19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

[Mgreer]

This may sound kinda odd, but does anyone know any good anti immigrant, anti Irish song, or anti-Catholic songs of the 1840's-60's

[PetePaolillo]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Marvin. This is probably not what you are looking for because this song was actually popular among Irish Immigrants but the lyrics speak of the times.

http://tigger.uic.edu/~rjensen/song.htm

[Mgreer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

yeah im looking more for songs that were sung about Immigrants. today Irish songs are popular but back then not so much

[Hank Trent]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Well, here's one: Few Days. (Click on View This Item to see the words.)

It's pretty subtle though, unless you know the whole context of the times, and then it's downright ominous.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[Mgreer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Thanks Hank... I knew Willie would know something lol

[33rdaladrummer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Croppies Lie Down, known as "No Party Quickstep" in Bruce and Emmett's 1861 Drummers' and Fifers' Guide...

Here's a hilarious story about the tune being played in 1888:

"Although it is nearly a century since the tune of ‘Croppies Lie Down’ was sung by Orangemen in Ireland while they massacred the Catholics, it still has the power to incite Irishmen to overt acts. Paddy Ryan plays the concertina. He was born in this city. He had somewhere heard the obnoxious tune but knew nothing of its historical significance. Paddy is a member of an East Side social club. The annual ball of his society occurred a few evenings since. The usual fiddle scrapers were on hand to provide the dance music but Paddy had brought his concertina along, being a little proud of his one accomplishment. During one of the lulls between the dances the president of the association went up to the boss musician and said: ‘Av ye plaze, sor, I wouldn’t be wantin’ t’ be interf’arin’ wid your music. Sure, we’re all highly plazed wid it, so we are, an’ more power t’ yer elbow when yer waggin’ yer fiddle bow. Faix, ye’ll get yer pay wheth er or no, so ye will, an’ its not wan o’ us ‘ud be takin wan cint off yer bill’.
There he stopped to take a breath and the German professor looked down at him from the platform in an enquiring way.
‘Vot you will haf, mine frent? Beer, ha?’
‘Go smother yersel’, ye cheese-headed Dutchman. I can buy me own beer, so I can, an small fear t’ me. I want ye t’ stop squ’akin’ th’ fiddles an’ rattlin’ th’ brass till Paddy Ryan plays an Irish chune on his concertina. Now, d’ye understand that, ye ould beer barrel’?
‘Yah, yah, das is all recht. Stop de moosic’.
The music was stopped and the president shouted: ‘Will Paddy Ryan come up [to] the platform an’ play an Irish chune fer the b’ys an’ gur-rls’?
Paddy came bashfully forth, his face suffused with blushes and his beloved concertina under his arm.
‘Play the ‘Rakes o’ Mallow’’, shouted a voice.
The rollicking air set everybody’s feet to itching. This was followed by ‘The Wind that Shakes the Barley’, ‘The Cat in the Corner’, and ‘The Limerick Races’. All these were rapturously received. Paddy was encouraged. He glowed with pride. Pulling his forelock apologetically, he stood up and said:
0A
‘Av the ladies an’ gintlemin plaze, I’ll play a new chune I’m after larnin’ the other day’.
Of course the audience was pleased, and every ear was open to catch the air. Paddy pulled the lively measures out of his instrument with eagerness. He had hardly played two bars, however, when the listeners turned and looked at each other with surprise and indignation. Then twenty roysterers arose as one man and made a rush for the luckless player. They seized him from behind and before. They kicked his concertina into the middle of the floor, where the girls made a football of it. They tore his store clothes from his back and bruised his cheeks with their hard fists. Those who could not get at him shook their fists in his direction and swore terrible oaths. Impelled by a stogy boot poor Paddy shot out the door, followed by the howling mob. As he rolled down the staircase and out on the sidewalk, a friend picked him up and hurried him around the corner into a saloon. Bleeding, bruised, and almost naked, Paddy stammered:
‘Shure, w-w-w-hats th’ matter, Jim’?
‘Ah, ye ould fule, weren’t ye playin’ ‘Croppies Lie Down’’?"

http://www.concertina.com/worrall/anglo-in-united-states/

Another Orangeman tune is Boyne Water:

'Of "The Battle of the Boyne Water," Samuel Bayard (Dance to the Fiddle,
March to the Fife) says, "formerly in western Pennsylvania the mere singing
or playing of the tune could bring on a mass attack by any group of Catholic
Irish who happened to be within hearing distance," and, "there is a
story -- possibly a true one -- in Fayette County about an old Irishman
turning up potatoes in his garden, while his wife, following him with a
sack, was stowing them away. She absent-mindedly began humming this air,
whereupon, in a blind rage, he turned about and killed her with a single
blow of his spade." '

https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A3=ind9709&L=IRTRAD-L&E=0&P=374352&B=--&T=TEXT%2FPLAIN;%20charset=US-ASCII

If you ever get a copy of Bayard, look up "Kick the Pope." Can't remember how old it is though...

[33rdaladrummer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

today Irish songs are popular but back then not so much

For what it's worth:

YORKTOWN, VIRGINIA.
The Illustrated London News, vol.39, no.1111, p.338.
October 5,1861
***There is a long line of camps on the ridge of the high river banks, another in an open space of the woods beyond, and a third is down on the shore; behind you, around you, which ever way you turn, the pointed tents dart up in bright relief before the broad river and blue line of distant coast, or lie snugly embedded in the dark green woods; and from one or another of these encampments one's ears are perpetually assailed by the drum and the fife, which comprise the principal military music of Yorktown. The Southern stock of band instruments is nearly exhausted, so the fife rings changes on the martial airs of "Dixie Land" and the "Marseillaise," varied by Irish jigs; and the drum beats time to the march or parade.

The United service magazine 1854- Page 197

On proceeding about half a mile farther, a turn in the road showed oa on our left, and a few hundred yards in advance, a large hacienda, whose whitewashed walls gleamed cheerfully through the hedges of gigantic aloes that bounded the road in front of it, and as we approached more nearly, the brisk and lively notes of the wry-neck'd fife playing a merry Irish jig, became distinctly audible.

Historic days in Cumberland County, New Jersey, 1855-1865: political and war page 42 by Isaac T. Nichols - History - 1907 - 257 pages

The Fourth of July, 1861, was patriotically celebrated in Bridgeton, the exercises taking place in a grove on West Commerce street. Paul T. Jones delivered an eloquent address, patriotic and enthusiastic in character. The Declaration of Independence was read by Morton Mills. The day opened bright and beautiful. Early in the morning the old- time drum corps. Lot Loper, fifer; Levin Bond, kettle drummer ; Eddie Crozier with the big drum, proceeded down Laurel hill to Edmund Davis' hotel, corner Laurel and Commerce, and took a position which was soon surrounded by a crowd of men and boys. The music which these veterans sent forth roused the crowd, the reveille was beat, and the spirit of '76 held high carnival. Those who looked on can never forget the appearance and enthusiasm of Lev., Lot and Eddie as they made the welkin ring with "Yankee Doodle," "Hail Columbia," "Red, White and Blue." "The Girl I Left Behind Me," and an Irish jig or two.

[Mtn.Guerilla]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Hey Marvin (I'm sure you have already) but have you talked to Kiev about any? He and I had talked about learning some at some point. He may know of some titles.
Take care,
Eric

[MBBursig]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

There are a number of songs written in the minstrel style to make fun of Irish and Germans on the Library of Congress 19th Cent. Songsheets Collection site.

[Jubilo]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Dear Sir Paradiddler ,
While I consider the topic historical it does seem like bait for a emotional flame war. As for as Irish massacres , you should in all historical fairness mention Scullabogue, Wexford Bridge and Gorey , of the 1798 United Irishmen Rebellion for starters.
all for the old flag,
David Corbett

[Mgreer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Mr. Corbett,

I do sort of see where you are coming from, but being PC was not an issue for them at that time. As an African American do some period songs offend me yes but I can’t deny that it happened or ask that people not sing them. By doing so you only cover up the ignorance that some of our ancestors including my own believed. And I do thank you for your comment because it is through discourse such as this that ideas are passed wich help us all grow as historians.

Marvin

[33rdaladrummer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Not trying to start a flame war. I personally don't take sides in the whole Irish Catholic versus Irish Protestant thing. The related music, however, does make for some interesting history.

While it can be debated whether the "Irish" musical styles are over or under-represented in our hobby, I think some are probably missing the point. The real question that needs to be answered is if musicians are really performing the music in a period-correct manner.

The modern "Celtic" music scene probably is too heavy of an influence on reenactors trying to play "Irish" music, just like the modern fife and drum repertoire has distorted the correct interpretation of 1860s martial music.

No one wants to hear a fake Irish accent and fools acting like "leprechauns" anymore than I want to hear the latest modern drum solo played at a reenactment by a fife and drum corps.

There is actually pretty good documentation that can be found if one digs deep enough. By looking through period tunebooks and period references to "Irish jigs", it seems to me that we need a little more of "Rory O'More" and a lot less "Minstrel Boy."

Dear Sir Paradiddler ,
While I consider the topic historical it does seem like bait for a emotional flame war. As for as Irish massacres , you should in all historical fairness mention Scullabogue, Wexford Bridge and Gorey , of the 1798 United Irishmen Rebellion for starters.
all for the old flag,
David Corbett

[AZReenactor]

Re: 19th C. Pro Immigrant Song

This one is from the other perspective and pro-immigrant but I thought I'd toss it out into the discussion since it is one of my favorites from the period.

Uncle Sam's Farm, 1850

It was included in the 1860 Republican Campaign Songster and parodied a number of times as well.

[Jubilo]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Dear Sir,
The intelligence of your reply is most refreshing. Thank you.
all for the oldflag,
David Corbett

[33rdaladrummer]

Re: 19th C. Anti Immigrant Songs

Lovers (and haters) of "Irish" music should get a kick out of this. Also note that the William Chappell mentioned below was much more of an expert on music than this one will ever be!

The Musical World, Vol. XXXVIII
London, Published by Boosey and Sons
1860

BENEDICT'S ERIN AND CALEDONIA.*

(From the Illustrated Times).

That these brilliant morceaux de bravoura should have attained almost unexampled popularity is not to be wondered at, considering the manner, at once clever and congenial, in which Mr. Benedict has treated the beautiful melodies that form their groundwork. For " Erin " he has selected two of the most racy of the (supposed) Irish national tunes, which will be recognised under the comparatively recent titles of " Believe me il' all those endearing young charms " and " The Minstrel Boy." For '' Caledonia" he has had recourse to " Auld Robin Gray," and one of the liveliest, most piquant, and characteristic of the Scottish reels. In both instances the wisdom of his choice is borne out by the complete success of his workmanship. The airs are admirably harmonised, and the passages are, without exception, graceful, showy, and effective. The plan of each fantasia is clear, well defined, and masterly ; and in the Irish as in the Scotch essay the character of the tune is imitated throughout with the utmost felicity, though it is by no means certain that " The Minstrel Boy " is an Irish tune, any more than " The girl I left behind me," " The Cruiskeen Lawn," and others which were never thought to be anything but English until Moore adapted them. We often hear of Scotch and Irish music being wonderfully " characteristic," and yet persons who should be good judges are perpetually making mistakes as to the character of each. Mr. Chappell in his volume of English national music, frequently remarks and shows that such and such a composer or compiler (among others Moore) could not tell the tunes of one country from those of another. From this we infer—while fully believing that each possesses a certain number of airs clearly impressed with the stamp of nationality— that owimr to interchange, imitation, and probably some other causes, there is a far greater resemblance than is generally supposed between the airs of England and Ireland, and also between those of England and Scotland. During the last year " fantasias on Irish airs " have been published by Mr.Wallace (an Irishman) and Mr. Benedict, in each of which one of the motives is " The Minstrel Boy," otherwise " My lodging is on the cold ground." With regard to the nationality of this tune, Mr. W. Chappell tells us that it has been a stock song in England since 1775, and that it was never claimed for Ireland until the beginning of this century, when Thomas Moore included it among his Irish melodies. " I believe," he adds, " there is no ground whatever for calling it Irish. The late Edward Bunting, who was engaged to note down all the airs played by the harpers of the differcnt provinces of Ireland when they were collected together at Belfast in 1792, and who devoted a long life to the collection of Irish music, distinctly assured me that he did not believe it to be Irish, that no one of the harpers played the tune, and that it had no Irish character. I do not think a higher authority as to Irish music could be quoted, or one more tenacious of any infi mgcment upon airs which he considered to be of truly Irish origin. I might add the testimony of Dr. Crotch, Messrs. Ayrton, T. Cook, J. Augustine Wade, and others, both Irish and
English, who have expressed similar opinions to that of Bunting ; but, in fact, there is a total want of evidence, external and internal, of its being an Irish tune. About the same time that Moore claimed it it was printed in Dublin in Clifton's ' British Melodies.' "

http://books.google.com/books?id=04gPAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA594&dq=%22irish+music%22&lr=&as_drrb_is=b&as_minm_is=0&as_miny_is=1850&as_maxm_is=0&as_maxy_is=1865&as_brr=0#v=onepage&q=%22irish%20music%22&f=false