Where to Wear Your Haversack & Canteen?

[tenfed1861]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

I own a Wiley haversack and I think it's beautiful.I don't see why he can't sell it at that price.
Cullen Smith

[MontReb]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

CS single bag is a sweetie too, (a CS copy of the US Mex-War bag). He does use a latex based paint, and will tell you that up front.

[Richmond Depot]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

Is the use of a modern laytex paint acceptable for items sold by an approved vendor on this board? I would expect the items to feature a correct finish and not a modern substitute.

[hardtack1864]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

He was listed on approved vendors, but he's not there anymore, though he was listed as having great leathers, nothing about his other items. Also, apart from the latex paint, his stuff seems really good.

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

Is the use of a modern laytex paint acceptable for items sold by an approved vendor on this board? I would expect the items to feature a correct finish and not a modern substitute.

Unfortunately, even from approved vendors, the vast majority of "painted cloth" available is a modern facimile.

The reason the "Wiley" haversack is so inexpensive is that it is a simple design and it is 100% machine sewn. The reason why a number of other reproduced haversacks are more expensive is due to the amount of handsewing involved.

[bonniegreenflag]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

Thanks for the info guys, I guess I will have to spend the $95.00 for a ************ haversack. That is the one with the correct paint isn't it? I suppose I should have never considered anything else, but getting an authentic haversack for $29.00 was too good to not investigate. Money is hard to get! :tounge_sm Im trying to get a good haversack for Cedar Creek, and I suppose I will post a new post in the WTB area. Unless the mods would move this post for me?

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

Andrew has found what he wants, the original question has been answered so I will beat a dead horse here...latex paint = plastic.

[Agate]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

Latex is the protective fluid contained in tissue beneath the bark of the rubber tree, Hevea brasiliensis.

The problem with "latex paint" is that most modern paints, both water based and oil based contain polyurethane, as noted.

Rubber was applied to cloth commercially in the 19th century before the discovery of vulcanization. Done by dissolving natural rubber in Naptha to make a paint. The first painted cloths would have been of limited use as one can imagine, the stuff took forever to cure. Other goods of this material were manufactured as well. Rubber waterproof shoes were made by "painting" this material onto a glass form and allowing to cure.

In the 1830s this problem was partially solved by the discovery of the addition of sulfur to the paint in order to speed up the curing process.

It was the 1840s and the discovery by Goodyear of vulcanization, that changed the practical use of rubberized cloth for commercial purposes.

BTW, in the 19th Century, as today, "French" talc was used as an agent to keep vulcanized rubber cloths from sticking together. French talc is modern talcum powder, and is the reason why modern vulcanized cloth has a somewhat "white" cast to it. During the period imported French talc may very well have been expensive, at least to an Army contractor, and my question is if manufacturers of Army goods made of vulcanized cloth substituted a cheaper agent, such as an oil for the purpose.

In the hobby, for years there has been the notion of a 19th Century paint made of rubber, and utilized for "painted" cloth, and so expressed by some. If correct, this paint would have been rubber dissolved in Naphtha (lighter fluid) or maybe turpentine. Modern water based latex paint this is not.

The question we must then ask is threefold:

Was water based paint used at all during the period?

By the time of the Civil War, what uses, if any, would there have been for material coated with raw rubber, a cloth that is, that wasn't vulcanized? Was the process an outdated method of manufacture?

If commercially available, would the Army have accepted it?

BTW, another reason why the "Wiley" haversack is less expensive is that it is made of cotton and not linen. Because it is manufactured of cotton, it "might" place it as an earlier haversack as linen became the Army standard for both haversacks and knapsacks at least by the middle of 1863. It is linen specifically that is called for in contract advertisements.

I say "might" because as with everything, the USQMD purchased different grades of goods. Drawers for example are often mentioned as being sample "A," sample "B," and so forth, and purchased for a different price.

One thing that can be said for certain, oil was used in the production of painted cloth, we know that. Modern materials may not be free of all synthetics, but there is certainly an argument to be made for the use of an oil based mixture for our purposes.

Many of these questions are best answered here:

http://cdl.library.cornell.edu/moa/

With regards,

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

I greatly appreciate Mr. Sarver's knowledgeable and scientific defense of natural rubber latex, but the topic of latex paint clearly applies to a modern synthetic coating. Don't confuse what he (Mr. Sarver) is explaining with a cheap knockoff of a period application.

[DougCooper]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

The good news is Nic ************, Don Smith and James Owens are making excellent tarred haversacks with a period finish that is as close as we are likely to get until someone discovers the exact make-up of the original stuff. There may be others but these are the three that come to mind who take their paint formula and construction very seriously.

[D F Smith Historic]

Re: Harrison Wiley's Haversack

Hi All,

Just my .02 here.

Most makers of painted cloth items tend to lean toward Latex due to the quick drying properties (as well it's simmilality to period paint. Unfortunately latex doesn't wear exactly like the real oil paint of the day.)

The period hand mixed linseed oil based paints, weather in Oil Cloth (the emusion soaks through the cloth) or in Enameled IE Painted Cloth (the emulsion lays on top of the cloth due to a under coat of sizing or gesso) has to have a "cureing" time to eliminate the hazard of self cumbustion. Once properly "cured" the product is totally safe ( I have been working with period paint for 11 years now). The curing time takes, depending on humidity 1-3 weeks. In the fast paced repro market of today makes some makers cut the corner of proper paint. Putting on the product Latex with an overcoat of Linseed Oil.

I believe in mixing the propper paint for the items I make. They last longer and end up looking and wearing as the originals after long use ( this REALY makes it important for makers to mark their good so as not have the item infect the collectors market, but that's another subject).

As they say "the Devil is in the details"

All the best,

Don S

[FootsoreFederal]

Blue Line Haversack

Hey everyone,
Can anyone attest to the quality of the blue line haversack made by the Haversack Depot? I mean, is it an accurate reproduction, adequate reproduction, so-so reproduction...etc.

Thanks,
Zach Whitlow

[20thMainerCampaigner]

Re: Blue Line Haversack

Hey everyone,
Can anyone attest to the quality of the blue line haversack made by the Haversack Depot? I mean, is it an accurate reproduction, adequate reproduction, so-so reproduction...etc.

Thanks,
Zach Whitlow

Do you mean the new england/ohio haversack? If so then yes it's a very good reprodution, I have a haversack depot haversack, I would and i would stand it up against anybody's.

Best Reagrds,
Court Micker

[20thMainerCampaigner]

Re: Blue Line Haversack

I forgot something. Chris Daley also makes a really nice one. I've seen it first hand, it truely is a work of art. His contract haversacks are awesome.

Best Regards,
Court Micker

[hardtack1864]

Re: Blue Line Haversack

I bought my Daley haversack last year when it was half off and I love it, but I don't belong to a New england, Ohio or Minn. unit. :(