Where to Wear Your Haversack & Canteen?

[BrettKIllinois]

Re: Two Haversacks?

I know that the men of the 55th IL XV Corps often mention using their pockets, to carry personal effects this around the Atlanta Campaign / Sherman's March, they reflected on keeping not only ammunition but personal effects in their pockets.

[BrettKIllinois]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Which makes sense, the records and rolls the company/battalion/regimental clerk would be forced to carry for the Adjutant or commander would be considerable, and not something I'd leave for the teamsters to bring up with the wagons if there were wagons there at all. I'd be interested in hearing the accounts of all of this.

What kind of personal effects did you have in mind, exactly?

I seem to recall that there have been accounts shared of company clerks carrying an extra haversack for the company paperwork.

[Rob]

Re: Two Haversacks?

I seem to recall that there have been accounts shared of company clerks carrying an extra haversack for the company paperwork.

I do not have any original references at the moment, but I've been doing this for as long as I've been doing clerk-work. Papers, pens, traveleing inkwell, and reading glasses fit nicely, and they're protected from the weather as well.

A dispatch case would be nicer, but... what is the likelihood that a common soldier would have had one?

[CJDaley]

Two Union Haversacks Article

The subject of this thread reminded me of an article entitled Two Union Haversacks by Robert Miller in the Military Collector & Historian Journal, Vol IV, No 4, December 1952

I don't know what collection these bags are in now, but it would be cool to see the one with the inner bag as those are pretty rare.

[Alamo Guard]

Re: Two Haversacks?

I have read where men had the "opportunity" to get extra rations for one reason or another. They talked about even filling their hats with liquids so why If the situation calls for it, why not? On the other hand If they are on short rations, just eat the crumbs out of bottom and curse the quartermaster as always.
Bottom line is see what the game plan calls for. If you the 20th Alabama at Vicksburg for example, why would you have 2 haversacks? But if you were the 15th Alabama in Penn., it might be another story. Just use common sense and do not farb out.

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Elsewhere on this forum, under Camp of Instruction, Research Papers, you will find "the School of the Clerk," which contains most of what I've been able to dig up about military administration. I haven't yet found a reference to two haversacks, though in the past I've used a second one for company records and writing materials. I've since gone, for a company clerk impression, to carrying a portfolio and other papers in my knapsack, and a writing kit in my regular haversack, which actually is documented.

Last year I came across (Andersen, Mary Ann, ed.) The Civil War Diary of Allen Morgan Geer, which has the following eye-opening entry for May 11, 1863, from Utica MS. Geer was acting as orderly at the time:

"Marched at 10 A.M. 3 miles and camped on the left of the road in a fine grove. Here we took a rest. I posted up Co. C’s books & morning reports for the last 10 days."

What's astonishing about this entry is that he's working with the company's books, which he could not have carried on him. This would mean that the wagons were near, and that would mean that when Grant crossed the Mississippi and cut himself off from his lines of supply taking only the most essential stores with him, those most essential stores included the army's paperwork.

It was well that Geer brought the books up to date. The following day he was wounded in the battle of Raymond and would not rejoin his company for a month.

But back to the question. The odds of a Union soldier having two haversacks if he wanted them, would not be insurmountable. They wore out quickly, but over the course of the war the QM Department procured some 4.6 million. While officially classified as "Camp and Garrison Equipage" and thus company property, I've seen haversacks and knapsacks listed in the "Inventory of Effects" of deceased soldiers, which would make them available to be auctioned off with other personal effects on the soldier's death.

[MuddyWaterMess]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Im not trying to "FARB" out was just curious becasue small things can make or brake and impression and dont want to make that mistake. Was just curious and i do appreciate everyones input. Have to say this is a KILLER forum and i am glad to be part of it.

Ben

[DougCooper]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Each soldier was issued one and only one haversack. I suppose you could scrounge another from home or off the battlefield, but an extra single strap haversack on your shoulder is trumped in comfort by instead carrying extra stuff in a knapsack or blanket roll, IMHO.

[AZReenactor]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Ben,
I'm still curious what items you are thinking of carrying that might necessitate a second haversack. While it certainly isn't unimaginable that someone might have toted two haversacks in unique circumstances, certainly most soldiers had no need or use for two haversacks. beyond just carrying an extra foodbag as a man purse, what is the bigger picture? What are you needing to carry?

Im not trying to "FARB" out was just curious becasue small things can make or brake and impression and dont want to make that mistake. Was just curious and i do appreciate everyones input. Have to say this is a KILLER forum and i am glad to be part of it.

Ben

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Hallo!

These prisoners said that might need some extree in that Yankee prison camp...


Curt

[1stMaine]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Comrades,

The only documented use of two haversacks that I can vouch for is by Confederate Ambulance Corps personell. The second haversack, along with a seond canteen and cup, was designed to carry items for the wounded. These included 4 bandages, a tourniquet, 2 large and 2 small splints, a tin cup and a pint of "alcoholic stimulant". The entire passage relating to these may be found in Todd's Military equipage.

So, in this case, the enlisted man would've had two haversacks, but iddued for different purposes. One for food, one for the tools of his trade.

There are also spotty accounts of Federal Ambulance Corps personell, as well as men detailed to assist the surgeon at Field Dressing Stations of being issued similar, but oversized, white haversacks for similar uses as their Confederate counterparts.

Respects,

[Fahlem]

Re: Two Haversacks?

Shortly after the battle of Chancellorsville, Co. F, 1st USSS took a detailed inventory of all issued property in the hands of the 47 enlisted men presnt in the ranks. This was a very detailed report, matching names with a list of columns heading the sheet, marking each name with a check for whatever gear was present upon each person. This included not only the "common" stuff we all consider the norm, but screwdrivers, bore wipes, crossbelt plates, etc....like I said, very detailed. With regards to the haversacks, most on hand only had one haversack marked, but a few, & it seems to be those on detached service or in the hospital, had several...one even having as many as five. I am currently at work, so I don't have the excat numbers in front of me, but it was very interesting to say the least. However, I would not advocate carrying more than one in the ranks. Two? Maybe if you where the only one in the compnay, but beyond that, it gets way out of hand in my humble opinion. By the way, these records reside at the University of Michigan.

Michael Fahle
Co. F, 2nd USSS

[drytortilla]

Re: Two Haversacks?

I've never read a first-hand account of carrying two haversacks but I have read of finding haversacks strewn about after a battle. It seems reasonable that some would have been picked up and carried off. Quien Sabe?
Rodney W. Nance
Live Oak County, Texas

[Rebel Yell1863]

Re: Two Haversacks?

There are some sketches that Alfred Waud drew at Appomattox, VA April 9th 1865, that show Confederate soldiers with TWO haversacks. As to what's in them, it would be conjecture on my part...:D

[Rob Weaver]

Re: Two Haversacks?

There is a quote in Gordon Rhea's book, "The Battle of the Wilderness," which is a list of recommendations from one soldier to another. Included in that list, paraphrased, are an extra blanket, an extra haversack and all the food you can find. I don't own the book, so I can't give you a full citation, but it's in the first quarter of text, IIRC. I believe the recommendation was also from an artilleryman. If so, it's from someone who could ride to war instead of walking, and maybe carry the extra gear more easily. Also, a recommendation isn't exactly proof that someone took him up on his suggestion. When I was in my hardcorest days, I carried a horsecollar, but didn't like the way my personal gear rolled up in it. Too much stuff for a tight roll, but not enough to carry in my pockets without wrecking them. Also, I found it annoying that when I spread out my blanket to sleep, my carefully hoarded personal belongings were in a little puddle next to me. I couldn't afford a pack, but I did already own an extra haversack. It went into use for that purpose, and worked pretty well. I felt justified after finding the abovementioned citation. At this point, I carry a pack, so it's unnecessary, but I keep my original candle stove and sundries to use it therein. It's a bulky shape that I don't carry often, but when I do, I really don't want to ruin it by bending it out of shape (although it's a good bit sturdier than most of the repro tinware I own).