Enlisted Frock Use

[wajohnson12]

I'm wanting to research the prevalence of the Federal Enlisted Frock during the war. Certainly it was more of an early war item as the arsenals began to supply the more economical/time efficient fatigue blouse as the war went on. With the usual caveat of unit/time/place, would anyone care to generally opine on this topic or offer suggestions on reference materials? Thank you in advance for your help!

[MarkTK36thIL]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

It's my general observation that you can literally find them everywhere, and in every time frame of the war. I was just looking at an enlisted guy who was photographed in Savanah; obviously a late war image. Your best bet is to look at group shots of soldiers, and keep your eyes open for images with tax stamps.

[CompanyWag]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

I agree with Mark. You really can't consider uniform coats as strictly an early war thing. They appear all throughout the war both east and west, in the field and in garrison, warm months and cooler months. Some commanders compelled their troops to draw them...others left it up to personal preference. Certainly sack coats are vastly more common, but uniform coats are never out of place, IMO.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

Hallo!

IMHO....

Since its use or non-use is so "random,'' "varied," and at times "inconsistent..." to the point Hard & Fast Rules cannot be (easily or readily) established...

You might glean some vague generalities if any or none....by photo-analysis of field and studio images in collections that house a decent sampling to be viewed. Or even, 'Echoes of Glory" or the older "Image of War 1861-1865" type references.

Curt

[Tyler Underwood]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

IIRC, there is an account of members of the 77th OVI being issued frock coats right before the Camden Expedition. I will check my notes and see if I can find the account for you.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

Hallo!

My wife's great-great grandfather John Miller served in the 77th OVI, dying of dysentery at Camp Tyler, Texas.

Curt

[Eric Tipton]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

FYI. Since this is a very general discussion about Frocks, I have moved it here to the Camp of Instruction Folder.

[Tyler Underwood]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

Andy, I cannot for the life of me find the account.

This is a little off topic, but interesting nonetheless. Sgt. H. Brabham of Company H 77th OVI wrote in his diary about going to the QM and drawing an artillery jacket and cavalry overcoat.

Curt, yes I remember you telling me about that before. I will have to share with you some of the info I found when researching the 77th for Red River.

[Palmyra Possum]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

We tend to think of the soldiers as having a uniform. They had a frock, or a sack, or a whatever. However, the possibility exists that they had more than one uniform. While his site is devoted to people doing a campaign impression, the original soldier's weren't always on campaign and sometimes had the luxury of additional niceties being available.

Recently, on another thread, I posted a picture of Allen Morgan Geer, 20th Illinois, that I believe was taken in 1863, wearing a frock. I included some of his diary entries to support the estimated date of the picture. In his diary, we also read:

Wednes. Apr 8th [1863] Recd orders to be ready to fall in with cartridge boxes, boots blacked, best uniforms etc. at 2 P.M. to receive as a Div. Adgt. Gen Thomas.

The phrase "best uniforms" implies that they had more than one to choose from. It isn't much of a stretch to suppose one was a fatigue uniform and the other was a frock. Later in the same year Geer wrote in his diary:

Mon Dec. 7th Drew clothing. Got dress coat and boots pegged $10.08.

While we cannot completely rule out the possibility of other types of uniforms, it is reasonable to assume this dress coat was likely a frock. We know the 20th had frocks until fairly late in the war. I posted another picture of George Sleezer on a different thread. He also is wearing a frock despite the fact that he didn't enlist until September 26, 1864.

All told, I have four different pictures of enlisted men in the 20th wearing frocks. At least three of the pictures are not early war pictures. The fourth is undetermined. I've attached a picture of Martin Mohrle, the regimental color bearer. Take a look at that flag. That is not an "I just enlisted" picture.

Source: Geer, Allen Morgan. The Civil War Diary of Allen Morgan Geer, Twentieth Regiment, Illinois Volunteers. Edited by Mary Ann Andersen. Denver: R. C. Appleman, 1977

[wajohnson12]

Re: Enlisted Frock Use

Thank you gentlemen for all your responses and suggestions!

Much appreciated!