oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

[Bones]

Pards- i have made 2 CS painted cloth groundsheets ,coated with the usual latex / turnentine/linseed oil mix-2 coats on the black side and a coat of linseed oil and Japan dryer on the white side.
Problem is they still absorb water,so ,without going into the period formulas (toxic at best, dangerous at least) has anyone had experience using oil based paint on cloth goods? If so , how did it turn out?And does it shed water, or at least not absorb it ?whatever paint I use I will finish it with another coat of turpentine/linseed oil and Japan dryer. i know this has been covered before as to the formula but my question is regarding oil based paints.


thanks
Doug Jarrett
Bones
Armory Guards

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

Mr. Jarrett,

You've stumbled on to the worst of both worlds here somehow. The "hazards" that most folks refer to come from the linseed oil (not to mention the additional VOC's and flammability from the Japan drier). Latex is not historically accurate. You've got both!

Part of your problem might be that you're working with oil-based paint (that's the linseed) AND water based paint (latex).

Others may have different information, but I've never heard of a groundcloth painted on two sides, each with a different paint recipe. I've only heard of them being painted on one side.

Hopefully, we can get some folks to give us some good links to other threads from the past... this topic has been discussed, hashed, rehashed, and hotly-debated frequently in the past. So, there's good data to be found, if someone can dig it up (big "nudge" to our readers here!).

Best of luck to you.

[Tyler Underwood]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

Doug, go to the "How To" section www.governorguards.com there is instructions for making a period paint using linseed oil. I have used this recipe on many occasions and have never had a problem. You only need to apply the paint to one side. To prevent it from bleeding through you need to make a thin paste with corn starch and water. Brush this onto the fabric, let dry and apply period paint.

[Clsinclair]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

Mr. Jarrett,

Regardless of the pigment you use (Oil or latex) you coat the paint with the linseed oil. I have made hundreds of these and I only use the turpentine to cut the pigment/paint and I add a tad of Japan dryer to speed the drying time. I use two thin coats after I use cornstarch to size the material. After the two coats have dried then I add a tad (couple of tablespoons) of Japan Dryer to the linseed oil. I am now growing an extra toe from hand rubbing the linseed oil in the material. If I use 8 oz drill or canvas then I cut the material to match the width of the material for that time period and then I sew them back together again. Some people use muslin or sheeting but I have not had much success with that. A 4' X 6' or 71" X 46" Federal should weigh around 2 pounds and should be fully waterproof. You only prepare one side. Also put two grommets about 1/4" from one edge about 22.5" from each end. This is to tie off as a shawl and it will keep you dry in the rain and will give you more range of motion for your arms. Good luck and have fun. You can PM me for a link of my website to get a copy of the original quartermaster ordering specifications for the Painted Federal Oil Blanket. It is also the one featured in Echos of Glory on Federal equipment. The Watchdog also had a good article during 2002 on oil blankets.

[Silas]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

I'd listen to what Claude says. I field tested one of his blankets during the Friday monsoon at Vicksburg last week. I was quite dry on the inside. Frankly, if you don't own one of his blankets, they you're all wet.

[arkangel33]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

I use the way that Claude describes for my haversacks and knapsacks. I don't know how Claude does it, with his price at $55, but if you can afford the $55 plus shipping you cant go wrong with a Sinclair blanket. I own four of them and they are made how I have made them for myself in the past. Top Shelf!
Mike Brase

[JustRob]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

Claude,

Would you be willing to post your recipe?

I have a knapsack that needs repainting, and your stuff would be just the trick.

Thanks,

[GrumpyDave]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

http://www.cwreenactors.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-17533.html

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt
02-10-2010, 03:39 PM
Hallo!

"Oilcloth and Painted Accouterments
by Jack Cox

“Painting” was a 1800’s method of waterproofing cloth for such items as knapsacks, haversacks, belts, cartridge boxes and ground cloths. Properly done, the fabric does become very waterproof, but retains its flexibility.
There are many different recipes for both "period accurate" oilcloth and for a modern version that looks the same, but without some of the problems of the 1850's recipe. The paint is generally applied over cotton drill or linen canvas.
The instructions below discuss the making of ground cloths, but the same procedure applies to all painted goods.

Modern Recipe:
While this recipe is obviously not authentic, it produces the same look and feel as the original methods. The final product looks, feels and wears as close to the original as most of us can approximate today. However, you need to make a decision as to whether you want to "fake it" with a modern approximation when a good period recipe is available.
Materials: Wallpaper sizing. Get it pre-mixed and ready to use. Flat black or semi-gloss interior latex paint *** Boiled linseed oil Mineral spirits paint thinner Japan dryer
(All of these materials are available at any good paint store)
Method:
1. Using a roller, paint both sides of the cloth with the wallpaper sizing and let it dry. It should take an hour or less. The sizing will prevent the paint from soaking the cloth, and it will give it some "tooth" for paint adhesion.
2. Using a roller, paint one side of the cloth with the black latex paint. Let it dry overnight.
3. Mix 2 parts of mineral spirits with 1 part boiled linseed oil. Add Japan dryer. Use 1 oz. (2 tablespoons) per pint of paint.
4. With a brush, paint the sized side of the cloth with the linseed oil mix. Let it dry. This may take several days, depending on temperature and humidity. It's NOT wise to let it dry in the house.
5. Paint on two additional coats of the linseed oil mix. Let it dry between coats.
*** There is a variation of this recipe that works very well also. Instead of using plain latex paint, mix 2 parts of latex paint with one part of boiled linseed oil. Stir it thoroughly, then follow the instructions above.


Period Recipe:
This recipe is an approximation, since the original recipe specified "litharge," or lead monoxide (PbO) which is extremely poisonous.
Bright Idea: Leave out the lampblack, and you have a recipe for a nice civilian waterproof cloth.
I strongly recommend this recipe because it is about as authentic as you can get without putting life and limb in danger.
Materials: Boiled linseed oil Mineral spirits paint thinner (or turpentine) Lampblack (comes in tubes or dry powder) Japan dryer Corn starch
Method:
1. Make a sizing by boiling about a quart of water and adding cornstarch mixed in cold water until the mixture becomes a little syrupy.
2. Paint the cloth with the cornstarch sizing and let dry.
3. Mix one part of boiled linseed oil with one part of mineral spirits. Add lamp black until the paint is a very opaque black. Add one oz. (2 tbsp) of Japan dryer per pint.
4. With a brush, paint the cloth with the blackened linseed oil and let dry. This can take several days.
5. Mix one part of boiled linseed oil with two parts of mineral spirits. Add one oz. of Japan dryer per pint.
6. With a brush, paint the cloth with the clear linseed oil mixture and let it dry. This can also take several days. Two coats of this mixture should give the results you want.
(You can omit the cornstarch sizing if you want, but the oil-based paint will pretty much soak the cloth.)

Confederate Ordnance Manual Recipe:
There is a recipe from the 1863 Confederate Ordinance manual which I have not tried. Use at your own risk.
Materials: 28 Parts lampblack 1 Part Japan varnish 73 Parts boiled Linseed oil 1 Part spirits of turpentine 1 Part litharge (substitute Japan Dryer for this.
Litharge is lead monoxide, and is very poisonous.)
Method:
1. Mix the ingredients, using 1 oz. (2 tbsp) of Japan dryer per quart of paint.
2. If you don't want the paint to totally soak the cloth, size it with cornstarch as in the period recipe above.
3. Apply 2-3 coats until the desired sheen is obtained.
Turpentine-base Recipe
This recipe comes from "Young's Demonstrative Translation of Scientific Secrets - 1861." This recipe will sound familiar in materials and proportion, but uses turpentine instead of mineral spirits for a thinner. Hazard Warning: The recipe uses litharge*** (poison hazard) and the mixture is boiled (fire hazard).

I DO NOT RECOMMEND OR ENDORSE USING THIS RECIPE.
Materials: 1 pint of spirits of turpentine 1 to 1 1/2 pints of linseed oil 1 lb litharge
Method:
1. Combine all materials in a large metal bucket. Litharge reacts strongly to aluminum and zinc. Do not use an aluminum or zinc coated vessel.
2. Boil and stir until thoroughly mixed and dissolved.
3. Paint on the cloth.
4. Let dry in the sun.
This recipe will give a clear to reddish or yellowish color, depending upon the base color of the litharge. The first coats could be tinted with lamp black to make a glossy painted oilcloth.
*** Safety data (MSDS) for litharge."

CHS

[Silas]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

I have been hosting Jack's article on my links page for many years. I also host his article about making your own shelter half.

[fallstoomuch]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

Is the center seam a "French" seam like on shelter halves and is it and the edges sewn before painting?

[Clsinclair]

Re: oil based or latex paint for groundcloths?

There are several ways to sew the seam. You will find several types in the Shelter Half Tent Book by Fred G. I fold over a half inch on each part and interlock them. I use the same seam on the shelter halves I make. I would rather sew before painting but I have painted before sewing. For customer satisfaction I would rather sew and then paint as that will seal all the seams. If I do paint before sewing then I put a thin coat on the blanket to seal the seams. Personally I just would not want a painted oil blanket if it leaked at the center seam. I use a treadle sewing machine as it makes the correct chain lock hem but then again most of your modern machines will do a a correct chain lock but I have not found a modern wally word sewing machine that can do the heavy thread and fabric. If one machine breaks down then I have four others with working heads.