Cartridge Box with Sling and Belt?

[Ferris41st]

I'm going to use a 1855 cartridge box. It has loops for a belt and or a sling. I believe the belt was used to hold most hanging items in place? This being said would it be correct to have the box looped through the belt loops as well has using a sling to stabilize the weight hanging cross the chest?

Kevin Ferris (Ferris41st)

[PMFerringer]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

It is one or the other, not both. The slings are far longer than where your belt should be riding. If your belt is being worn low enough to accomplish this you need to hike it up to your navel.

[Ferris41st]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Got it thanks!

[maillemaker]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

My understanding is that if you use the cartridge box with the shoulder sling then the shoulder sling passes [i]under[/u] the waist belt. Your waist belt keeps the cartridge box tight against the body and prevents it from flopping around.

Steve

[Dbackfed]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

You can use both. There are photographs and period accounts of soldiers putting boxes on their belts and using the box sling. It's personal preference unless there is specific documentation to your impression.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Hallo!

Technically, the weight (roughly five pounds loaded) is not hanging across the chest, but rather is distributed fairly well by the width of the shoulder belt on the shoulder.
(Which the Army thought sufficient enough to reduce its width in July 1864.)

Curt

[Ferris41st]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

My understanding is that if you use the cartridge box with the shoulder sling then the shoulder sling passes [i]under[/u] the waist belt. Your waist belt keeps the cartridge box tight against the body and prevents it from flopping around.

Steve

my thoughts as well. Thanks

[Ambrose Bierce]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

I recommend Paul D. Johnson's Civil War Cartridge Boxes of the Union Infantryman as a reference. Lots of great photos of soldiers wearing the various patterns throughout the war.

While Pat makes a good point, Mark's is also valid. Most photos show soldiers wearing the box on its sling, the belt being worn high, nearly at or just below the rib cage, and over the sling, per Steve's post.

Really, it comes down to the impression, what is mandated for use, and if your unit has specific requirements to wear the box in a particular configuration. This will rarely be a comfort-based decision.

Personally, I prefer wearing it on the sling and being a cartridge box full of blanks doesn't weigh close to what one full of live ammunition weighs, it really doesn't make much difference. Once you have your traps adjusted and fitting well you will notice when things are not riding where they should.

[Michael Comer]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Seems to me that it would be very awkward putting on and taking off if you had it secured both ways.

[CompanyWag]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Yes, there is ample photographic evidence of infantrymen using both belt and sling threaded through the cartridge box at the same time. To me it seems like the ACW equivalent of the old duffer that wears suspenders and a trouser belt at the same time. I also agree that separate sling or belt carriage was by far more common.

[john duffer]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Yes, there is ample photographic evidence of infantrymen using both belt and sling threaded through the cartridge box at the same time. To me it seems like the ACW equivalent of the old duffer that wears suspenders and a trouser belt at the same time. I also agree that separate sling or belt carriage was by far more common.

Hey, for the record I've never worn suspenders AND a belt at the same time.

[PMFerringer]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Yes, there is ample photographic evidence of infantrymen using both belt and sling threaded through the cartridge box at the same time. To me it seems like the ACW equivalent of the old duffer that wears suspenders and a trouser belt at the same time. I also agree that separate sling or belt carriage was by far more common.

Links to the images? I have never seen this and am curious if they modified sling length to make it work. I am still skeptical.

[CompanyWag]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Patrick,

The images are not always obvious until you look at the relationship of the belt to the box and realize the belt is too low to go over the sling above the cartridge box. Just a quick look through Paul Johnson's "Civil War Cartridge Boxes of the Union Infantry" yields the following examples:
Page 46, Fig 24
Page 87, Fig 58
Page 153, Fig. 86
Page 274, Fig. 158
Page 282, Fig. 166
Page 183, Fig 167

[Palmyra Possum]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

“Links to the images? I have never seen this and am curious if they modified sling length to make it work. I am still skeptical.”

To add to what Paul said, the best evidence of cartridge boxes on both the belt and sling is a detailed description by Walter V. Reeder, 36th Illinois (it seem to have been primarily an Illinois thing). It can be found at this link:

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-15743.html

but for convenience sake, here is it again:

June 2nd 1863

I guess you never saw a soldier fitted out for a march, so I will tell you of how they are rigged when ready to start on a march, be that either long or short. Well, imagine a soldier, you have seen some of them. The first thing after the clothes comes the belt, and the cartridge box, I don't know as you ever saw a box of this description, Father can describe it to you. On the belt is the "bayonet scabbard" and cap box in addition to the box for cartridges. The two boxes are worn on the right side the bayonet scabbard on the left, as the cartridge box when full is quite heavy, so there is a strap extending over the left shoulder, which is fastened to it, and thus most, if not all the weight, is taken from the belt. I will not take up any more paper, If you don't understand from this description. Father can tell you about them for he has seen them, next to these comes the Haversack and canteen, worn on the left side, straps over the right shoulder, then comes the knapsack, filled according to the owners idea of things. Lastly comes the guns, or muskets, by the way, we have a gun called the "Enfield rifle" now, an arm far superior to the ones we had at the time of the battle (Stone's River), If we had had such guns then, we would have done much more execution, but I am digressing.

Imagine a soldier thus accoutered, and you will have some idea of how he would look when ready for marching.

As for pictures, admittedly it is hard to find photographic evidence of boxes being worn that way due to the difficulties of seeing the back of the boxes in pictures. Many times, the best you can do when looking at a picture of soldiers is to conclude “this may have been worn in this manner,” or “this definitely was not worn in this manner.” Here’s an old thread that may show belts and slings that were worn in this manner.

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/showthread.php?23875-suckers-76th-Illinois-interesting-pic&highlight=cartridge+box+sling+belt+illinois

Here are a few more pics of Illinois soldiers in which the cartridge boxes may be worn on the sling and the belt.

[PMFerringer]

Re: Cartridge box with sling and belt?

Very interesting. Some of them clearly show the box on both belt and sling. Others are not so clear and one even looks like the box is worn over the belt on a sling with a short strap. Very odd practice. I don't see how that would be practical or comfortable.