US Naval Uniform Patters

[D F Smith Historic]

Hi All,

I have recent project I have taken on I need some help with, and thought I'd ask on the AC if any one knows where, or whom to talk to about good US Navy Uuniform Patterns.

I have a customer that is having me make a full set of Pre War Naval Uniforms for the Mexican War.

Any helps or leads would be wonderful.

Please keep in mind as far as the sewing end of things I have all that tied down. Just looking for patterns and other related info

Thanks and all the best

Don S

[Ross L. Lamoreaux]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Don, one of the few makers of Navy clothing of note is Steve Hesson at www.hesson-clothiers.com. Another source is Joe Blunt of J. Blunt Clothiers (Spongebucket on this forum). I've also dabbled in 1830's and 40's summer linen frocks (modern "jumper") for our Seminole War navy unit, but as far as patterns, I've basically looked at one original at the Bardstown museum and used the Bosun Brown series of prints from the 1830's and created the pattern. I'd be happy to help you with that, but I'm far from an expert on the other stuff.

[Ian McWherter]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

I'm not sure if anyone offers any high quality 1840s-1850s U.S. Naval uniform patterns commercially, I know there are some decent 18th century and Regency era seamen's patterns available, but that's no help. If you have detailed enough photographs of a/several original uniform(s) I would recommend drafting out a pattern from scratch using an original pattern drafting manual or tailor's plate from the 1840s/1850s as your best course of action. You could use the spring bottom style trouser drafts as a base and move on from there. Anyway you look at it I think you have your work cut out for you, wish the best.:)

[Pvt_Sullivan]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Don,

One of my Living History pursuits (Tidewater Maritime Living History Association TMLHA) has patterns for a mid-19th century Sailor's Frock and Undershirt. I sent you a PM with my e-mail address in it and I would be glad to send them to you.

If you want some more background information I suggest you check out the Civil War Navy and Marine Forum as well as the Navy and Marine Living History Association.

[Duff]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

The Harrisburg civil war museum has a good number of original navy uniforms. Perhaps they would let you examine them.

[Matt_E_Wright]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

...and you may want to check with Greg Starbuck and see if either he, or the Civil War Navy Museum in Columbus, GA have anything squirrled away.

Matt Wright

[Vicksburg Dave]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

These sites may provide some guidance.

http://www.history.navy.mil/library/manuscript/edwards_wm.htm#d0e26

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq59-27.htm

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq59-26.htm

http://www.history.navy.mil/library/online/uniform_history.htm

Tily, James C. The Uniforms of the United States Navy. New York: Thomas Yoseloff, 1964.

Rankin, Robert H. Uniforms of the Sea Services: A Pictorial History. Annapolis MD: United States Naval Institute, 1962.

[JohnTaylorCW]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

I don't know anything about the group myself, can anyone comment on the US Naval Landing Party's Handbook; they have a Plans and Patterns section?

http://www.usnlp.org/handbook.html

[Justin Runyon]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

...and you may want to check with Greg Starbuck and see if either he, or the Civil War Navy Museum in Columbus, GA have anything squirrled away.

Matt Wright

Indedd Don, I know Greg to have some degree of knowledge on wartime naval material culture. My favorite and most versatile pair of trousers were, at one time, Greg's. When I bought them from him he mentioned having made them based on a USN quartermaster returns. As it turns out they are perfect for CS officer, US officer, CS enlisted, some US enlisted, and civilian. Who says Authentic Campaigning is too expensive...just do the research and find the gems. Of course I bought everything else as well, but that's beside the point.

[D F Smith Historic]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

I'm not sure if anyone offers any high quality 1840s-1850s U.S. Naval uniform patterns commercially, I know there are some decent 18th century and Regency era seamen's patterns available, but that's no help. If you have detailed enough photographs of a/several original uniform(s) I would recommend drafting out a pattern from scratch using an original pattern drafting manual or tailor's plate from the 1840s/1850s as your best course of action. You could use the spring bottom style trouser drafts as a base and move on from there. Anyway you look at it I think you have your work cut out for you, wish the best.:)

Hi Ian,

Thank you for the reference. I sincerely appreciate it.

I looked through the taylor guides, looking at the spring bottom trousers. I think these allong with the copy of David Rickmans refreence book "Sutters's Fort Costume Manual c.1845 for California State Parks will help out alot. & will recult in a decent pattern.

(For those of you who don't know of this reference book, it is a great source and starting point for the different pre war styles of clothing seen in early California.)


As you say, I do have my work cut out for me. I love a challenge

All the best

Don

[D F Smith Historic]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Hi Ross,

Thank you for the offer . I would like to take you up on it. Any pointers as to construction detail would be most helpful

I have contacted Steve Hesson, his work looks wonderful.

Can I give you a call? Or we can email about the particulars

Let me know by PM or shoot me an email

Thanks!

Don S

[D F Smith Historic]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Hi David,

Thank you for the reference links, they are very helpful

All the best

Don S

[Pvt Peck]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Don:

Hmm you might need to whip up some landing party uniforms and come out and storm the Customs House with me!

Ross: Thanks for posting that link to Hesson, they have some neat looking stuff!

Edward Parrott
"off the coast of Alta California with Sloat"

[sigsaye]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Been away for awhile. Nice to see something about the Navy on here again. Navy uniforms prior to 1886 are basically only uniform because Sailors were wearing them.

The Navy did not put any effort into the strict standardization of enlisted uniforms like the Army did. There is a very practical reason for this. the Army was never intended to leave the country. it was more or less always close to its source of supply. so, the Army could have its system of inspectors and QA checkers. Now, the navy had this also. They had shops on several naval Ship Yards that manufactured uniforms and leather gods for the fleet.

But, the fleet was not intended to hang around in home waters. Ships are small. Captains were faced with a choice. They were authorized to carry two spare outfits of clothing onboard for each man in the crew for a four year voyage. This unfortunately took up a lot of space that could be used for food, water, ammunition and such. Additionally, the Sailors had to buy these items and most Sailors hated to buy clothes. On the other hand, Captains could carry bolts of fabric, which provided twice the clothing at less than half the storage space aboard ship. Sailors found they could buy the fabric and make their own uniforms for less that half of the price ready made navy issue uniforms cost. So, what you end up with is a vast varity of "uniforms' If you look at any group shot of Sailors prior to 1886, if you look close you will notice that no two Sailors are wearing the same thing. At first glance they look uniform, but the details set them apart. Some have slash pockets in their frocks, some patch pockets, some none at all. Collar shapes vary constantly. Fabrics like wise, were what ever blue or white fabrics could be obtained. So, the fabrics and shades of blue used in Sailors uniforms seldom matched. Satinete was the prefered fabric for ready made issue uniforms. But kersey and flannel were used more often than not or trousers and ffrocks respectively. White uniforms wre actually suposed to be made of duck (white cotton drill about 10 oz) with blue denim collars and cuffs. The last set of documented originals karen and I worked on were actually made of linin with blue cotton Nanken collar and cuffs. the blue cotton was faded to a light sky blue, but in the seams it was a rich dark indigo blue. While some form of woolen was the fabric of choice for blue unfiorms, I have documentation of Sailors from the 1840s through the Civil War making working uniforms of blue denim and blue cotton drill. And, Sailors had distinct working uniforms, dress uniforms and liberty uniforms. it was not one uniform for all occassions. But, these are ont officially recognized, just something that by custome was done. Sailors had to stand muster daily, and inspection at least once a week, much like Army dress parade. They would be punished for dirty on excessivly mendtd clothing and anything that was out of regs (this meant no fancy work, embroidery, bows, ribbons, that sort of theng). Work on a ship is dirty, so they had gear to work in. When he went ashore, a Sailor wanted to look sharp,so he had his liberty uniforms that had the fancy work on them. These are what has survived to be put in museums, and unfortunately give a false impression that all Sailors uniforms were done up.

There are no commercially available patterns for naval uniforms. Karen and I spent months going over originals in private collections and museums and developed patterns and learned the techniques used to make the uniforms of the period.

The pattern that is available through the various CW Naval living history/reenacting organizations, while correct is for a button down collar style that ws not really very commonly used. Rare in photos. It is of the white frock in EOG, which is a liberyt frock. This style was only found during the CW.

naval uniforms of the period while confuseing at first, ar fasinating for the same reason, no two are alike.

Steve Hesson

[Pvt Peck]

Re: US Naval Uniform Patters

Mr. Hesson:

Great info, I have question though regarding fancy work on the uniform. I was under the impression that sailors of the period were known for doing fancy embroidery on the collars of their frocks and the tops of their hats. I have also read that this was a long standing tradition with both civilian and navy sailors. I have long wanted to see an authentic 1840's naval landing party here in Monterey where Commodore Sloat "took" California for the US.

Ted Parrott