. Brim: 3", height 5 3/4"
4. Brim: 3 1/8", height 5 7/8"

(I have puzzled as to whether the dimensions varied per size of the hat. I believe yes.)

Curt

[adamandnicole]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

John,
Not sure if you are questioning the dimensions of any specific maker's reproduction, but I can say that I had this same question after purchasing a Dress Hat from one of the popular vendors. The brim on mine was at least 4". I carefully cut it down to 3 1/4" and had the edge binding re-stitched. It just didn't look right at 4" so I went with the prescribed measurements and it looks much better.

Adam Dickerson

[roundshot]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

http://www.33wis.com/articles/pdf/Hardee%20Hat.pdf

Good information and dimensions on some actual (and repro) hats in this article.

[thad gallagher]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

Would it be possible for the wool felt to have dried out or shrunk over the years? Could account for some of the 1/8" variances?

[ScottCross]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

The originals are fur felt, not wool felt, although many cheap reproductions are wool. Here's a more recent article that was originally published about 2001. I've forgotten what magazine is was published in.

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-8196.html

[CompanyWag]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

DB now advertises his dress hats can be had in either nutria or beaver. Although these would be types of fur felt, neither of these were specified for use in original dress hats and the nutria was not introduced into North America until the 20th Century. The original specification was for rabbit fur (a mix of 8 parts Russia Hare and 1 part Scotch Coney). There may have been other substitutions by wartime contractors, but I am not immediately aware of them.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

Thanks for the help, folks!

Looking at the 1858 regs, it would appear that 3.25x6.25 (brim x crown height) is the specification. Anyone seen an original hat to that spec?

Most originals surveyed in articles appear to be 3" x 5 1/2" to 5 7/8".

I have seen a number listed on auction sites listed with 3" brims, but no listing of crown height. Also, those measurements were for an auction description, not making a survey of dimensions. So, who knows how precise they were trying to be.

Thanks!

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Hardee Hats: Max Dimensions?

Hallo!

I see that the "server is busy try again later" has eaten my reply.

Let's see...

With clothing, and kit, one does find measurements that are off the "manual specs." We NUG attribute that to inspectors not rejecting sme minor deviations when goods were need just because a spec was slightly amiss. I suspect the same was true for hats.

I also hold the theory that like clothing, hats were subject to measurement variations based upon the size of the hat. But I do not have data or access to enough original hats to take measurements to prove or disprove the hypothesis.

Also does any 0ne has saved/referenced an old article or ancient posting about dress hats that talks about the differences between the so-called "M1858" and the "M1861" dress hat? (I lost mine in the dead hard drive disaster...)
When we look at originals there seems to be two types- one with sorter crown and more tapered sides, and one with a taller crown and more straighter sides. I have seen this referred to as the basis for what is a "M1858" and what is "M1861" dress hat.
But, I am thinking, or misremembering on this one, that that may be, have been a modern vendorism or reenactorism- and the old article or post may shed some light on that.

???

Thanks.

Curt