EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

[FlatLandFed]

Chums,
Is the Echoes of Glory collection still considered a starting point for our research projects?

In recent months I've noted that many of us, when selling an item, direct folks to page such and such to see a photo of the original item. But others occasionally remark that the EOG series contains enough errors or lack of detail that they don't rely on it as a research tool.
I'd like to place some typed notes inside my set of EOG to point out discrepancies or new research findings that dispute what's in those books. What errors of fact or omission come to mind?

Regards,
Paul Hadley
Yes, I Did A Search Squad, Lack of Details Detail

[PFLINT]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Is the Echoes of Glory collection still considered a starting point for our research projects?

I don't think thumbing through EOG is research. EOG is more of a picture book in my mind. It has nice color pictures of a wide variety of uniforms, equipment, arms etc. but it does not provide much context. I think the starting point for research is the local library followed by interlibrary loans and trips to local, state and national archives/museum collections.
Patrick Flint

[JimConley]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Echoes of Glory is still a good collection, and there are a lot of reproductions out there that claim this reference. However, I believe that people cite discrepancies with it simply because people have come to place too much emphasis on it's contents.

While Echoes of Glory displays a lot of original items, there is still much that is left out, including some of the more common items that would have been found on a soldier's back. Also, many of the photographs can be misleading in regards to color. Take, for example, the Woodward jacket on oage 143 of the Confederate collection. The photograph would lead one to believe that this jacket is of a dark jeans material, whereas viewing the original in person says otherwise. Which leads me to the other problem.

Not everyone has good access to museums, collections, and other sources that house originals. So, Echoes of Glory allows for a quick view of certain items. However, flipping through the pages and glancing at the photographs is far off the mark of actually viewing the original in person, which is what, I feel, many want to emphasize to others.

And, as far as citing Echoes of Glory as a point of research, that too falls short of the mark. Reading articles like Les Jensen's A Survey Of Confederate Central Government Quartermaster Issue Jackets, for example, will give you a much better understanding of these items than a picture in Echoes of Glory.

I think that the main premise is simply this: People should do more of their own research, reading books, articles, studying original documents and photographs, and viewing originals for themselves rather than relying on Echoes of Glory as a basis for impressions or research.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Hallo!

I LOVE pictures of artifacts and relics, I surely do!

But, aside from a very general (such as determining a quick visual difference between a M1850 Foot Officers sword and and a M1850 Staff and Field Officers sword) fleeting "snapshot," what EXACTLY does a small or tiny image in a book contribute to research or a "researched impression?"
(Meaning... what does a small picture tell one about the raw materials, patterns or forms, methods of production, and actually use by Civil War soldiers and in what ways, how, when, and where that we can emulate- BEHIND the "statistical artifacts" previously sitting on a shelve behind glass or in a vault's box or collection drawer?)

Not knocking EOG. I have both the hardbound and a desk-use paperback set (I found at BORDERS for $19.95) because I love pictures...

And yes, the "color" range of EOG images will be found to vary somewhat depending upon the "printing" (version).

Curt

[Canton Zouave]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

I find myself looking past the images. The Picture Credits is where I get the information that I need as to the location of the artifact. I can then go through channels to research and examine items personally, and use my my own archival review process. Several of the EOG artifacts have passed through The Horse Soldier over the past couple of years, so a chance to see the items up close, and even contemplate a purchase has arisen. The book is simply a start, and a little kindling to ignite a fire under someone to do some good research.

[HighPrvt]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Collecting the Confederacy, by Shannon Pritchard is an awesome book. far greater photographic detail than Echoes, without the errors.

[Matthew Semple]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

I agree that EOG is not a primary research method and that it is a picture book with errors and omissions. The most important aspect of EOG is that it gets people to ask questions and interested in doing more intensive research.

I'd like to place some typed notes inside my set of EOG to point out discrepancies or new research findings that dispute what's in those books. What errors of fact or omission come to mind?

I have been gathering that information for myself for the past few years. I don't have my notes in front of me so I can't post specifics.

Something to consider:
The back part of the books with the artifact location lists change from time to time. Certain artifacts have changed location since the printing. It also does not list the private collections. That is understandable and it takes a significant amount of time and contacts to try to track these specific artifacts down. Usually, we don't know what private collection houses an artifact until the item changes hands through auction or through a relic dealer.

That part of the book can still be helpful in locating those artifacts in major museum collections. When conducting research on a specific uniform item, I find the location of the item and if possible, schedule an appointment to examine it. This way I can conduct my own research on the actual garment and can take my own notes, measurements, and pictures. The Musuem of the Confederacy, the Smithonian Institute, the National Archives, and the National Military Park Collections have all been very helpful for viewing original items and documents associated with them.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Hallo!

Agreed!
If the images in EOG spark/prompt/lead a lad to research things further and track down its location and arrange to "view" the item... BONUS!

Curt

[ley74]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

In many cases, a museum will have a survey of the item on file. They usually charge a small fee, smaller than the cost of actually visiting. If a survey does not yet exist, you can usually commission one. While slightly higher in cost, you help make the survey available to others.

There is nothing like viewing the actual item, IMHO, especially for context of the item as a whole. Pictures and surveys just do not capture the three demensional aspect.

[westcoastcampaigner]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Collecting the Confederacy, by Shannon Pritchard is an awesome book. far greater photographic detail than Echoes, without the errors.

Sir,

Is this book still in print. I did an internet search and wasn't able to turn up much. Where can a copy be obtained? Thank you.

Best Regards,

Josh Sawyer
Liberty Rifles (National Light Infantry)
Hardtack Society

[Richmond Depot]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Sir,

Is this book still in print. I did an internet search and wasn't able to turn up much. Where can a copy be obtained? Thank you.

Best Regards,

Josh Sawyer
Liberty Rifles (National Light Infantry)
Hardtack Society

Call The Museum of the Confederacy and ask for the Haversack Store, they have Pritchards book in stock and ready to ship. 1-804-649-1861.

Best,

[ley74]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

The EOG at Amazon.com.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/index=blended&field-keywords=echoes%20of%20glory&results-process=default&dispatch=search/ref=pd_sl_aw_tops-1_blended_26165053_1&results-process=default?tag2=amd-google-20

I prefer the paperback version for my working copy. Although they do not wear as well as the hardback, they are easier to carry and you do not feel so bad annotating them.

[HighPrvt]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

Shannon had a couple of slightly damaged copies at the Dalton relic show, they were half price.
His site is;

https://www.oldsouthantiques.com

[SKIP-34TH VA CAV]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

I think this series of museum quality photos serves as an excellent reference book for comparing things such as style of kepi, nuances of a certain musket or rifle. I personally have used it as a resource but have never used it as a stated source for authentic reproduction arms and equipment.
When I make a piece of gear I will always personally inspect the original article befor I begin. I hve been lucky in that I have been able to go to most all museumes in the south.
Take care when using EOG as a reference I know of several items that are reproductions made by men in the 1970's and 80's.
Due dilligence....verify.

Skip McLean
34th BTN VA CAV

[Chris Suppelsa]

Re: EOG: still top shelf or tarnished?

I always liked how the federal one compared the stocks of the Springfield rifles.