House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

[echamp6165]

I just saw this on the Horsesoldier website, has anyone seen this yet?

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c110:H.R.4125:

[Johnny Lloyd]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

Glad I got my kit before this garbage takes effect...

I don't support this because it ruins the attempt (art, if you will) at authentic reproductions- hence ruins our end of the hobby.

But I DO support further legislation that makes it a bigger crime to sell reproductions as originals- just look at Ebay's horror show of "original" items.

There is a happy-medium here- it's called full-provenance of an item by a qualified antiques appraiser and harsh penalties for those that market repros as originals.

Off my soapbox...

-Johnny

[Andy Ackeret]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

"To amend the Hobby Protection Act to require that imitation Civil War items be clearly marked as copies."

"b) Imitation Civil War Item Defined- Section 7 of the Hobby Protection Act (15 U.S.C. 2106) is amended by adding at the end the following:

`(8) The term `imitation Civil War item' means an item which purports to be, but in fact is not, an original Civil War item, or which is a reproduction, copy, facsimile, or counterfeit of an original Civil War item."

My feeling is this law is to give specific legal backing to make forging antiques illegal. Not to ruin your kewl sack coat or belt. Anyway, I support modern marks discretely put on reproduction items to prevent future owners using them in a fradulent way or being fooled in 10 or 20 years.

[Johnny Lloyd]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

Andy-

You're right... the "intent" of the law is to prevent fraud obviously...

But who knows how far the authorities will take it if there is the ability to do so?

The key is, to make the law specific-enough to prevent fraud and allow those that make authentic reproductions to practice their craft properly.

-Johnny

[OldKingCrow]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

Bully for the honorable representative from the Old Dominion for his wise and judicious use of the public coffers and process.

We all know this will stop antique forgers dead in their tracks.

Seeing how it is sitting with the Energy and Commerce Committee maybe when you’re done hammering out this gem of national importance you might get to work on that $3.25 a gallon issue.

[Johnny Lloyd]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

"Bully for the honorable representative from the Old Dominion for his wise and judicious use of the public coffers and process."

Yeah, I was SO worried about the fakes in the antiques market versus the insane price of gas, global warming, or terrorism...

Nope, not worried about that stuff compared to this at all...

Our Congress really makes a positive difference in our lives on this one...

"Stop the insanity..."

-Johnny

[mslaird]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

...Seeing how it is sitting with the Energy and Commerce Committee maybe when you’re done hammering out this gem of national importance you might get to work on that $3.25 a gallon issue.

Exactly. Right on.

I am absolutely sick to death of the folks that are selling fraudulent "original" items on the auction sites. It goes fairly beyond our hobby as well and the frauds are costing many an unwarry or ingnorant buyer into the thousands which is definitely felony territory. But there are many a state with statutes and codes which include "Theft by Deception" and the verbage in those statutes lends them to apply in such cases. This smacks of another legislative instance of not enforcing laws that already exist and making more laws to convolute the issue even further.

[Vicksburg Dave]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

Given Mr. Moran's location, it sounds like someone close to him got burned. While he is at it maybe he could craft legislation curtailing our importation of fake goods from China, or maybe force ebay to actually enforce its rules about fakes, instead of ignoring people when they report them.
It's a stupid law. The forgers are already breaking the law, why would the passage of another law discourage them. Unless it is the death penalty, or maybe getting a hand chopped off, it won't deter them.

[reddcorp]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

By all means, let's allow the federal government control over one more aspect of our lives. We all know how well the feds do with most everything they get involved in..spending our money, regulating our lives, etc.
We should not expect the government to protect us from everything...to do so takes away the freedoms we cherish so. Life is a risk, be careful.
As to CW reproductions/authentic articles....caveat emptor.

A.Redd

[sepoy1857]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

Don't they have anything better to do with their time? They are worried about your sack coat and if it is properly marked as a repro??? Yeah forget about crime, drugs, illegal immigration, and terrorists...This qualifies as the most ridiculous item of the day!

[mslaird]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

If not the most ridiculous it is definitely in the top five. This is why we should pay more attention to the folks we continually elect into the house and senate. They are the people who make our laws. Yet, the folks do not seem to care who thier senator or representative is or how these people are spending thier tax dollars while they debate nonsense in committee. It would astound you to know how many people do not even know thier senator or representative's names or affiliations if you ask them.

[unclefrank]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

As a people, we don't get the government we wish for, but the one we deserve. Because of our ignorent and lazy behavior, we have staffed Wahington with self serving rascals, and outright morons, with a sprinkling of honest "do gooder" types. :baring_te

[mslaird]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

As a people, we don't get the government we wish for, but the one we deserve. Because of our ignorent and lazy behavior, we have staffed Wahington with self serving rascals, and outright morons, with a sprinkling of honest "do gooder" types. :baring_te

Once again, right on sir.

[PanzerJager]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

Reading over the proposed amendment it appears that whoever wrote this did so probably with the most legitimate intentions, but as with many other laws didn’t think it through entirely. The people who make and deal in fakes are going to continue to do so regardless of this law as long as there are buyers who are willing to hand over their hard earned dollar. I think ultimately the responsibility comes down to the collector/buyer to know what he is purchasing before he or she willingly parts with their money. It is scary in the collector world how many people don’t know, study and familiarize themselves with the current reproductions, you would think with the money some of these people invest they would but to often I have seen an entire months pay spent on a fake. A good example of this was the Richmond relic show this summer, if anyone checked out the world war 2 militaria side of the show there was a variety of reenactment stuff being pawned off as the real thing. I can’t tell you how many fake German tunics I saw, being a reenactor I was able to spot this stuff 50 feet away. The same thing is true when it comes to high end civil reproductions, saw plenty of fakes on the civil war side of the show as well. We buy this stuff as repro and when we sell them second hand we don’t know what the next person is going to do with it or the person he sells it to, that’s why collectors need to study the fakes and reproductions as they just get better and better all the time. There is always going to be a “cottage” industry of fakers out there who get better and more clever with their techniques, some of which are down right scary. An amendment like this I fear will do little if anything to stop fakes as there is always going to be a market.

Regards,

[Dreamer42]

Re: House Bill:Marking Requirements for Reproduction Civil War Items

I agree with other posts in that I feel the government has better thangs to do. However, there's more to it than that. When I step back an look at this what angers me more is that this type of thing has no end. It's a question of electing leaders who can't be satisfied until everything is controlled, regulated or taxed. I'd be willing to bet that there's money in someone's pockets at the end of this legislation. I recall that there are provisions in our founding documents limiting what the government can and can't do. Gradually, over the years, not just states, but individual people have fewer liberties. Unclefrank has the right idea. The Constitution and Bill of Rights can't keep us from being fools with a law.

- Jay Reid
Dreamer42