Gilham's or Hardee's.

[Limey]

Hi,

I am doing research on the 37th NC Inf. Does anybody know or have an idea as to which drill they would have used. I would guess they were trained with Revised Hardee's early in the war but when they became part of Hill's Division, Jackson's Corp would they have change to Gilham's?

Thanks,
John English

[markj]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

Hi,

I would strongly suggest you stick with Hardee's revised manual in the absence of specific evidence to the contrary. Geoff Walden did a two-part article in "Camp Chase Gazette" some years ago (around 1996), looking into this question, and came to the informed conclusion that, from roughly 1862 onward, "Hardee" was pretty much the standard for CS units in both East and West.

I did look on the National Archives website to see if any 37th NCT regimental order books have survived but it appears they have not. You may want to consult the "Official Records" and "Supplement to the Official Records" since these may contain documentation regarding what drill system was used. I got lucky when I looked through the 32nd Tennessee (AoT) books: I found two special orders from early 1863 specifically stating that "Hardee's tactics" were to be used by that regiment.

If all else fails, you could also check documentation pertaining to units that were brigaded with the 37th NCT and this may provide you an answer.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Tom Ezell]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

I am doing research on the 37th NC Inf. Does anybody know or have an idea as to which drill they would have used. I would guess they were trained with Revised Hardee's early in the war but when they became part of Hill's Division, Jackson's Corp would they have change to Gilham's?

Gilham's is not a drill manual per se, but rather an officer's all-in-one handbook aimed at the newly-commissioned or more-socially-than-tactically-adept militia/volunteer officer who has to get up to speed in a hurry. If you'll notice, it has a lot of stuff, from routine admin how-to-run-a-company stuff, the basic of drill for the three combat arms, up to the basics of military justice and courts martial. If you could only have one book in your tail pocket or haversack, this was designed to be a good choice.

Gilham's "drill" is really Hardee's, anyway, save for the odd chapter on the old muskets where he lifts the School of the Soldier from Scott's tactics...

Tom

[CaptainUCSB]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

Can you please post that article from Camp Chase Gazette?

[Dignann]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

John,

Searching for information about what manual a specific Confederate regiment used is like looking for the proverbial needle in the haystack, if that needle even exists.

I offer this information. The 37th NC was a part of the Branch/Lane Brigade, along with the 7th, 18th, 28th and 33rd NC. There is a copy of William Gilham's Manual of Instruction for the Volunteers and Militia of the Confederate States... (Richmond, 1862) owned by the Tennessee State Library and Archives that belonged to John Cain of the 18th North Carolina. Also, the Library of Virginia has a copy of the Richmond 1861 edition of Gilham that bears the following inscription:

"Ives Smedes
Raleigh N.C.
Apl. 15th 1863.
Adjutant 7th Regiment N.C.T."

On the endpapers of Smedes copy are a variety of sketches and diagrams depicting movements and maneuvers.

From this, one can draw the conclusion that Gilham was being used within the brigade. However, does that mean for School of the Soldier they were using the manual for the musket, or manual for the rifle? I'm not sure that can be answered, to anyone's satisfaction.

Good luck with your research.

Eric

[VMI88]

VMI Use of Gilham's

I recently ran across a satement by Virginia Military Institute Cadet Beverly Stanard (killed in action at New Market). He wrote home on April 14, 1863, "We have abandoned the old drill and begun a new one (Hardie) which I much prefer."

The old drill is presumably Gilham's. I find this interesting since Col. Gilham was still Commandant of Cadets at the time. I wonder if there was some official directive that Hardee's serve as the official manual? Or at least a recognition that most of the army was using Hardee's?

Our unit uses Gilham's, but this statement makes me question its use after the first two years of the War.

[Dignann]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

Bil,

VMI did switch over the Hardee, but it was not the Goetzel revised editon. They chose a Richmond reprint of an older edition entitled Rifle and Light Infantry Tactics; for the exercise and maoeuvers of troops when acting as light infantry or riflemen. Prepared under the direction of the War Department, by Brevet Lieut.-Col. W.J. Hardee (Richmond, Va.: J.W. Randolph, 1861).

From what I can tell, VMI's decision to switch to Hardee was based on their supplier's inability to get Gilham. VMI purchased its textbooks from James Woodhouse & Co. in Richmond. In a letter dated February 1863, Woodhouse wrote to VMI informing them he was sending them Hardee and that he was having difficulty procurring Gilham. This is odd since Gilham appears in 1863 newspapers advertisements for Richmond booksellers. The letter from Woodhouse is in Gilham's file at VMI.

Eric

[markj]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

For Pat Furey:

I've got the Walden articles at home (he sent them to me) but, in the meantime, here are links to on-line items by Geoff that might be of interest to you. In fact, I think they're pretty much identical to what Geoff sent me:

http://216.247.222.222/vpp/ccg/manualarms_1.htm

http://216.247.222.222/vpp/ccg/manualarms_2.htm

As always, you be the judge.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Dignann]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

John,

Here's another piece of info on manual use in Lane's Brigade. The most recent catalog from Historical Collectible Auctions contains a manual id'd to an officer in the 33rd N.C. The manual is:

Rifle and Light Infantry Tactics; for the exercise and maoeuvers of troops when acting as light infantry or riflemen. Prepared under the direction of the War Department, by Brevet Lieut.-Col. W.J. Hardee (Richmond, Va.: J.W. Randolph, 1861).

The pencil inscription on the fly-leaf reads:

"Camp near Chaffins Bluff
July 16, 1864
Capt. W.J. Callais
Co. G, 33'd N.C.
Lane's Brig.
Light Div.
A.N.Va."

This edition is not the revised Hardee's, but is a CS reprint of the pre-war version of the manual.

Eric

[chaplain]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

This is a great discussion! I love the responses! I have been on a quest for a similar answer; only, I am interested in VA Regts. Here is a link to a well documented article. The author concludes that Gilham's is historically correct for those portraying the ANV: http://www.1stregiment.org/library11.htm

[ndnchf]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

Limey,

Have you read Michael Hardy's book on the 37th NCT? I have, but can't recall if a drill manual was mentioned. It would be interesting to know. My GG Grandfather was Sgt. Willam H. Harrison, Co. C, 37th NCT. Good luck with your search.

[Silas]

Re: Gilham's or Hardee's.

Umm, you realize this thread sank to the bottom years ago until recently revived. I don't think Limey is going to notice your post. He joined this forum in February, 2004, and hasn't been signed into his account since October, 2006. His total post count is one. His solitary post is the one which commenced this thread back in 2004.