Ben Tart or County Cloth?

[Jim Mayo]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Hi everyone,
I was browsing around today on the web, just looking at different fabrics,mostly by Ben Tart and County Cloth, and it got me to wondering.... which has the edge over the other? Drew Lane

Comparing these two is like comparing apples and oranges. I own products from both dealers. It depends on what you want as to who has the edge.

Ben Tart's jacket material is mostly jean cloth. His website says he provides Cassimere and Satinet but I have never seen any of his uniforms made from anything other than jean cloth. He also does not list these materials for sale on his Fabrics page. IMO his speciality is NC uniforms using naturally dyed jean material which are very good.

County cloth has long been the place for obtaining authentic uniforms back to the days prior to the 125th events. They regularly provide jean cloth as well as cassimere and satinet. Many existing CS uniforms are made from cassimere and satinet and having these materials available is a plus. The availability of the variety of material from County Cloth IMO gives them the edge. If there is a down side it is that all of these materials are not available all the time but that is the way things are in this hobby.

[AZReenactor]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Hi again,
I am not trying to trying to find which maker is the most authentic and i am not trying to buy any fabric right now. I have a jacket made out of County Cloth material and love it. I thought it would be interesting to hear people's personal preferences...just out of curiosity.
Drew

Curiosity is all well and good. Many in that other hobby like nothing more than to delve into it while popping the top on a couple of brewskis in front of their well made, hand forged cast iron fire grates after a day of honoring their forebears with three battles and a ball. Round these parts though the question that really needs to be asked and answered about this type thing isn't what the personal preference of some yahoo who merely managed to make it through the AC account creation process is.

The question if folks prefer apples or oranges more is really irrelevant. What should be asked is which specific type cloth for a particular application most closely matches the model set down 140+ years ago. Preference has little to do with it.

If you just want a bunch of disjointed opinions and not actual facts you might as well ask your questions in Osz since you will surely get a much wider and more interesting set of replies. Granted not as many over there will have heard of Charlie Childs or Ben Tart but if the question is of little more value than asking people if they prefer to shop at Wal-mart or Target who really cares, right?

[rebjeb04]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Mr Lane - this is not a zero sum game, so not sure what you mean by "which (who) has the edge over the other?" Both are outstanding, and indeed are 2 men who have made correctly reproducing period textiles their life's work, and the hobby is in their debt, big time.

Order the cloth that you believe most closely matches what you are trying to reproduce. There are plenty of choices.

I will say this is the best method in choosing what to use for what you are making. for example, I had Don Smith recreate Capt. Otis Baker's double-breasted frockcoat in Echoes of Glory (not the lieut.'s coat). In picking out my fabric, I had to decide what the coat would have looked like new. The original is a dark tan now, but in 1863 it probably would have been a nice steel gray (Tart's Logwood jean is what I chose). This fabric would give me the closest color to the dark tan after one more year or so of war. Of course oxidation over 130 years helps as well. Don executed it perfectly, and I'm afraid it will be mistaken as an original in a few years.

I know Tart has produced his fabric to an almost exact weave to even the twist of yarn. However, I have had Mr. Childs goods as well, but if you want a natuarally dyed garment that will fade and oxidize over the years, Ben Tart is probably your man. I have swatch cards for both and these two gents have a great deal to offer. I might suggest you purchase a swatch card from them and compare to get your best results. Mr. Childs has also reproduced shirtings, and cotton fabrics for lining exactly from existing originals.

Hope this helps,
Erik McBroom

[Ghostrider_58]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Curiosity is all well and good. Many in that other hobby like nothing more than to delve into it while popping the top on a couple of brewskis in front of their well made, hand forged cast iron fire grates after a day of honoring their forebears with three battles and a ball. Round these parts though the question that really needs to be asked and answered about this type thing isn't what the personal preference of some yahoo who merely managed to make it through the AC account creation process is.

The question if folks prefer apples or oranges more is really irrelevant. What should be asked is which specific type cloth for a particular application most closely matches the model set down 140+ years ago. Preference has little to do with it.

If you just want a bunch of disjointed opinions and not actual facts you might as well ask your questions in Osz since you will surely get a much wider and more interesting set of replies. Granted not as many over there will have heard of Charlie Childs or Ben Tart but if the question is of little more value than asking people if they prefer to shop at Wal-mart or Target who really cares, right?

Dear Troy, I actually do enjoy hearing other people's opinion on this board. I don't have to take anyone's opinion as fact, I have my own preferences after doing many years of research. Many guys on here (including you) have spent many years making their uniform accurate as possible and it is always nice to hear the insight of others, just like Mr. McBroom's opinion on oxidation and the twist of yarn, or Mr. Berry and Mr. Berrier's information on piece dying. The beauty of this site is that it gives an opportunity to talk to like-minded individuals, and if someone feels like a question has little value then they do not have to respond to it.

[AZReenactor]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Drew,
It is fine that you enjoy hearing the opinions of others and I do indeed hope you are discerning enough to separate the wheat from the chaff but the fact is that there a lot of people who have signed up on this forum who's mere opinion isn't worth spit. There are also far too many on this board who's level of research is to simply ask what an online forum thinks about an issue or if a vendor appears on some rather inconsequential list. You may well be ahead of the curve when you began visiting here, but for the sake of the other side of that bell, it is important that both questions and answers be well formed around here.

[Michael McComas]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Mr. Mayo,

I have some of Mr. Tart's cassimere and satinet, and I can certainly vouch for the high quality of the fabrics. The satinet does get a little fuzzy in the dye bath.

What Mr. Tart has in stock depends a great deal on what he has woven at the time. If he doesn't have what you're looking for, call and ask. He's friendly that way. I have a stock of #5C stashed away. Now that it's a "collector's item", I'll have to charge a premium for it.

Best,

Michael

[lthull3rdla]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

I have 3 shell's made from Childs jeans and they are all fantastic. All three of these are made out of material that was available from 8-10 years ago. I just finished a columbus depot made from Tarts sumac dyed jeans. Both of them suppy some really really fine material. You just have to figure out what you want.

Ronnie

[Fifer37thNC]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

I had a NC Sack coat made by Ben Tart. Since I am a fifer it has the Musicians front on it. It was worth every penny.

[reb290]

Re: Ben Tart or County Cloth?

Hello,
I just got a couple yards of Ben's Rusty bark jean and I must say it is awesome :D I can't wait to make a jacket out of it.