Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

[Richmond Depot]

I wonder if anyone on this forum besides myself has actually examined this ( ECJ, Kent, Paine & Co.)jacket in person. If so, would you be interested in swapping notes?

[Gallinipper]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

I wonder if anyone on this forum besides myself has actually examined this ( ECJ, Kent, Paine & Co.)jacket in person. If so, would you be interested in swapping notes?

Scott,
I don't want to speak out of turn, but I believe Mr. Tart has seen this jacket. You might give him a "holler". (BTW-- It was nice to meet you guys at Spotsylvania.)

Rich Croxton

[PieBoy96]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

I believe Michael McComas of Confederate Tailor fame has examined it. He posted some broad notes on it on this thread: http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/...ead.php?t=3997

[RyanBWeddle]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

I believe Michael McComas of Confederate Tailor fame has examined it. He posted some broad notes on it on this thread: http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/...ead.php?t=3997

Don't forget Charles R. Childs, who has seen more CS clothing than anyone living.

It seems far too many people overlook the man that really starting things off for so many appropriate CS impressions.........

[Richmond Depot]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

The jacket is a really fascinating piece. It has 2 inside slash pockets and the lining is much different than any that I have ever seen reproduced.In talking to the curator, Robert Hancock, he believes, (as I do) that the coat was originally a much greyer color than what it now is. More than likely it was a vegetable based dye also. The material produced by FHW ( Grey, Green Brown satinette) is a dead ringer for the current shade. However, if one reproduces in that shade then they are reproducing a possibly already faded piece.Interestingly, a thorough examination of the area's hidden from sun light also match the area's exposed to sun light. This could also possibly indicate a vegetable dye where the entire piece has changed color over the years.

I also did a thorough examination of 3 RD coats. One a Type 2 and two Type 3's. They were extremely interesting to study.

[Richmond Depot]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

I remember way back in about 1983-84 or thereabouts, I first heard about Charlie Childs and all of his wonderful fabrics. Actually I heard about it almost every weekend from Dave Jurgella. I believe that the first Reproduction Richmond Depot coats were done by Lynn Bull. This was based on Les Jensen's early research and were made after he did a "talk" for our group ( Co. G, 12th Va. Inf. Richmond Grays ) At that time I was a senior in high school and looked upon Childs and Bull as the legends that they have become today in the community.

[Richmond Depot]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

Hi Rich, was wondering how you were doing.

Paul,I missed Mike's postings on the K,P and C coats. But just finished viewing it and would have to agree with his assertions.

Also, this coat has the funkiest belt loops that I have ever seen. They are of a very narrow tape trim which is now an off white color. I have to speculate on the original color as the rest of the tape trim on the jacket has not changed color. Additionally the Epaulettes are one sided, being that it is only one layer of satinette, with the raw layer visible by turning the epaulette over.

If you get a chance, look us up at the August North -South Trader Relic show here in Richmond.

[Gallinipper]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

Hi Rich, was wondering how you were doing.

Paul,I missed Mike's postings on the K,P and C coats. But just finished viewing it and would have to agree with his assertions.

Also, this coat has the funkiest belt loops that I have ever seen. They are of a very narrow tape trim which is now an off white color. I have to speculate on the original color as the rest of the tape trim on the jacket has not changed color. Additionally the Epaulettes are one sided, being that it is only one layer of satinette, with the raw layer visible by turning the epaulette over.

If you get a chance, look us up at the August North -South Trader Relic show here in Richmond.

Thanks Scott,
And to just add my $.02 cents here... I procured some of that same FHW satinette material you are speaking of last year with the intent of making a RD jacket like the Royal example. This is apparently also made of satinette and is now a similar greenish-brown color (Nephew, I believe Mr. Childs has attributed this tint to chrome being utilized as the mordant. Nasty stuff!). I believe Pat may have replicated the original fabric pretty well, because some of the oddities you described of the original jacket surfaced in construction. I was struck by the very flexible nature of the fabric, which seemed to have less "body" than jeanweave. It was nicely face-finished and different to work with to say the least. Attempts at making traditional epaulettes yielded a very thick looking result, which again might explain some of your observations and differences of the original. I also understand the KP&C jacket is lined in a heavier weight cotton drill, which again would seem to be a logical choice if the original fabric was similarly flexible. I would be interested to know if any other members have had similar experiences with this particular material, and your observations. Thanks.

Rich Croxton

[Richmond Depot]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

It's funny that you mention that drill lining... that was one of the first things that we noticed about it. It would in fact give the satinette more body and as for the button holes it makes them that much more durable and actually easier to work with. Like today's satinette, the stuff of old also looked to be challenging also.

[bAcK88]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

The jacket is a really fascinating piece. It has 2 inside slash pockets and the lining is much different than any that I have ever seen reproduced.In talking to the curator, Robert Hancock, he believes, (as I do) that the coat was originally a much greyer color than what it now is. More than likely it was a vegetable based dye also. The material produced by FHW ( Grey, Green Brown satinette) is a dead ringer for the current shade. However, if one reproduces in that shade then they are reproducing a possibly already faded piece.Interestingly, a thorough examination of the area's hidden from sun light also match the area's exposed to sun light. This could also possibly indicate a vegetable dye where the entire piece has changed color over the years.

Segerant James McHenry Howard described his Kent, Payne Company jacket as "coarse grey, but very durable." Howard served in Company H, 1st Maryland, one of the four Maryland companies formed in Richmond which recieved the uniforms on or about May 20, 1861. While three compaines would serve with the 1st Maryland, Clarkes Company, which Jenkins served, became Company B, 21st Virginia. These were the uniforms that were worn by the companies during the Manassas campaign but by August it is likely that few were still worn as there is a photograph of Pvt. James Thomas, who also served in Company H, wearing a jacket similar to those issued to the Harper Ferry companies by Mrs. Johnson, the wife of Major Bradley Johnson. A great resource for the uniforms worn by both Maryland regiments is the article by Ross M. Kimmel but it is unlikely that you have not read it.

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

I remember way back in about 1983-84 or thereabouts, I first heard about Charlie Childs and all of his wonderful fabrics. Actually I heard about it almost every weekend from Dave Jurgella. I believe that the first Reproduction Richmond Depot coats were done by Lynn Bull. This was based on Les Jensen's early research and were made after he did a "talk" for our group ( Co. G, 12th Va. Inf. Richmond Grays ) At that time I was a senior in high school and looked upon Childs and Bull as the legends that they have become today in the community.

I have an old K.P & Co. jacket by Ray Bass or Mickey Black. ( I could be wrong but I think it is an ancient 2NC or "Blackhats" worn jacket, does this make sense?) If anybody is interested I'll pack it up and send it to you to check out. I have no idea how good it is but any copy I have seen by Bass or Black has been excellent.

Scott,

You are so right. All of my kit is this early '80's stuff by Lynn with Charlie's early kersey and blue jean. Ben Tart's first sumac and logwood cloth and thread too. It is amazing. I think Ben was just out of high school and at the NC State University Textiles School.
They began the uniform trends we strive to follow today.
Ray Bass was the first to explore the popular patterns we now use back in the early '70. Bass is one hell of a shoe maker too.
And don't forget Butch Meyers.

I also have a remarkable charcoal grey McDowell withan Anvil Arms stamp in it. Who was that, Luther Sowers?

There was also I guy that made perfect US caps. Was that Jurgella by any chance?

[Yellowhammer]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

Garrison,

While the items formerly in the collection of Dave Jurgella (most of which now comprise the US Army QM Museum's CW collection) were the basis for many of the authentic patterns still in use, Dave has never been a craftsperson.

The cap-maker that I think you are probably referring to would be Paul Smith from Uriah Cap and Clothier.

Also, any discussion of the early makers of authentic good would be incomplete without a mention of Joe Covias of New Columbia.

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

Also, any discussion of the early makers of authentic good would be incomplete without a mention of Joe of New Columbia.

I am humbled by my failure to give Covias credit. Perhaps the first great maker of authentic Federal and US State issue.

The cap maker's name still remains unknown, he was a ''rank and filer'' who just made McDowell caps for an avocation. He might have been or could be in the old 20th Maine with Bull et al.

[CJSchumacher]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

I am humbled by my failure to give Covias credit. Perhaps the first great maker of authentic Federal and State issue.

The cap maker's name still remains unknown, he was a ''rank and filer'' who just made McDowell caps for an avocation. He might have been or could be in the old 20th Maine with Bull et al.

How about Paul Von Reus?? Another legendary cap maker! I think we have two of his old ones lying around somewhere...

I know for a fact that Paul Smith made a McDowell as does Joel Bohy now.

Von Reus, Paul Smith, and now Joel Bohy produce those truely "museum quality" pieces.

[Michael McComas]

Re: Kent ,Paine and Co. Jacket of E. Courtney Jenkins

Scott,

You're right about the drill giving body to the coat. I tried making a jacket from satinet with an osnaburg lining, and it was like trying to sew melted ice cream. Despite the difficulties, it's still a fun jacket to make.

As for the grey-green/brown material from FHW, a collector recently told me at length that it is a dead ringer for "Charlottesville Gray". Which probably means whoever was making that cloth indeed used chrome in the mordant. I've tried chrome a few times, and I always try to time my project to coincide with "Hazardous Waste Collection Day" at the town dump.

I'd be interested in comparing notes. Did you get to look at Jenkins' trousers while you were there?

Cheers,

Michael