Civil War Mandolin??

[Shamee]

I was curious about the use of the mandolin in Civil War music. I know it was probably around, I might be wrong. I figured it would be since it is used in Bluegrass. My impression is a private in the Army of Northern VA(1st VA, Company H). Would it be historically accurate to use an Italian pill back mandolin, just in camp. I'm a new reenactor, so any input about use of musical instruments in camp would be greatly appreciated.

Thank-you,

Steven Colagiovanni

[MBBursig]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

I'd be curious about mandolins in general during our period. Alot of the recordings that are made include mandolin i.e. David Kincaid.
I play a modern Fender that is the tear shaped style. (The rounded shape that you think of with a mandolin.) I wouldn't even know where would you get a period 19th Century styled Mando. Specially made probably? I would also assume cat gut strings as well?
I would almost hate to bring it to an event though. Imagine: Hard to carry on the march & mud caked into the tuning pegs. :) Just kidding. Still we should find out about its authenticity.
Cheers,

[K Bartsch]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

I always thought it was Bill Monroe who introduced the mandolin to Blugrass/Mountain music -- if so, that means it's a 20th century development and anachronistic at Civil War period events.

Anyone?

Cordially,

[ferraius]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

I don't think this is the place to be talking about Bill Monroe or Bluegrass music. I don't even know why you would want to play a mandolin at a Civil War event in the first place. Be a man and learn how to play a minstrel banjo or fiddle. There were a lot more or those in the camps than mandolins.

Jon O'Harra

[K Bartsch]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

I don't think this is the place to be talking about Bill Monroe or Bluegrass music. I don't even know why you would want to play a mandolin at a Civil War event in the first place. Be a man and learn how to play a minstrel banjo or fiddle. There were a lot more or those in the camps than mandolins.

Jon O'Harra

Mr O'Harra,
I was merely trying to make the point that in my opinion, mandolins probably shouldn't be played at Civil War events. My mention of Bill Monroe was intended to elicit comment from those more learned than me on the correctness of my belief that Monroe introduced, or at least popularized, the mandolin to American Appalachian folk music during the 20th century. That's all. lighten up.

[dave81276]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

The mandolin certainly existed then. I believe Colagiovanni is only trying to determine what style of mandolin is period-correct. As someone who can only play a radio, I'm only interested from a trivia standpoint. At least he doesn't want to play bagpipes!

-Dave Eggleston

[Possum Skinner]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

Unless you are supposed to be a recent Italian immigrant, playing parlor music, forget the mandolin. The mandolin was NOT an accompaniment instrument for any "popular" music of the day. Although it is a very old European instrument, and certainly existed in the U.S. before and during the war, it was not popularly used and would not be correct, P/E/C, for a Civil War setting.

It was not until the 1880's, with a greater increase of Italian immigrants, that the intrument was very widespread. It was not until the early 1900's that the modern flat-backed mandolin was introduced. It was not until Bill Monroe that the instrument was used in modern bluegrass. In short, there doesn't appear to be any justification, nor have I seen any documentation, that would support a mandolin for use as a correct instrument during the WBTS.

Actually they would be JUST as out of place as bagpipes or even an electric guitar.

Here is a link to some mandolin history :Madonlin Cafe

[ferraius]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

Mr. Bartsch,

I am making the point that this is not the place to run a thread about 20th century American Appalachian mountain music, bluegrass or country-western.
There is nothing worse than hearing some idiot playing a damn steel strung banjo or a mandolin at an event. That is something that is hard to lighten up about.

Jon O'Harra

Jon,

The 'Be Nice' rule is one of the basic rules of this forum. Your posts to Keith are nothing but combative and rude.

You may wish to revisit our rules:

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1034

In the meantime, please consider this your First Warning.

Scott McKay, moderator
Authentic Campaigner Forums

[K Bartsch]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

There is nothing worse than hearing some idiot playing a damn steel strung banjo or a mandolin at an event.

In that sir, we are in agreement, but I would add bagpipes, hammered dulcimers, autoharps, dobros and modern acoustic guitars to the list of banned instruments. :wink_smil

Cordially,

[MBBursig]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

Mr. Colagiovanni, I suppose that we mandolin players will not be bringing our mandolins to an event. As previously stated unless we are representing a member of the "Garibraldis" or an Italian immigrant then it would possibly be correct. As I am only versed in the Celtic renderings for the instrument any attempt at Italian music would be rare for me.
So the mandolin shall yield to authenticity.
I suppose I will stick to the Tin Whistle for events (or I could always learn the fiddle which is very similar to the mandolin depending on the tunings of course). Do not worry sirs I have no aspirations to play the dobro or bring one to an event.

Cheers,

[Old Cremona]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

In that sir, we are in agreement, but I would add bagpipes, hammered dulcimers, autoharps, dobros and modern acoustic guitars to the list of banned instruments. :wink_smil

Cordially,

actually, on the old authentic campaigner website, a lady posted an 1860 picture of a person with a hammered dulcimer.

[Shamee]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

Thank you everyone for your, umm........ spirited posts. I just enjoy playing mandolin and thought it would be fun to play it at an event, I didn't really think about annoying other people. I don't know that much about the instrument except how to play it, it is an instrument I recently picked up. I didn't know about it not being used in bluegrass before Bill Monroe. THanks for all the information. I realize now that it will take more resources than I have access to and more money than I have to make it truly historically correct, and it would have been rare or nonexsistent in the Civil War anyways. I didn't think of the catgut. This would be an interesting topic to research more. If anyone has any more information please add to the post.

Thank you,
Steven Colagiovanni

[Lone_Rebel87]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

I must throw in that the Irish new the mandolin and so many of them fought on both sides in the ACW that I'm sure it was heard with their traditional songs of their beloved Ireland but much reasearch would be needed to know the correct mando to have.
my $.02 worth :)

Jordan Davis

and it was used in bluegrass much before Bill Monroe came along... he just brought it forth not as a simple background intsrument only and showed that it could be played with vigor and have as much to give as a guitar or banjo or fiddle..He just played it different.

[ferraius]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

So sorry Mr. Bartsch for my combative and rude behavior. I will keep my thoughts and comments to myself from now on in this forum. Please accept my appologies. Have a smiley face on me... :wink_smil

Jon O'Harra

[Possum Skinner]

Re: Civil War Mandolin??

Thank you everyone for your, umm........ spirited posts. I just enjoy playing mandolin and thought it would be fun to play it at an event, I didn't really think about annoying other people. I don't know that much about the instrument except how to play it, it is an instrument I recently picked up. I didn't know about it not being used in bluegrass before Bill Monroe. THanks for all the information. I realize now that it will take more resources than I have access to and more money than I have to make it truly historically correct, and it would have been rare or nonexsistent in the Civil War anyways. I didn't think of the catgut. This would be an interesting topic to research more. If anyone has any more information please add to the post.

Thank you,
Steven Colagiovanni

Steven,

Sorry if my post seemed a little "over the top". You said it all when you said "This would be an interesting topic to research more". Why not do a little research on actual period music, then look at what you can play and add to an authentic event. Soldiers loved music, heck, almost everybody loves music. I would probably love to hear your mandolin playing at a bluegrass or Celtic festival, but not at an authentic designed Civil War event. The playing would only annoy in as much as the men at the said authentic event were being assaulted by a sound that would not commonly be heard in 186X.
Gut and horsehair strings were the standard for stringed instruments, and they were often tuned in other keys as well. Period stringed instruments do not generally sound like modern instruments, and the style of playing was often different than modern styles. Someone who listens to modern bluegrass, or even old time clawhammer music, may believe that it is ancient and founded deep in the roots of America, but only its very deep tap roots are there: some of the lyrics and modal designs.
Do some research. There are many venues out there. Make a joyful noise in camps, but do it like they did it. When you start researching some of those very old tunes and folk songs you will be amazed at some of the things you will find.