Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

[PvtRJBrown]

How common would it be for men in the Civil War period to have knowledge of music by such composers as Mozart, Handel, Bach, Beethoven, etc? Just a thought for music at events & such.

[Jefferson Guards]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

There were many classical pieces that were transcribed for brass band. Just off the top of my head, the Port Royal Band book has arangements for " Un ballo in Maschera" and "Der Freischutz" Also, according to Billings, the Dead March from Handel's Saul was used as a march for military executions.

[Danny]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

How common would it be for men in the Civil War period to have knowledge of music by such composers as Mozart, Handel, Bach, Beethoven, etc? Just a thought for music at events & such.

Franklin -

Apparently Classical music was played in extended city-by-city tours around the Country in the decades leading up to and through the Civil War by certain instrumental virtuosos, if not via full Orchestra as the Europeans heard them. The Virtuosi travelling in America mixed classical music in with performances of Opera music, which apparently was not considered so Classical at the time. (R. Allen Lott, "From Paris to Peoria: How European Piano Virtuosos Brought Classical Music to the American Heartland" New York: Oxford University Press, 2003).

Louis Gottschalk was one of the first Great American Concert pianists who travelled constantly through the States at the time. Quote: "Gottschalk was comfortable composing in a European style. He was able to imitate in his music the approaches of Chopin and Liszt, two of the most significant European composers of the romantic period who were just being recognized as such in 1850s America." (Louis Moreau Gottschalk, John Sullivan Dwight, And The Development Of Musical Culture In The United States, 1853-1865 " an unpublished dissertation by Laura Moore Pruett , © 2007)

Famous American music critic John Sullivan Dwight was apparently able to make a career from reviewing fine art musicians who toured the U.S. He wrote of an Austrian pianist who toured the United States in 1851-54: "Alfred Jaell is now, we suppose, generally acknowledged the foremost pianist who has visited this country. . . . He is master of most that has become classical, from Bach and Beethoven, to Mendelssohn and Chopin, and of all the bewildering brilliancies of the Thalbergs, Liszts, Littofs, Willmerses, and all the minor would-be Titans..." (John Sullivan Dwight, Dwight's Journal of Music, 22 January 1853, 124-5).

The question remains, though likely that officers knew such classics, because they were high-born Northerners or Refined Plantation owners who could afford such concerts before the war, would the average field soldier have attended such concerts?

Dan Wykes

[DonH]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

Ok, ready for a terribly long post? Sorry...I'm used to writing long papers now in college lol. Anyway... Music of the early Romantics, such as Carl von Weber, Schubert, Mendelssohn, Chopin, Schumann, and Liszt may have been popular by the time of the Civil War. Note that I say may have been, as they were all European composers who were famous (or dead) by this time, but I am not exactly sure as to how popular they were in the US. Someone else can research that ;-)

Something to understand about the Classic Period and ALL periods prior is the way society viewed music. Today, we sit down to the radio and listen to music from all sorts of periods, from classical (in general terms…not just the period) to AC/DC to Duke Ellington to fife and drum (ok…I admit…never heard fife and drum on the radio, but you get the point haha). The music we as a society listen to can be on tour right now or 200 years old and we’d love it.

However…prior to the Romantic Period, society ONLY wanted to hear NEW music. During the Classic and early Romantic Periods things began to change. But why do you think Bach wrote so much, or why Haydn wrote over 100 symphonies, or why every other composer from this time and prior wrote so much? It’s because the people they wrote for were never content with old music; the composers were expected by society to provide them with new music all the time.

The next thing that goes with that…once a composer died, his music was more/less forgotten. This happened all the way up until Beethoven. Beethoven was perhaps the first composer in music history who long after he died, people still wanted to hear his works they loved them that much. The only people who knew about old composers were composers and music critics who studied works…but they never played their music, just studied it. J.S. Bach is considered a very famous composer today; at the time of Beethoven's death, few people probably would have heard of Bach. In fact C.P.E Bach and J.C. Bach, two of his sons, were more popular then than their father (until Haydn and Mozart came along).

Technically, when you go to Colonial Williamsburg (which portrays the 1770s) and you hear Handel, Vivaldi, Bach, or any other Baroque composer, that would never have happened. The only reason I don’t say anything, is just like today, the new styles often start in Europe then eventually make their way here…it may have just taken a while for colonial musicians to have realized the Baroque style was out and the Classical style was in.

In fact, it wasn’t until Felix Mendelssohn began willingly performing Baroque and Classical music that people began to enjoy old works. He conducted Bach’s St Matthew Passion in 1829, the first known performance of it since 1736. Soon after this new performance, Bach began on his incredible highway of fame that still continues today.

Perhaps by the time of the Civil War, people may have been starting to perform more Baroque and Classical music. Either way, for historical accuracy, you would have a much better time getting away with Bach at Civil War events than at Rev War events oddly enough!

[Old Cremona]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

In the case of Sigismond Thalberg, the pianist, a classical musician actively sought a "popular" style to endorse, and presumably increase his stature among the "common folk."

"...The attention bestowed upon the banjo by the great Thalberg, and his having taken lessons from the author, is conclusive evidence of its merits as a musical instrument..."

Phil. Rice, Correct Method for The Banjo, With or Without a Master, 1858.

[RJSamp]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

Good stuff Donald! And have read that as well.....new/newest is the rage. whether it be melodies or lyrics for old songs. For Hymns we use the 1857 Episcopal Hymnal. Trumpet music we start with Arban's 1854 Etude Study. And for Music we do a cross between posted contemporary concert lists and Levy Music. So we can get a list of the 16 pieces played at a dance/ball/concert/dinner party for a General....and then have a reasonable chance at finding a period arrangement (the actual sheet music).

Jari Villanueva has done yeoman's work on pulling together forgotten, yet popular, works.....the music of the 26th North Carolina (Moravian) Band is available in 4 volumes. The troops like to hear the new music, and we try to oblige them as much as possible....they are our audience after all (and our employer, albeit indirectly). When the General requests a favorite air, or a certain quadrille is requested for the dance, you can be certain we add them to our repetoire!

Nothing like a cornettist playing "The Bohemian Girl's Lament" atop the parapets at 10PM.....for BOTH sides.....

Time to sing along with Mitch!
"I dreamt that I dwelt in marble halls,
With vassals and serfs at my side,
And of all who assembled within those walls,
That I was the hope and the pride.
I had riches too great to count
Could boast of a high ancestral name;
But I also dreamt, which pleased me most,
That you lov'd me still the same
That you lov'd me, you lov'd me still the same,
That you lov'd me, you lov'd me still the same."

[Danny]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

... Music of the early Romantics, such as Carl von Weber, Schubert, Mendelssohn, Chopin, Schumann, and Liszt may have been popular by the time of the Civil War. Note that I say may have been, as they were all European composers who were famous (or dead) by this time, but I am not exactly sure...

Don -

Maybe you missed it, but already answered. Again:

... Famous American music critic John Sullivan Dwight was apparently able to make a career from reviewing fine art musicians who toured the U.S. He wrote of an Austrian pianist who toured the United States in 1851-54: "Alfred Jaell is now, we suppose, generally acknowledged the foremost pianist who has visited this country. . . . He is master of most that has become classical, from Bach and Beethoven, to Mendelssohn and Chopin, and of all the bewildering brilliancies of the Thalbergs, Liszts, Littofs, Willmerses, and all the minor would-be Titans..." (John Sullivan Dwight, Dwight's Journal of Music, 22 January 1853, 124-5)....

Dan Wykes

[Johnny Lloyd]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

Hmmm... interesting question...

Not a musician here, but wouldn't that question be specific to kind of socioeconomic class/availability of classical music performances to whomever was listening to them?

I'd think the popularity/knowledge of a certain kind of music (minstrel show tunes, drinking songs, slave work songs, sea chanties, classical music concerts, church music, etc.) would depend on what class of person would (or could) hear them.

I'd think if you were relatively rich or had enough money to see a concert, chances are you'd know what classical music was and could appreciate it at live classical concerts- which obviously would be the only way you could hear music in the 1860s.

Of course, it doesn't mean a rich man couldn't go to a minstrel show or hear his slaves singing in the fields and is doesn't mean a poor man might not have a penchant for classical music he heard a band play sometime. "Popularity could be quite subjective and might need clarification in terms of what kind of person we are talking about in the 1860s, I reckon.

Perhaps minstrel tunes/drinking songs and other commonly-sung tunes would be like our equivalent of 'pop music' today and classical music would be the 'highbrow' music of the 1860s.

-Johnny

[Raymond]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

Three sources are very interesting to find an answer on the availability of 'classical' music.
First are the advertisements and reviews of concerts, which I have seen a lot (also on this forum), but never researched myself.
Second are the lists of series, mostly on the front cover of sheet music. These can be found in the superb online collections your libraries are producing. Two examples are: http://levysheetmusic.mse.jhu.edu/le...es=4;range=0-3 and http://library.duke.edu/digitalcolle...sm.b0997/pg.1/ (of which the second one is of more relevance in this discussion).
Third and most valuable are the 'also for sale from this publisher' lists at the back of sheet music (there should be an English word for that, but I do not know it). Again, these can be found in online collections, but are more difficult to find. (That is why I haven't got a quick example.) These will give you a quantitative estimate of how much 'classical' music was available compared to 'pop' music in these days.
(Some time ago I found one (I think it was from a Philadelphia publisher) who had, apart from dozens of songs, methods for piano, violin and flute the complete Lieder ohne Worte of Mendelssohn. This was one of the more expensive publications, I think it was about 4 dollars.)
I hope this helps a little. Unfortunately, I don't have time now to find you more examples.

Raymond Rammeloo

[7thNYcav]

Re: Knowledge of barouqe/classical music during the ACW

Check out this site has lots of infoemation on classical music in the U.S.

http://composersdatebook.publicradio.org/

This is for today

1846—American premiere of Beethoven: Symphony No. 9 ("Choral") by New York Philharmonic Society at New York's Castle Garden, George Loder, Jr. conducting; It appears that the Society tried unsuccessfully to invite Mendelssohn to attend this festival performance, which they organized to raise funds for "the erection of a suitable edifice for musical purposes" in Manhattan; The next documented performance of Beethoven's Ninth outside of New York was given in Boston on February 5, 1853 by the combined forces of the Handel and Haydn Society plus the Germania Society; Other 19 th century regional premieres of Beethoven Ninth occurred in New Haven (Dec. 10, 1870), Columbus (Dec. 13, 1870), Chicago (Dec. 17, 1870), Philadelphia (April 27, 1874), Milwaukee (Oct. 22, 1878), Baltimore (May 3, 1884) and Pittsburgh (May 25, 1889);