Sailor or layborer

[Mgreer]

Found this image on Ebay. It was listed as CW sailor. What do you think.



Marvin

[Ross L. Lamoreaux]

Re: Sailor or layborer

Great image either way. Its hard to tell with clarity, but what he's wearing does conform to standard work clothing of a sailor of either navy. Blue flannel shirts were quite common, and the trousers seem to conform as well. Would have loved to see a full length image of him.

[BrandonEnglish]

Re: Sailor or layborer

I have no idea, but could he also be a crew member of a merchant vessel?

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Re: Sailor or layborer

I have no idea, but could he also be a crew member of a merchant vessel?

Crew of Merchant Vessel = Sailor

Heck, even in looking at various enlistment records there seems to be some consternation in the 'period' vernacular for folsk that worked the water. In reviewing the enlistment records for folks from the 26th VA Vol. Regt., I'm reminded of seeing the terms; sailor, waterman, boatman, fisherman tossed around interchangeably all for the same proffession; ie. waterman, which was/is equivacable to what we would consider the proffession of commercial fishing...sigh, but I digress.

Excellent Image!!

Paul B.

[BrandonEnglish]

Re: Sailor or layborer

Crew of Merchant Vessel = Sailor

It was listed as CW sailor.

I think it's a safe assumption that its a reference to US or CS Navy Sailor.

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

Re: Sailor or layborer

I think it's a safe assumption that its a reference to US or CS Navy Sailor.

Assume US or CS...why?? While I didn't see the original auction, all we have to go on is the description Mr. Greer provided which is said to be the description from the auction...CW Sailor.

From the image, there doesn't appear to be any direct Uniform conitations for the Navy (US or CS), and the question posed by Mr. Greer is as to whether or not one could even go as far as to clarify that it's a water-based impression and not equally possible for it to be a good laborers impression.

I think it's a great image, and certainly invokes an image of what many would presume to be of Martial Nautical nature (open light blue flannel shirt, long black/blue 'silk' scarf, dark blue trousers), but these are also very 'common' features of work clothes of the period.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, but just trying to clarify, what leads us to certain conclusions when reviewing images like this.

Did anyone notice something that appears to be under the blue flannel shirt, I cannot tell if it's a foreign object to the image, a shirt, or possibly some time of rope...thoughts??

Paul B.

[Ian McWherter]

Re: Sailor or layborer

I see nothing here to qualify that this is a Civil War sailor. He is simply wearing a baggy blue wool flannel overshirt with a loosely tied cravat, probably made from silk. There are dozens of photographs of California Gold Miners dressed in exactly the same way. Are they all sailors too? Well, they did have to take a boat out. I think the ebay seller would be better served trying to pawn this image off as California Gold Rush than Civil War sailor. It would be harder to dismiss. I can't tell you how many images I've seen on ebay that are clearly Gold Rush that are sold as "early war Confederate in Battleshirt," or "man wearing Civil War Guerrilla shirt." With those tags the auctions go wild.

The object underneath his shirt is probably his undershirt which could be unbuttoned at the placket.

[ferraius]

Re: Sailor or layborer

And if you hallucinate hard enough you can juuuss make out his peg leg under those dark blue trousers of his!

[Elaine Kessinger]

Re: Sailor or layborer

To me it looks as if the shirt body might be pleated into a yoke at the shoulder in the manner of the Kentucky State Guard Fatigue Coat, pg. 15 of the MOC Uniform Catolgue. (there's a picture in EofG too, but mine's AWOL at the moment). I accept that it might be my eyes playing tricks, but to me there looks to be distinct wide pleats meeting a smooth shoulder-line.

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: Sailor or layborer

The object underneath his shirt is probably his undershirt which could be unbuttoned at the placket.

And I saw it as a cord for a marlinspike or a rigging knife.

[Ian McWherter]

Re: Sailor or layborer

And I saw it as a cord for a marlinspike or a rigging knife.

Well if you're already convinced he's a sailor then you're probably going to find things in this image that justifies your belief. I'm not convinced he's even a sailor, the collar on his shirt has nautical styling, but that doesn't mean he's a sailor. Just look at the "sailor shirt" this would be miner is wearing:



Now, should we make up a story about how he was a sailor who jumped ship and headed off to the mines, but before he did he had this picture taken? Or should we stick with what we know, which is to say very little. "Sailor" clothing was popular among Gold Miners, I have transcriptions of original store inventories that list Naval Monkey jackets, shirts and other nautical gear for sale all over the Gold Country. So just because someone is wearing seafaring clothes doesn't make him a sailor. Love the label on the shovel.

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: Sailor or layborer

I'm no more convinced that its a cord than you are a placket. I can think of few things from the period that were suspended by a cord around the neck, rigging tools being two of them.