Sargents Major and arms

[BobbyHughes]

Comrades,

I used the search and no dice, so here goes. I have been checking photographic evidence, and what few first hand accounts I have come across, as well as Kautz, Hardee, et all, and can find no answer to the question, How were Sergeants Major armed? The few images I have seen of Sergeant Majors, show them with only the NCO sword. The one very clear image, which I do not have access to at this hour, is of USCT in parade formation. Anyone have any idea, as to if they carried the NCO sword in addition to or in lieu of the rifled musket?

[BrianHicks]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

Pat Landrum sent me this little tid-bit a few weeks ago:

From Sgt. Major Chambers-46th Ms Reg.

"It was seemingly one of the darkest nights I ever saw. I had lain down without removing even my blanket or sword. At the first volley I sprang to my feet,but a little excited at the din."

This is a quote from New Hope Church and Pickett's Mill time frame. Thought you would like it.

While not conclusive, it is noteworthy because it tells us what this particular SgtMaj was carrying during the Atlanta campaign. (Both he and I commented on the fact that it is from a campaign in Mid-1864, and this SgtMaj was still carrying his NCO sword, and not for parade or ceremony, but in the field during active campaigning).

[Seamus]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

From Infantry Tactics, Vol. I, Schools of the Soldier and the Company,
by Major-General Winfied Scott (1835)

MANUAL OF ARMS.


FOR SERGEANTS.

The sergeants, like the rank and file, will always present themselves under arms with the bayonets fixed.

All sergeants, including the sergeant-major and the quartermaster sergeant, also corporals of the colour-guard, and all corporals not in the ranks and files, will carry, and handle their arms, as herein prescribed for sergeants.

[Ross L. Lamoreaux]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

I posted on this sometime before the famous crash, but I recall in an account of the 19th Indiana of the Iron Brigade, the sergeant major was newly promoted either before or after Antietam and did not have a sword. One was "procurred" for him from a Confederate officer who was newly captured and belt and all was given to the new sergeant major. I've also read at least two accounts of mid to late war sergeants major in Western Federal units carrying muskets since their regiments were depleted. Its hard to use images only to judge, as many of them were wearing their best uniforms and would want to be as regulation as possible. I highly recommend using both images and first person accounts to get a more well rounded approach.

[Will Eichler]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

As with Ross, I'd certainly recommend looking at images of the men of the period. When I was trying to reach a decision for a sergeant major's impression I was doing several years ago, I found at least 6 images of sergeant majors carrying officer's style swords. I could not identify any as the regulation, rather all were private purchase. Still, all three of these were shaped more like the 1850 foot than the NCO sword.

I was lucky that one of the six images came from a private collection here in MI and happened to be one of the sergeant majors of the regiment I was to portray here.

Don't discount the use of private purchase swords.

As a caveat, all my research was on the Federal side.

Good luck in your research,

Will

[BathGuards11thVA]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

I don’t post much here but just wanted to throw in my 2 cents. I'm an active duty marine and I would want to think that their military would be a lot like ours in the issue of gear. Back then and like today we have official Tables of organization but in combat they are very rarely followed from one Battalion to the next. I think it would be a personal choice and the feeling from the command of the battalion or regiment they served in like today. You can see Pictures of Marines in Iraq carrying Long arms and some with just pistols due to their personal choice as stated before. Like I said this is my opinion.

[BobbyHughes]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

Thanks for all the replies... this is going to be fun, once I get the time to really pour into the research. This has really been bugging me since I got railroaded into the position. (Still havent received my Engineers cap and train whistle yet!:-))

[10TnVI]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

Here's a quote for your research- excerpt from the book "From Antietum to Fort Fisher'- the CW letters of Edward King Wightman

Wightman originally enlisted in the 9th NY(Hawkin's Zouves) and latter renlisted in the 3rd NY

October 26, 1864- in camp near Deep Bottom, VA
"I have been ... appointed acting Sgt. Major. This exempts me from all details and from lugging a musket"

[markj]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

I've undoubtedly posted this before, but you still might find it compelling and edifying.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[BobbyHughes]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

Mark,

Very interesting survey! Thanks for posting that..its a big help.

[Kevin O'Beirne]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

I recall that the book, Sons of Old Monroe (regimental history of the 140th New York), by Brian Bennett, published in 1992 by Morningside Press, contains a quote about the regiment's actions on Little Round Top during the battle of Gettysburg. If I'm not mistaken--and I apologize that I have not looked this up to verify it before posting this--the quote (I believe attributed to Lt. Porter Farley) mentions that the regiment's young Sergeant Major was armed only with a non-commissioned officer sword.

This is interesting because it:

1. Is about a "spit-and-polish" Army of the Potomac regiment. The 140th was, at times, brigaded with either the spiffy Fifth New York and with Regulars, and the regiment reportedly tended to regard itself as like Regulars in its military bearing and manner of conduct.

2. It is from a battle (i.e., on campaign) during a very long and arduous campaign. One might otherwise tend to think that the Sgt Maj in such a campaign would toss his lightweight and symbolic sword for a weapon with which he could defend himself. This Sgt Maj apparently did not.

I suspect that the real truth about whether or not Sergeants Major typically carried a long-arm is a complex question that probably few if any can conclusively answer. The best bet is to assemble some documentation that backs up your typical portrayal to the best extent possible.

Regarding the post above about what Scott's Manual says, that's all well and good to know and understand, but often there was a difference between "what the book said" and what was actually done in the field by volunteer regiments in the Civil War.

[john duffer]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

"Regarding the post above about what Scott's Manual says, that's all well and good to know and understand, but often there was a difference between "what the book said" and what was actually done in the field by volunteer regiments in the Civil War."

To support what Kevin is saying, the manuals by Scott, Hardee, et al, are meant to be textbooks more than rule books. The reference shows how a sergeant major should carry his musket if he has one, rather than requiring that he must have one.

[JustRob]

Re: Sargents Major and arms

Could it also be that by the time the Sergeant Major needs a musket there are probably a few spares lying around?