Searching the Web/Research & New Recruits

[SCTiger]

Comrades:

In regard to the "new" AC members and the Camp of Instruction questions.

I have noticed that many of our veterans of his site (trying not to lecture here) have suggested to new members that they use the search engines, i.e. Google, Lycos, Yahoo, et al. Most of the experienced AC forum veteran posters have the ability to search for what we want on the internet or on this site. They also may know exactly who to ask concerning specific areas.

A person that is new to the authentic movement and this forum would be hard pressed to find the right gear or information if the simple answer was "just search Google." (I not picking on you JK) :), lots of AC members have done this.

The newcomers to the movement may have no clue what is considered authentic and may have no idea what to look for. It's a real small needle in a really big haystack and then your not sure what kind of needle you need.

Example: Start a google search with the words "civil war undergarments or underwear." Even with the advanced features, you will still have to wade through a ton of BS and you may wind up looking at 1000 manistream sutlers before reaching one of our vendors. Some guidance and repetitiveness may be necessary for the newbies. I recommend that the new person search this site first, ask an AC veteran, then search the internet, once you have a clue what you are looking for. Maybe we should have a "help" feature, called "ask a veteran". I thought this was the purpose of the "Camp of Instruction" but, aren't we using that forum too often as a "authenticity discussion" for veterans?

I think the moderators and vendors have done a great job with the new recruits and you have exhibited remakable restraint, however; a wealth of knowledge may impair your ability to remain patient with folks on the 1st grade level of authenticity versus the "graduate" school. We have forgotten what is like to be a novice in this hobby. When I started this hobby in 1998, it was very bewildering and confusing. I am glad that I met a few kind hearted people who pointed me in the right direction.

I not asking for the veterans to do their fishing for them, just send the new guys to the right fishing holes and warn them of the bad ones. I.e. continue doing the good things you have done in the past. I believe the authentic movement would really take off if we did this. More recommended links and articles will help.

[Chad Teasley]

Civility

Comrades,

I believe that Greg has hit on a good idea here. There are folks new to the hobby who come onto this forum and ask what seems to them to be a highly valid question, whereas to someone more experienced it may obviously be elementary in the extreme, perhaps even "farby". The reason may be that the poster lacks fundamental research skills, or just simply does not realize that the same topic was covered ad nauseum a hundred times on the "old" version of the forum. Unfortunately, the query which seems to be a perfectly good question to them sometimes appears ridiculous to a "veteran" AC member, to the point that it might even be perceived as flame bait...Or, at best, the questioner seen as downright lazy for having asked it. The frequent result is a blast of sarcasm from experienced members of the forum, which ends in the formerly excited and enthusiastic wanna-be-authentic logging off for good, usually with a determination that the fellows in his mainstream unit were right all along: All "hardcores" are a bunch of arrogant jerks, and unwilling to help those less experienced or knowledgable in living history than themselves.
My suggestion is that sarcasm and rude comments be refrained from in all replies to such questions. There is certainly nothing wrong with gently pointing out to a new poster that his comments may best be referred to another forum ("No farbism" IS a basic rule of the A/C, after all), or steering him in the right direction with regards to research. Doing so may instil in him those basic skills needed for him to progress as a living historian. However, short-tempered commentary, especially of the demeaning type, should be refrained from.
Please understand that I am not pointing any fingers, and I most certainly am not trying to sound holier-than-thou. Most of the time novice inquiries are handled very professionally, particularly by our great team of dedicated moderators. Unfortunately, it is the exception that sticks out in peoples' minds, and that paints the entire authentic movement as being a bunch of elitist jerks. I just think that we should remember that nobody likes being humiliated, and that in a past-time which is ostensibly fun, there is really no reason for such a thing to occur.
I confess that, if not for a few very patient mentors on this forum when I first discovered it during my second season in the hobby back in 2K, I might never have seen the light of authenticity myself.
Thanks for listening.

Respectfully,
Chad Teasley

[ewtaylor]

Re: Searching the Web/Research & New Recruits

Guys,
Doing a search for reenacting gear on the search engines usually only puts you in contact with the "historically incorrect". The old forum had a link entitled "Resources" which listed approved vendors. Maybe this forum needs that link back, but title it "approved vendors" this time?
ewtaylor
bluegrass rifles

[BHoover]

Re: Searching the Web/Research & New Recruits

I think the moderators and vendors have done a great job with the new recruits and you have exhibited remakable restraint, however; a wealth of knowledge may impair your ability to remain patient with folks on the 1st grade level of authenticity versus the "graduate" school. We have forgotten what is like to be a novice in this hobby. When I started this hobby in 1998, it was very bewildering and confusing. I am glad that I met a few kind hearted people who pointed me in the right direction.

This is a difficult issue to deal with. Sometimes it feels as if Job himself wouldn't have enough patience to answer the same questions over and over again, but that is the reality of being an educator. I have taught college math and computer science for over twenty years, and you wouldn't believe how many times I've heard some of those "newbie" questions. It can be very difficult to stay as enthusiastic about the answers on the 200th time around as it was at the start, but that sort of consistency is what makes one a professional. Not many of us on the board are professional reenactors (don't you wish!), but the large majority act in a very professional fashion when answering the fresh fish questions. Once in a while the patience may snap and a harsh answer is given, but those are infrequent.

But I think we do need to remember what Greg said... at one point we were all new, and had those same questions. The curiousity that prompts the question is a good thing. Our task is to guide that curiousity and to make sure it's not snuffed out by a harsh reply.

But by golly, sometimes you do just want to say "Look it up in your Funk and Wagnalls"! :)

[srmitchell]

Re: Searching the Web/Research & New Recruits

All,
I believe that Greg has hit upon something good here as well. I'm sure that moderating these boards plus handling questions from those newer to the authenticity movement must be very trying at times. In this light, why can't we spread out the responsibility of answering these questions? I'd be more than willing to answer some questions, or at least guide someone to the right "fishing hole" if it would help relieve some of the pressure. The 'ask a vet' idea has alot of merit. How many members did this board claim last time anyone checked? If I remember right (and I could be wrong here) it was over 1,000. I'm sure we could find plenty of qualified volunteers to take turns answering the most rudimentary questions, and thereby relieve the strain on some of our more taxed brethren. Is such a feature possible on this board? I believe it's an idea worth looking into.
Regards,

[KarinTimour]

UN-volunteering

Actually, I'd like to take Stephen's idea to the next level, which is UN-volunteering to answer what seems to you to be a ridiculous or needlessly simple question. If you've answered "what should I look for in a brogan" so many times that you want to scream, don't answer. Step aside and wait -- one of the things we often forget about being on the progressive path is that there are others there too -- and some of our more recent members might not really understand the differences between a good RDII and a great RDII, they might have brogans down cold. Let them have answer. It's a lot of fun the first time you realize that you have good advice to offer someone who is less recently "on the path" than yourself.

And if you know that you have answered the "what should I look for in a brogan" question 200 times in the past year, don't even open that thread. With over 1000 members, there are more than enough of us nosy enough to eyeball the answers given and step in if the answer posted starts "First you get a pair of workboots from Sears...."

Sincerely,
Karin Timour
"The Stories behind the Socks" Women in the Civil War Conference, Richmond, VA, June 2004
Period Knitting -- Socks, Hats, Balaclavas
Atlantic Guard Soldiers' Aid Society
Email: Ktimour@aol.com

[Chad Teasley]

Re: Searching the Web/Research & New Recruits

Karin,

I believe you make an excellent point!

A very elementary way of putting it another way may be "If you can't say something nice..." :)

[Michael McComas]

Re: Searching the Web/Research & New Recruits

Excellent points all around. Another patent answer that I would like to see go the way of the dodo is "Just throw it out and buy one from an approved vendor." I think I speak for a great many vendors when I say that an educated consumer is our best customer. Buying from Approved Vendors is certainly good advice, but please couple that with an explanation of why X is better than Y if you can.

This usually comes up in topics that start with "how do I defarb...?" Remember, defarbing is a step (often a first step) on the path to 'progressive'. Encourage the baby steps and before you know it, they're running alongside you.