Where to Wear Your Haversack & Canteen?

[John E. Tobey]

Re: Shortening Straps

Howdy all,

Although it's tough to say that modifications to surviving artifacts were done during the war, I have seen plenty of canteens with knotted straps that I believe were done during the war. If memory serves me correctly, the one pictured that's in the Gettysburg collection actually has a tag written by the soldier telling how he knotted the strap before some particular battle. I've included a close-up of another original canteen strap that was has a wartime knot in it. FWIW, we should also separate infantry-used canteens from cav-used canteens. I don't know how cav guys carried their canteens, but I've seen a fair number of original canteens with a cav provenance that have straps knotted up really short. At any rate, maybe some of the boyscouts on this board can identify the knot.

Haversacks are another matter. There's not that many original haversacks to look at, and the original straps were made pretty short to begin with. Some original straps that appear to have been field-modified are really repairs made after being broken by someone after the war. Nonetheless, I've included a photo of an original shortened haversack strap. Not sure why the soldier did this, since it only shortened the strap by maybe 1-1/2". It's folded and sewn.

John Tobey

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: Shortening Straps

Being that I am relatively thin and short, I shortened my traps from the correct original length, by cutting the strap with a knife and then tied the sling with a square knot. I find that having my haversack top at about even with the top of my belt is the most comfortable for me.

[10TnVI]

Re: Shortening Straps

This thread has drifted a bit-so back to the matter at hand-
Jason-your overthinking the problem. It doesn't really matter where you position your strap splice. The original regs don't address it and surviving artifacts don't appear to show a preference. Logic would dictated moving it away from any place like the shoulder where it might cause irratation. Easiest way would seem to be to position it under the lower sling loop on your canteen. If it's an issue-With your typical Fed canteen the strap is easily moved and thus can be positioned anyway the controling officials think is correct. I assume CS canteens will behave the same way.

Pards,
I am in the process of shortening my slings and making my traps ride higher. My question is how, or rather where, is the best place to cut the canteen strap to re-sew it? Is this a personal prefernce thing? I had intended to cut mine and sew it back together where the re-sewn piece would be at my back.

[theknapsack]

Re: Shortening Straps

Being that I am relatively thin and short, I shortened my traps from the correct original length, by cutting the strap with a knife and then tied the sling with a square knot. I find that having my haversack top at about even with the top of my belt is the most comfortable for me.

There is a canteen on Page 198 of EOG: Union that is doe that way. Not in one place but in two. It is also sewn in two different places. I did my canteen strap (which is correct) the same way Mr. Johnson did. My haversack I did like the picture attached by Mr. Tobey. They ride around the area of my belt. The Canteen at the bottom of page 206 (owned by Private Wm. Peck, 27th Conn.) of the same book is sewn in three different places (2 are easily seen, the third is halfway under the right keeper), and another (a fourth) looks like a field modification.

[Yellowhammer]

Re: Shortening Straps

"Since many units frown on tying your strap..."

What units are these and what is their documentation for enforcing this "rule?"

There is a wonderful id'd Federal canteen on display in the Gettysburg visitor center that not only has a knotted sling, but a note about when the soldier knotted the sling. If I remember correctly, he looped a quick knot in his canteen as he went into action at Sayler's Creek.

As other posters have said, the vast majority of the original canteen straps I've seen were either intact or knotted rather than sewn.

[gdarrell]

Re: Shortening Straps

John,

It is not clear, where on the canteen strap is that knot tied? Based on your post, I'm assuming it is not at the middle/centered (top of the shoulder) section of the strap. Is it close to the canteen or higher up on the strap?

As a former "Boy Scout", it looks like a simple "overhand knot" lol.

[Kevin O'Beirne]

Re: Shortening Straps

My advice is to employ some common sense on top of the learned posts here discussing artifacts. If you elect to "knot" your canteen sling, just put the knot someplace where it's not a nuisance. My Federal canteen with a cotton sling is knotted, and I put the knot near the canteen body, and I wear the canteen so the knot is in the back. That's my preference.

Not (or knot?) only have I seen several artifacts with knotted slings, but there's also plenty of first-person accounts of guys going into battles with knotted slings. For some reason one that stands out in my mind is included in the Gettysburg chapter of Haggerty's history of Collis's Zouaves (114th Pa.), and that's just one example.

If you purchase a haversack from an "authentic" vendor, you shouldn't have to shorten the thing n the first place. To echo John Tobey, the originals have short straps and so should the repros if they're done with attention to detail. Canteen slings, however, were 72 inches long, and that's too long for almost any "thin" guy unless you're as tall as Lurch in the Adam's Family. Cutting and sewing is one way, but in my case I just "knotted" it because it was the easiest, most expedient way to do it, and the knot has remained in place for about 6 or 7 years so far.

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: Shortening Straps

If you purchase a haversack from an "authentic" vendor, you shouldn't have to shorten the thing n the first place. To echo John Tobey, the originals have short straps and so should the repros if they're done with attention to detail. Cutting and sewing is one way, but in my case I just "knotted" it because it was the easiest, most expedient way to do it, and the knot has remained in place for about 6 or 7 years so far.

Mr O'Beirne and Mr Tobey are 100% correct, but like I stated before, even with a correct lenght sling some people may need to shorten the straps. I am 5'9" and have a size 38 chest, so it was nessisary to shorten my straps about 2-3 inches to make it comfortable height.

So if you do need to shorten your correct lenght strap, tieing a squareknot makes allot more sence that sewing the sling. A knot takes seconds to do, and is allot stronger that a sewn joint. Sewing a sling takes quite a bit of time and is murder on the fingers.

[markj]

Re: Shortening Straps

Greetings,

With the above comments, read what the "United States Army & Navy Journal" had to say in a November 1863 article:

"The bulging double-convex shape of the canteen prevents it from being worn in the regulation style, "on the left side, outside the haversack," especially when the latter is crammed with rations."

Here's my point: I guess the fact that many seem to overlook when they're fixing their canteen straps is that they're adjusting them to fit over an invariably less-than-full (or even empty) haversack. Try filling your haversack to the bursting point--what you'd see after stuffing several days' rations in it--and THEN try adjusting your canteen strap accordingly. You might notice a significant difference--maybe even shift your canteen to the opposite side to balance things out and be more comfortable.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Jefferson Guards]

Re: Shortening Straps

I usually put my canteen on after all my other equipment is in place (including knapsack or blanket roll) this allows me to gain easy access to it without having to take things off. This requires the canteen strap to be a little longer than the haversack strap in order for it to go over the equipment and still sit in a comfortable position.

[John E. Tobey]

Re: Shortening Straps

John,

It is not clear, where on the canteen strap is that knot tied? Based on your post, I'm assuming it is not at the middle/centered (top of the shoulder) section of the strap. Is it close to the canteen or higher up on the strap?

As a former "Boy Scout", it looks like a simple "overhand knot" lol.

The knot is about 12" away from the canteen, but that measurement probably means doodley, because the strap could have have changed position in the loops after the knot was made.

After this thread got going, I went looking for a quote I thought might apply. I finally found it...

The following is excerpted from the Company Order Book of Company B, 156th NY infantry, the entry is dated November 12, 1864:

"...officers and men are further reminded that they are not allowed to alter government property...violations have been noted [particularly] in the case of equipments and shelter tents..."

I think this re-illustrates another consideration for this topic. Canteens and haversacks were "on loan" from the government (Federal at least...I'm not sure about the Confederate system) and not the property of the soldier. Permanent alterations to equipments were prohibited, officially at least as well as in particular commands. This may be a reason for a fondness for temporary alterations like knots or fold-and-sew mods.

John Tobey

[markj]

Re: Shortening Straps

The knot is about 12" away from the canteen, but that measurement probably means doodley, because the strap could have have changed position in the loops after the knot was made.

After this thread got going, I went looking for a quote I thought might apply. I finally found it...

The following is excerpted from the Company Order Book of Company B, 156th NY infantry, the entry is dated November 12, 1864:

"...officers and men are further reminded that they are not allowed to alter government property...violations have been noted [particularly] in the case of equipments and shelter tents..."

I think this re-illustrates another consideration for this topic. Canteens and haversacks were "on loan" from the government (Federal at least...I'm not sure about the Confederate system) and not the property of the soldier. Permanent alterations to equipments were prohibited, officially at least as well as in particular commands. This may be a reason for a fondness for temporary alterations like knots or fold-and-sew mods.

John Tobey

Greetings John,

I can do you one better. Check this out:

(Extract from regimental order book of the 68th Indiana Volunteer Infantry, NARA RG 94).

Head Quarters 68th Ind[ian]a Inf[antr]y
Camp Dumont Indianapolis Nov 10th 1862

General Order
No 16

I. Painting or marking of any kind upon tents without the permission of the commanding officer is forbidden. No painting or marking whatever will be put upon arms, and no painting or marking upon Knap-sacks, haver-sacks, or canteens except in accordance with regulations.
****

By Order of
Edward A. King
Col Comdg 68th Ind Infy

King was subsequently promoted to brigade command but, I'm sorry to say, he "bought the farm" at Chickamauga.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Gerkin]

Federal Haversack Questions

Gentlemen,

I am trying to make a haversack for myself, and I am stumbling across some trouble. First, where can I get the leather for the buckles? Will I have to dye it myself? Second, does anyone have the recipe/instructions for the painted finish? Thank you all for your time.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Federal Haversack Questions

Hallo Kamerad!

Forgetting about the SEARCH feature for these commonly found questions?

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2530&highlight=Haversack+paint

Local or On-line leather sellers and shops carry "oak-tanned" leather. Yes, the leather needs dyed black, preferrably with a period method. Some blackpowder shops, local and on-line sell it dyed black with modern dye.

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt

[Gerkin]

Re: Federal Haversack Questions

Mr. Schmidt,

Thank you. I had used the search function, and found that recipe, but I was not sure if it was for a Federal haversack, as all it said was "tarred". Thank you for your time though. And one more question, what weight of leather would I need?

Thank you very much.