New Style Precussion Cap

[Latigerreb]

Went to an event recently, the sutlers were selling a 'new' type of precussion cap. It looks similar to that used on a pistol, only propotionally bigger and slits along the side. According to sutler this is similar to the familiar winged caps, but are $5 per 100 cheaper. Has anyone else come across these? Are they similar, safe, etc etc. IF I remember correctly, they appear to look like the kind one uses on a 'mountain man' type rifle.
If wrong place for question, please move to correct locale.

JIM Tebbetts

[CompanyWag]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Jim,

I would put any thought of using anything other than winged caps on a military rifle-musket aside no matter how much money you would save. Although period winged caps had far shorter wings than the modern ones, they are to my knowledge the only option currently acceptable.

Paul McKee

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Not having seen these caps before, I cannot comment on their quality or their intended use. However, I would reiterate Paul McKee's comments and direct you toward a (1) more historically accurate cap that has (2) a more established record of performance.

Also, I believe that one maker is now producing a more historically-accurate 4-winged cap made of copper (navy arms and the "German" brand are both brass). I have not tried them yet, or seen them, but they present an excellent (potential) opportunity to improve our impressions.

On the A-C, low cost does not justify a reduction in the historical accuracy of our impressions. If the caps are not winged, they are not appropriate.

...I still have a full tin of 6-winged caps that will probably never be used

[PieBoy96]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Hi John,

The new 4 wing copper caps you mention are made by CCI (infamous for their 6 wing caps). I believe the shapes of the wings are a little more in tune with originals, although they have a modern stamp on the top ('CCI') Here's a photo: https://www.nssnc.com/shop/product_i.../1508-0096.jpg

Here are some excavated originals:

http://thecivilwarlimberchest.com/Relic%20Links/7311.htm

http://www.corinthcivilwarrelics.com/dug39.html

http://www.joshuasattic.com/search/product.asp?ID=3546

http://www.greybirdrelics.com/caps.jpg

[Micah Trent]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

I purchased some of the 4 wing CCI caps at the Manassas event a few months back. I agree with Paul that they are more in tune with the originals. They do have modern markings on the tops of them. However, having fired them, I have had no issues with them and they seem to work just as well as Navy Arms and the German brand. Just my opinion...

[CompanyWag]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

From the photo, those new copper CCI caps look pretty decent. I'll have to get some in the near future. Any online vendors?

Paul McKee

[CompanyWag]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Arghh. Never mind...I found an online dealer and the haz-mat charge was more than the caps. I guess I'll hop over to one of the local black powder shops and see if they have them.

I noticed that some online customer reviews have noted a lower ignition rate and that CCI has responded that "The new 301's are just for the reenactors as the priming mix has been reduced so as to not have the cap fail when the nipple becomes plugged." Huh?

Paul McKee

[cprljohnivey]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Paul,

I think waht CCI is trying to say is that you have more fouling build up from blank firing than from live firing, so they don't pack as much punch in there to try to keep the fowling down. Can't say what they are saying is correct... but that is how I read what they are trying to say.

[PieBoy96]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

I just happened to have all three brands of percussion caps on hand and took some photos for comparison -- I won't even discuss the dangerous 6-wing caps, as that's a moot point by now. Although the CCI caps have the stamp on the top, otherwise they seem to be the closest to originals in terms of metal (copper), shape (smaller, rounded wings), and I don't know what color the chemical is in originals, but the CCI's are a nice old-timey brown.

[CompanyWag]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Paul,

Thanks for the great comparison shot. Too bad CCI felt compelled to stamp their initials on the top. At least the new 301 is a correctly shaped copper cap that will make great soldier-produced ventillation grommets in forage cap tops where the stamping won't be seen.

Paul McKee

[J.H.Berger]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Paul B. you are absolutely right! I think the new CCI look great. I have just seen that they are also available in Germany but quite expensive! . In the 80's Parker Hale was offering some caps that look pretty much the same but without marks. They looked very authentic I have got some 300 pieces of them and keep them for display purposes. I think the marks are all right so you cannot sell them as originals. I don't know if they are priced highly but you know there are some weird people out there.

[Latigerreb]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Jim,
I would put any thought of using anything other than winged caps on a military rifle-musket aside no matter how much money you would save. Although period winged caps had far shorter wings than the modern ones, they are to my knowledge the only option currently acceptable.
Paul McKee

You are more than right. Was trying to see if there were other 'issues' associated with they item that could be also used to preclude use by others. JIM Tebbetts

[CompanyWag]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Understood. It sounds like it is one manufacturer's attempt to cut corners and capture a part of the reenactor market that is more price driven than the authentic/progressive/campaigner crowd.

Paul McKee

[Pennvolunteer]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

I have some of the wingless caps from a couple of years ago when there was a "cap shortage" (at least that is what we were experiencing out here in Indian Territory) and it was all you could buy except for the forbidden 6-wing CCIs around here. They are from the same German company that made the 4-wing in Paul's picture, (with the green chemical interior) and are identical except for no wings. If I had a digital camera handy, I'd post a shot. Not sure why the company made them, but I have a box of them in my truck as back up just in case I forget to bring caps to an event. I also use them live-firing on the range just to save winged caps for living history.

[dixieflyer]

Re: New Style Precussion Cap

Jan, those CCI caps are dirt cheap in my neighborhood, and just happen to be the only ones available. They aren't very hot thouogh, just sayin' for those that are used to the winged German caps.

I was pleasantly surprised to see them when I went out to buy caps. I thought I was going to have to use Alclad metalizer paint on my brass caps to make them look good. ;)