Any idea what this is?

[Redemption]

This thing looks smelly to me. Its being advertised as an 1800's musket but there are several things that make me feel sketchy about its authenticity (though I almost know nothing about late percussion models, maybe someone can tell me what it is and what its worth?

[HoosierSince1829]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Chris,

I make no claims to be an expert, but I have been collecting 19th century rifles for long enough to know just enough to be dangerous.

Without more photos I cannot give any reliable guidance on what it is or how much it is worth, but here are a few questions and further thoughts:

1) What is the length of the barrel? That is not a perfect indicator, but in general, the longer barrels were on older rifles.
2) Is the rifle percussion or flintlock? Guns in percussion are worth considerably less than guns with flintlock actions, all other things being equal.
2) Is the rifle signed on the barrel near the breach? All things being equal, a signed rifle will always be worth more than an unsigned rifle
3) Does it have a metal patch box on the stock, any carving, or metal inlay work? Rifles with any of these features will be worth more than those without, all other things being equal.
4) Is there any documented history on the rifle and who owned it in the past? A rifle with a compelling and documented history behind it can have considerable value, even if the rifle itself is fairly plain.

Without a lot more detailed photos and information, it is impossible to give an accurate idea of what you have and what it is worth. However, from the one photo you have sent, it looks like you have what very well may be a rifle made in the 1800s. However, it looks to be a former full stock rifle that was cut down to a half-stock at some point in its life. If this is a percussion rifle that has no documented history, is not signed, and has no patch box, carving, or inlay work, I would guess its fair value at something around $500 +/-.

Thanks,

Matt

[Michael Comer]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Lots of smoothbores were made into shotguns and are fairly common. It could be something along those lines. I agree with Matthew that at first look, it appears to be something that was once full stock that has been screwed up. Sort of like in the 20th century with lots of Mausers being 'sporterized' after the war.

[roundshot]

Re: Any idea what this is?

That's just an old run of the mill 19th century fowling piece. Very light weight and not uncommon. I used to have one nearly identical. Nothing military about it except perhaps through incidental association.

[bhutton]

Re: Any idea what this is?

I agree, run of the mill 19th century fowler, I have one identical to it, wood ramrod etc. check out any makers marks or stamps it may have. The one I have was of English manufacture.

[Redemption]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Here are a couple of other pictures. Its looks a lot to me like an older run of the Lyman Great plains muskets. It was def a flint lock at some point that later became percussion. If its not an old Lyman then it bears a striking resemblance to a great plains style musket from the 1700's Not saying it is just that it looks a lot like one.


I dont think this one is a cut down. I think it is a half stock that missing the final band. The musket is over an hours drive from me and the seller is a 72 year old woman who is selling for her son who used to be a reinactor.


Lyman Great plains reproduction (based off the Hawkins)

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Hallo!

"Lyman Great plains muskets."

"... a great plains style musket from the 1700's."

For my own understanding and education, what does that mean exactly?

I do not have it in my hands, and the photos are too vague on my small monitor to get a good "looksee." Appears to be, at first glance, to me...

An 1820's-1830's common commercial type fowler, "sporterized' by having the stock cut down and ramrod pipes/ferrules likely added when it was altered to side-drum style percussion most likely in the late 1840's or 1850's.

Curt

[Redemption]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Lyman is a company ths been around for awhile that makes reproductions they have a rifle they call 'The Great Plains Rifle" that has a very similar lock plate and half stock.

Hallo!

"Lyman Great plains muskets."

"... a great plains style musket from the 1700's."

For my own understanding and education, what does that mean exactly?

I do not have it in my hands, and the photos are too vague on my small monitor to get a good "looksee." Appears to be, at first glance, to me...

An 1820's-1830's common commercial type fowler, "sporterized' by having the stock cut down and ramrod pipes/ferrules likely added when it was altered to side-drum style percussion most likely in the late 1840's or 1850's.

Curt

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Hallo!

Thanks for replying.

I know, I just do not historically see "eye to eye" with you on that score. :)





The Lyman "Great Plains Rifle" is inspired by, but not a copy of, the work of Samuel Hawken in the 1850's. Except for their creating a fantasy gun by putting a flintlock on an 1850's Hawken just to make it a "flintlock."

Curt

[Redemption]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Yes I agree with you. I meant only in the appearance of the lockplate and the half stock. I am very much an amateur where BP is concerned and please do not think I mean to represent myself as anything other than that.

Hallo!

Thanks for replying.

I know, I just do not historically see "eye to eye" with you on that score. :)





The Lyman "Great Plains Rifle" is inspired by, but not a copy of, the work of Samuel Hawken in the 1850's. Except for their creating a fantasy gun by putting a flintlock on an 1850's Hawken just to make it a "flintlock."

Curt

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Any idea what this is?

Hallo!

We are All pretty much "amateurs" and at best "students" when it comes to the Past.

Curt