rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

[ohio volunteer]

I've been told by other reenactors and several Museums as well, that sometimes soldiers would not return their rammers, instead just throwing them into the ground. Has anyone seen any evidence to document this practice? Or is it just an “assumed” reenactorism? I have read accounts of soldiers laying out their cartridges behind breastworks in preparation for an attack, moving their cartridge boxes to the front..etc, but not anything on rammers thrown into the ground.

Again, I am looking for specific documentation: pictures, archaeological data, or written accounts, not mere speculations or personal opinion, please.
Thanks,

[Chad Wrinn]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

During the Battle of Jonesville,VA January 1864 the Federals praticed this but it did not work out for them, when the Confederates charged they left them in the ground and were not able to fire any more thus forceing them to surrender fo flee.

[Pritchett Ball]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Battle of Kennesaw Mountain…

“Simply a slaughter. It was really sickening to see those brave fellows struggling up that valley. Our infantry did not return their rammers as usual, after loading, but stuck them in the ground and snatched them up when wanted, to save time. No troops could stand such a concentrated fire long”
1st Lt. Joseph Boyce, of Co. D, 1st/4th Missouri, CSA.


Kevin Dally

[ohio volunteer]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Chad, do you have a source where you read that? I would be interested to find out.

[Gallo de Cielo]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Cleburne trained his men on many things, one being rate of fire and accuracy. One technique was stabbing the threaded end of the rammer in the ground rather than returning it to save time.

It's been a while since I've read it but "This Band of Heroes: Granbury's Texas Brigade" details this (if my memory is correct).

I have done this at a few events and it works well.

My two cents,

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Was there not a "line of rammers" found at (I think) Pickets Mill some years ago?

[csabugler]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

I have been out to the NSSA for as long as I have been mounted, 9 years or so. But back when I shot in competion for speed and accuracy it was virtually unheard of as I recall to return rammers. Either stuck threaded end into the ground, or more commonly, stab your bayonett into the ground and typically slide the rammer into the barrell port. Granted that is modern, and does not offer period documentation. But it works.
IMHO

[Chad Wrinn]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Jacob,
I remember reading it somewhere in a book, but I was talking to a couple of folks that have been on the battlefield years ago and they said that they found rows rammers still stuck in the ground.

[Andrew Kasmar]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Hi,

While not exactly what you are looking for, here is a interesting quote from the book The Civil War Infantryman by Gregoy A. Coco (page 75).

To prevent fouling of the bore when consuming large amounts of cartridges in combat, a group of the 37th Mississippians found a clever solution. PVT Washington B. Crumpton explained how they began using Yankee cartridges that were "two calibes" smaller than their weapons: "We abndoned the slow method of drawing the rammer to load. We tore open the cartridge placed it in the muzzel, stamped the breech butt on the ground; the weight of the bullet carried the cartridge home, so we only had to cap and fire. It was almost like a repeating rifle"


Andrew

[Jimmayo]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

I don't want to hi-jack this thread but since undersize ammunition has been mentioned here is a link to a related subject on CS ammunition that recently appeared on the NSSA forum. I think it is worth a read.

http://www.n-ssa.net/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=11656

For what it's worth, I have heard of people finding rammers still stuck in the ground. I found one however it was stuck in the ground for the entire length with the tulip about an inch under the leaf mulch. Must have been hard for the soldier to draw that one out to fire. It was on the CS pickett line at Five Forks. About a foot away was a Springfield bayonet pushed down the same way until the socket was ground level. I guess the boys were playing while Pickett was eating fish.

[Phelps' Reg't]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

A U.S. Regular who fought in the Ray Cornfield at Wilson's Creek had this to say about the fighting on August 10, 1861: "Quarrels broke out among the men, for those in front complained that their cheeks were singed by the fire of their companions in the rear rank; and ramrods which had been left on the ground for convenience were taken up by others and not promptly returned."

Jeff Patrick

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Hallo!

Moderator hat on...

Lads, please keep this documented and "Period."

Meaning, no modern N-SSA competitive stuff.

And please read what you post.

"...I remember reading it somewhere in a book, but I was talking to a couple of folks that have been on the battlefield years ago and they said that they found rows rammers still stuck in the ground."

I have been to over 30 CW battlefields and have yet to find rows of ramrods still standing. Could be just me...

;) :)

Curt
17 Year member of the N-SSA who used his bayonet for a ramrod rest Mess

[Chad Wrinn]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Well Mr. Schmidt I guess you need to vist a couple more and look a little harder. I'm sure you've seen every square inch of those battlefields too. The Jonesville site has been private property since before the war and Uncle Sam has not got a hold of it yet to tear it apart. Sorry my post was farby I forgot how to read after a typed it thanks for reading it to me.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Hallo!

"Well Mr. Schmidt I guess you need to vist a couple more and look a little harder. I'm sure you've seen every square inch of those battlefields too. The Jonesville site has been private property since before the war and Uncle Sam has not got a hold of it yet to tear it apart. Sorry my post was farby I forgot how to read after a typed it thanks for reading it to me"

In communication there is:

1: What one thought they said
2. What others thought they said
3. What they actually said

I guess I do need to look at those battlefields a little harder as I have missed the ramrods sticking up in the air out of the ground for all these years where they were left during those battles.

;) :)

I did not say your post was "farby."

Curt

[ohio volunteer]

Re: rammers thrown in ground and not returned during firing

Back to the topic, Has anyone any evidence rather than just hearsay and the myth of rows of ramrods being found stuck in the ground on battlefields?