Canvas/camp shoes

[Emmanuel Dabney]

I have been curious, just keep forgetting to post about this...

How popular were these "camp shoes" that we see so many people wearing?
Who wore them? Were they invented just before the war? Why? Where? When?

I don't do shoe research per se, but I've never seen any images of regular civilian men wearing these in the antebellum or wartime era.

Thanks for whomever may answer. :-)

[markj]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Hi,

I can tell you one thing: Significant quantities of "cloth shoes" were issued to both Western and Eastern Theater Confederate troops at least as early as Summer 1863. I have previously posted a September 1863 deserter notice, issued by the commander of the 42nd VA in the Richmond "Enquirer," providing descriptions of his men when last seen--at least three of them are stated as having been wearing "cloth shoes." Also, while perusing company clothing issue books for units in J. C. Brown's Tennessee Brigade (Army of Tennessee) at the National Archives last week, I discovered that several men were also listed as having received "cloth shoes" in the July/August 1863 timeframe.

As I recall, there are one or more images of Confederate dead at Gettysburg that, when enlarged, clearly show the corpses still wearing "cloth" or "camp" shoes. This was discussed in a different thread a few months ago.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Emmanuel

You may want to run a search on this topic. It has been covered several times. Keep in mind there were private purchase "camp/sport shoes" and ersatz CS cloth shoes.

[markj]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Hi,

Try this thread:

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/showthread.php?t=326&highlight=cloth+shoes

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[hardtack1864]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

We know rebs wore these types of shoes, but what about federal soldiers? And I did not see that covered much on that other thread

[theknapsack]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Heres a picture of some soldiers that are wearing them. I don't know if it will answer you question completely though.
I find they are fairly common more or less with Confederates.

[Emmanuel Dabney]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

My original intent here was to see if there were any civilian references to these shoes. So far, I've searched forums and found none. And yalls postings have delivered only military references.

I should state, I don't want any (I personally think they're about as ugly as modern track and field shoes), but seeing if there were any references.

[tmattimore]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Riley
The photo you show is one of a series of photos taken in aug or sept of 1862. There is an excellent article in the summer 1986 JCOMH. By Richard K. Tibbals. They are of Btty B 1st ILL taken in Memphis. Apparently the whole Battery had their photos taken in a set of 29 . Tibbals analysis shows that out of the 147 men the following footwear is to be seen .
Boots 54
Bootees 4
"civilian sport shoes" 7
"civilian leather shoes" 1
unidentified 81
The Battery had just come from a year of campaigning participating in Belmont,Ft Doneleson, Shiloh and Corinth. They are all in new uniforms probably just off the boat. Mr Tibbals is the earliest reference I have found to these as civilian sport shoes. Thay are identical to the shoe in the MOC and Mr. Troiani's shoe in the EOG. Examination of photo's of the dead show the same pattern. My theory is that this may have been a civilian pattern but it is also the standard C.S. pattern of canvas shoes which may be captured goods. They certianly were not federal issue. I find it interesting that the same pattern shows up in Memphis in 62, Gettysburg in 63 and Richmond in 65. I have payroll records from 5 March 1863 Rhichmond depot showing 1824 pr cloth shoes under construction

[Fahlem]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Gentlemen,

A former AC posting by my good friend Brian White could also shed a bit of light on the question of whether it was common for federal troops to wear this particular shoe. He posted a photo of a grouping of men from Company F 2nd Reg. USSS just before going on guard mount. I am not looking at the photo currently, so memory must serve me. But I believe that out of the eight or so men pictured, two are certainly wearing the "canvas camp" shoe and a possible third also.
Any search under USSS or sharpshooter should bring you to the thread. I would post a direct link, but am new to the site and not real good with computer stuff yet. The quality of the photo is not as good as some copies I have seen and I feel the only good way to study a photo is a copy in hand and a good lens in the other, but his post will do. I'm sure after a good look at their feet and you can easily pick out who is and who isn't wearing the shoe in question. In my humble opinion, these (ones worn by Co. F) shoes were likely private purchase shoes from sutlers. So, at least for SS units, evidence does exist to have this shoe represented in their impression and I am sure, as threads mount, this will hold true for many federal units. As far as a history of the shoe, I can't even begin to touch that.

Michael Fahle
Co. F 2nd USSS

[Fahlem]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Gentlemen,

The above mentioned thread can be found through user name Greencoatcross and the thread, "From my files" Still haven't discoved how to post that direct link! :cry_smile

Michael Fahle
Co. F 2nd USSS

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

My original intent here was to see if there were any civilian references to these shoes. So far, I've searched forums and found none. And yalls postings have delivered only military references.

I should state, I don't want any (I personally think they're about as ugly as modern track and field shoes), but seeing if there were any references.

Maybe you should ask the mods to move this thread to civillian discussion area.

[SparksBird]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Emmanuel,
I know what you are saying, I have not really seen a lot, if any, pictures of civilians wearing canvas shoes. I would be interested to know as well how common they were for civilian usage. Interesting enough, there is a photo taken of the New York Knickerbockers base ball team, and in the picture they appear to be wearing simple leather shoes. On the other hand, one interesting point is that they are also wearing ice creepers fastened on to their shoes to give them some grip.However, in the picture below, which is slightly post war 1868, the Cincinnati Red Stockings are wearing them. But, I would be curious as well as to how common they were for civilian use.


Rick Musselman
Buckeye Mess
GHTI

[Tom Craig]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

My original intent here was to see if there were any civilian references to these shoes. So far, I've searched forums and found none. And yalls postings have delivered only military references.

I should state, I don't want any (I personally think they're about as ugly as modern track and field shoes), but seeing if there were any references.

Emmanuel,

It seems safe to draw a conclusion here. If canvas shoes were so common in the military then it stands to reason that they must have been widely available in civil life. Granted there needs to be more research done to draw any true conclusions, but it seems they were pretty common.

Take care,
Tom Craig

[paulcalloway]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Emmanuel -
This thread may be of interest to you: http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/...4931#post14931

We've posted some photos of some CS Canvas Shoes with a hinged wooden sole.

[Fishermans wife]

Re: Canvas/camp shoes

Thanks Paul for th e post.

Emmanuel,

I wear these 'ugly' shoes for my rural civilian impression. This is my documentation and reasoning. A reference i s made in the book " A BLOCKADED FAMILY IN SOUTHREN ALABAMA" to them having cloth shoes simular to modern Baseball shoes. The book was writtten shortly post war. SO I looked at the publishing date then researched in the history of baseball. Well,What do you know? There they are.......... camp shoes.

I , like you ,have seen very few images of civilians wearing this type of shoe outside of the baseball images. ( thanks Rick for posting that). BUt it stands to reason that if you are improvished enough to resort to wearing cloth shoes that you were most likely not going to have the resources to have an images struck. ALso in the book she was rather embarassed about having cloth shoes. SO it stands to reason that they would not be photgraphed wearing this item. ( ie. children's apron's).

I am still looking everyday for any references. But this is where I am at now.

Lisa Pace

PS Don't you call my shoes ugly anymore.