Irish Songs?

[PrettyBoyDonovan]

What are some good songs Irish immigrants serving in either army may have brought over. I'm sick of only knowing Mistrel Boy. I know some other songs (Finnigan's Wake, Rocky Road to Dublin etc.) but don't know if there from the time period or not.

Thanks

[Johan Steele]

Re: Irish Songs?

Black is the Colour, New York Girls, Johhny Jump Up, Bonnie Ship the Diomand and Beggerman are certainly period as they date to well prior to the Civiil War.

There is a songbook of songs sung by the Irish Brigade out there. There was also a very popular Irish song reffing to Pharoh's Army... w/ biblical connotations. Apparently the Brigade started singing iton the March to Gettysburg. I'd love to get my paws on the lyrics as the image of those men singing it on the march... is impressive.

[GWilson]

Re: Irish Songs?

A very good musician that I enjoy is David Kincaid. He has acouple CDs out that are very good and worth the money. If I remember right, the CDs contain a booklet with multiple page full-color booklet including lyrics,and photographs of Irish-American Civil War soldiers, and I'm pretty sure that all the songs are period. I am hoping he will come out with another one soon!!
Here is the website: www.hauntedfieldmusic.com

[dreierjs]

Re: Irish Songs?

Andrew,

I agree with Grant, Mr. Kincaid has done a marvelous job with his two CDs. I heartily recommend them also. The booklet notes of both CDs contain quite a bit of information on the songs, and are a nice little read, esp. the second, "The Irish American's Song."

One of the songs, "Free and Green" on the first CD, "The Irish Volunteer," is a new song, written by David Kincaid and a friend of his. (On a side note...the connection between David Kincaid, this song and a real Captain Taggart in the war is rather amazing.)

I believe that is the only non-period song that is heard on either CD.

[Eric Burke]

Re: Irish Songs?

Most common Home Front songs of the war have Irish origins if you do a simple search or visit some of the more common Folk Song websites out there. Frankly though, Irish songs weren't nearly as common in the field as minstrel music, etc. But I guess, whatever fits your niche.

[Kevin O'Beirne]

Re: Irish Songs?

A lot of discussion can go into answering this post. Fact is, back in the 1860s a lot of folks were writing and publishing music (just like today) and just because you find a dusty songster in a librar somewhere with some kick-butt songs about Irish Brigade heroes marching to battle at Antietam or something doesn't mean that soldiers at the front knew or sang these songs. Some of them may well have been popular somewhere, but did soldiers at the front have them and sing them? It's very difficult to say.

Further, some songs are dated and are inappropriate for most reenacting scenarios. The very popular (today) song, "Paddy's Lamentation" (it's included on the soundtrack to the PBS miniseries, "Long Journey Home: The Irish in America", it's on Kincaid's first CD, and it's on the 2003 release by Gallant Sons of Erin, "No Irish Need Apply" with the alternate title, "Pat in America"), is not correct for reenactors to sing in camp because it talks about how an Irish immigrant wounded in the Irish Brigade has trouble getting an army pension, so that says to me that it's a post-war song. You sure wouldn't want to sing that one, no matter how much you like it, while in camp at an Antietam or Gettysburg event.

Also, something to consider: soldiers certainly sang martial songs, but not always. I have always read that the most popular songs among soldiers were those of home--probably the most popular song in either army during the Civil War was "Home Sweet Home". Singing that one is grossly under-represented in reenactor camps.

For what it's worth, the following is a section from an article I wrote on Irish-American first-person portrayals:
*************
Songs
Irishmen and Civil War soldiers were very fond of singing, so learning a few tunes to sing at the campfire or on the march is an easy way to improve your impression—plus, singing is as fun today as it was in the 1860s. One Irish-American reenactor aptly said to this writer, “We should all make it a point to learn more than, All for Me Grog. How I’ve grown to hate that song!”
Further, evidence suggests that All for Me Grog is not a Civil War-era song.
The array of tunes sung by Irish-Americans in the Civil War is vast and, indeed, a paper much longer than this article can be written on the subject. Songs sung by the original Irish volunteers included sad melodies, patriotic (American) airs as well as tunes longing for Irish independence, “fun” songs, and everything in between. A very limited (although very popular in their day) selection of songs includes the sad The Minstrel Boy. The stirring Garryowen was the unofficial “theme” of the Irish Brigade and was heard in many other Irish regiments as well. Also heard in the Union army’s camps were “rebel songs” about Irish independence including Risin’ of the Moon, A Nation Once Again, The Wearing O’ the Green, and others. Several songs of the day were written specifically about Irish soldiers and an impressive array of them has been collected on David Kincaid’s 1998 compact disk, The Irish Volunteer, including the title song, Pat Murphy of Meagher’s Brigade, and others.
Iishmen of the Civil War were also American soldiers, so singing airs such as The Battle Cry of Freedom and John Brown’s Body while on the march, together with old campfire-standbys such as Home Sweet Home, Just Before the Battle Mother, and others are also good ways to improve your impression.
**********************

Again, before singing a song at the campfire, learn whether it even existed or was popular at that time in the war.

Finally, don't get the idea that Irish-American soldiers in either army were into or sang the same "pub songs" that are so closely associated today with Irish-Americans. While it could be that they were sung in the 1860s and even in the armies, I have never heard or seen any evidence that suggests that modern pub standbys like "Black Velvet Band", "Whiskey in the Jar", and others were popular in Civil War era armies, even though I've seen them on some collections of "Irish music" sold for reenactors.

I want to close by saying I don't know enough about this topic to be anything more than dangerous with it. I'm not a music-historian and music isn't my strong suit, and sure as heck I can't sing very well. :-)

[Gil]

Re: Irish Songs?

As a huge fan of traditional Irish music you could probably do worse than buy an album or two by the Dubliners, you'll find mixed amoung more recent tunes real old time tunes such as "Spancil Hill" , "Sam Hall", "Weila Waile" and a host of other Rebel songs enthusing about Irish independance, I'm sure (although have no evidence at the moment) they would have been well known and popular with the mis-placed Irish Americans and make for fantastic "fighting music" and great for an evenings entertainment if you're lucky enough to have a banjo, bones and whistle player in your Mess.

Gil
1st Tennessee Co E.
LazyJacks Mess

Gil, you must sign all posts with your full name - Mike Chapman

[manevin]

Re: Irish Songs?

There is some great information at www.racw.org. Check out their "links" page. They have links to irish music as well as military music. I also like www.cyberhymnal.org. They have a huge selection of hymns, many of which are found in the "Hymns for the Camp".

Pvt. Michael Nevin
69th NYVI

[County Militia]

Re: Irish Songs?

As others have said, I highly suggest that you purchase Mr. Kincaid's two cd's.

Mel Bay writes song books for just about every subject. I own his Civil War songbook. On the back of the book, it lists his other works. One of the works is Songs of Ireland. The regular CW book is decent, and his Irish one might be worth looking into.

His regular CW songbook has a few Irish tunes, but being I'm a Confederate fiddler, and the songs are obviously Northern, I can't play them in camp.

[Mystical_Piper]

Re: Irish Songs?

me and my company only sing irish songs even though we are the highlanders
there are alot!!!


MysticPiper, you MUST sign your full, real name to each and every post. Generally, posts should contain actual content, as well.

Elizabeth Clark,
Homefront Co-Moderator

[JKfifer119]

Re: Irish Songs?

"Further, some songs are dated and are inappropriate for most reenacting scenarios. The very popular (today) song, "Paddy's Lamentation" (it's included on the soundtrack to the PBS miniseries, "Long Journey Home: The Irish in America", it's on Kincaid's first CD, and it's on the 2003 release by Gallant Sons of Erin, "No Irish Need Apply" with the alternate title, "Pat in America"), is not correct for reenactors to sing in camp because it talks about how an Irish immigrant wounded in the Irish Brigade has trouble getting an army pension, so that says to me that it's a post-war song. "



For there nothing here but war
when the murderin cannons roar
and I wish I was back home
indear old ireland



this is part of the above referenced song....the lyric is clearly written in the present tense. Although it's sentiment may deem it an inappropriate camp song (more likely a song sung on the streets of five points) it does seem to me that its singing about a conflict currently being fought as do other parts. Also the pension reference refers to General Meagher's promise of a pension if you get shot or lose your leg..Meagher resigned his commission After Fredricksburg .. still got a lot of war yet...I don't see this as necessarily a post war song...a protest song perhaps but not necessarily a post war song


thanks
Joe Korber
wandering Irish musician

[Gallant Son]

Re: Irish Songs?

Sorry to weigh in so late on this one. Here is a disclaimer up front: I have a vested interest in recommending the “No Irish Need Apply” CD by The Gallant Sons of Erin. Be that as it may, here is some information that I hope is helpful.

Music is crucial for a proper camp impression. Primary sources, especially letters, indicate that music was prevalent in camp. It wasn’t always good – but it was always present and nearly always appreciated. It appears that in many camps, bands played concerts every evening (when soldiers were in permanent camps.)

I agree with Kevin that the most popular songs were songs of home, lost loves, and other emotional tear jerkers. In his book, Singing The New Nation, Professor E. Lawrence Abel states, “Battle-scarred Johnny Rebs, fresh from the killing fields, preferred tenderhearted songs about homes and the ‘girls they left behind’ to musical flag waiving. . . . Nineteenth-century men, expected to keep their feelings to themselves, were paradoxically free to sing their emotions in public.”

However, there are also many references to soldiers kicking up stirring patriotic and military airs, especially when on the march.

According to one poster at the Mudcat Café Forum, in the book, This Was Andersonville by John McElroy, he refers to the Raiders singing “Brennan on the Moor.” You can find a period broadside of the lyrics at the America Singing website of the Library of Congress. http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/amsshtml/amsshome.html Search for “Brennen on the Moor” with the “e” instead of the “a” in Brennen. This site is an excellent resource for period lyrics. Everyone should browse it liberally.

It is important for a good first person impression to know more than just the songs that you sing around the campfire and on the march. You need to know what was part of the popular culture of the time. Music is a rich source for tapping the pulse of the 1860’s society. So while soldiers may not have sat around the campfire singing “No Irish Need Apply” or “Pat and the Know-Nothings”, they certainly would have been aware of those songs and the sentiments expressed therein.

I mention the following sources:

David Kincaide’s two excellent CD’s “The Irish Volunteer” and “The Irish-American Song” are highly recommended http://www.hauntedfieldmusic.com/

I unabashedly recommend the Gallant Sons of Erin’s “No Irish Need Apply”. We have extensive information on each song and how it interprets the history of the 28th Massachusetts Regiment of the Irish Brigade. Detailed information on each song is available FREE on the web at: http://www.28thmass.com/NINA/NINA.htm
CD info and MP3 samples are available at: http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/gsoe
This CD was just named as the 8th best Celtic theme CD of 2003 by the Celtic Connections radio show.

I also recommend Jerry Ernst”s 4 CD’s. They are more eclectic (not only Irish-American) but his research is excellent and you can rely on every song being certified CW era. You can search for Jerry’s CD’s and hear samples at http://cdbaby.com

Derek Warfield, formerly of the Wolfe Tones is a world-renowned musician. He has 2 Irish-American Civil War theme cd’s out. You have to take care because he readily admits that many of the melodies used are his own composition. Also, many of his selections are CW theme, but are well post-CW era. So, you have to study his material carefully to know what you could use in your impression and what you can’t.

The 69th PA has a CD entitled “Rock of Erin”. They state up front that some of the songs are modern compositions and some more of the “traditional” Irish tunes they include are post war (i.e Roddy McCorley). However, all proceeds go to battlefield preservation! You can access them at CD Baby as well.

Three print sources that are not well known are worth mentioning:
- High-Minded and Low-Down: Music in the Lives of Americans, 1800- 1861 by Nicholas Tawa
-‘Twas Only an Irishman’s Dream: The Image of Ireland and the Irish in American Popular Song Lyrics, 1800-1920 by William H.A Williams
- Songs of Irish Rebellion: Irish Political Street Ballads and Rebel Songs 1780-1900 by Georges Denis Zimmermann (this is newly back in print)

Out of print but an excellent resource if you can get it a library or through interlibrary loan is Robert Wright’s “Irish Emigrant Ballads and Songs” from Bowling Green U. Popular Press, 1975. I found a copy at the University of Vermont.

Enjoy, keep the music alive, and let’s get more guys singing in the March and in camp!

Gallant Son
Mark DeAngelis
28th Mass. Co. K
Columbia Rifles

[Mystical_Piper]

Re: Irish Songs?

i found this web site for you all irish folk songs

http://www.cs.hut.fi/~zaphod/irish/all_titles.html