Rations

[MissAnnaMae]

Re: Vegetables

There has already been a thread on this....

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1423&highlight=desiccated+vegetables

[Pvt Schnapps]

Re: Vegetables

Can anyone tell me where I can find "dessicated vegetables" (spelling??)
Thank you in advance. :wink_smil

Good luck on the desecrated vegetables. The Subsistence Department also issued dried potatoes, a version of which you can find in ethnic (Latin American) food stores, under the name "Papa Seca." You need to simmer them for 20-30 minutes to make them edible, but they're not bad.

[Yulie]

Re: Vegetables

Can anyone tell me where I can find "dessicated vegetables" (spelling??)
Thank you in advance. :wink_smil

Marc,

Where to find dehydrated vegetables? Best on-line reliable source I've used (when I don't want to dry them myself) is:

BulkFoods at http://www.bulkfoods.com/products.asp.
The direct link to the diced dehydrated vegetables is: http://www.bulkfoods.com/search_resu...hParamTxt=4482

I don't know where you hail from, but if you are in the Detroit area you should go to Eastern Market -- it's my main source. There are at least three stores that carry dehydrated vegetables, fruits, herbs, spices, cereals, grains, rice, beans that are appropriate/accurate for the mid-nineteenth century: Rafael's, Rocky Peanut Company, and Hirts, Co. Rafael's also carries real wood-charcoal.

Yulanda

[jaybird]

Lard Containers???

Pards,

Have come across a lard can of some age, but I don't think it's that old. However, what kind of container was lard, or similiar items (not hardtack or ammo), packed/transported/kept in?

[Virginia Mescher]

Re: Lard Containers???

Pards,

Have come across a lard can of some age, but I don't think it's that old. However, what kind of container was lard, or similiar items (not hardtack or ammo), packed/transported/kept in?

I found the following in _Miss Beecher's Domestic Recipt-Book_ by Catherine Beecher (1858).

"Lard and Drippings must be kept in a dry, cold place and should not be salted. Usually the cellar is the best place for them. Earthern, or stone jars are the best to store them in."

Sarah Hale wrote in, Mrs. Hale's New Cook-Book_ (1857), in the section on trying lard, ".... strain it into small stone jars, or deep earthen pans, and when perfectly cold, tie over it the skin [pigskin] that was cleared from the lard, or bladders which have been thoroughly washed adn wiped very dry."

"To Preserve Unmelted Lard for many months. It may be kept well during the summer months by rubbing fine salt rather plentifully upon it when it is first taken from the pig, and leaving it for a couple of days; it should then be well drained, and covered with a strong brine; this, in warmer weather, should be changed occasionally. When wanted for use, lay it into cold water for two or three hours, then wipe it dry, and it will have quite the effect of the fresh leave [lard] when made into paste [pastry crust]. Inner fat of pig 6 lbs; fine salt 1/2 to 3/4 lb.: 2 days. Brine, to each quart of water, 6 ozs. salt."

In my store ledger research and transcriptions, I only found lard being purchased in cities. It was purchased in varying amount and not always in whole pound increments, which leads me to believe that the customer asked either for a certain dollar amount, such as $ .25 cents worth of lard or just asked for a specific weight of lard.

It is possible that when lard was puchased, the store owner wrapped the purchased amount in paper and the customer then stored it in a container at home, or brought a container, such as a tin pail with him. Bringing one's own container was not unusual. I found many instances where molasses or kerosene was puchased and at the same time, a molasses jug or oil tin was purchaed at the same time and the container was a separate purchase.

Not finding any CW period reference as to how it was sold or stored in the store, I used books closest to the CW time period that I could find. In _The Grocer's Hand-Book_ (1882) the author stated, "It is put up in kegs, barrels, and tierces, and also in small cans of several pounds weight."

A bit later the _Grocer's Goods: A Family Guide_ by F. B. Goddard (1888) stated, "Lard may be had in barrels, wooden and tin tubs and pails, and in one pound tin cups. It is also retailed in bulk, like butter."

[amazingkenneth]

Vinegar Storage

Hello All,
Here is a question that I would like to get some information on. I was reading on items issued to the troops. We know about hardtack, fatback, etc..but vinegar was also issued. Does anyon know how troop would have recieved it? I guess was in a spare canteen. Or my thought was that they recieved it in a container.

Your Servant,
K.J. Reihl

[Ringgold]

Re: Vinegar Storage

Herr Riehl,

One thing I can guarantee you, it would not do well in a metallic container. If it were galvanized, it would eat the zinc right off of it. If it were iron, it would rust it badly. You should see what true vinegar does to the iron barrel bands of the wooden kegs that contains it! The stuff you buy today is usually "reduced to 10% acidity" or some other such nonesense. You should try a pull straight from a geniune cider vinegar barrel - it'll pucker you up at BOTH ends!

My guess is it would have to had been either a glass, copper, or wooden container to withstand the corrosive properties of the vinegar for any length of time. Especially the amount of time it would take to get it to the troops and then dispense it.

Anyone have any definative answer for this question?

[1stMaine]

Re: Vinegar Storage

Comrades,

The only reference that I can locate regarding Vinegar containers is from the "US Army Regulations, revised 1863", pp 301, para 7; to wit: "Vinegar-kegs should be painted and the bungs capped with tin".

Other comments regarding rations from that same page are: para 8: "Liquid measures and scoops should be made of treble X tin".

The whole section, pp301-303 is worth the reading, as it states what types of packaging should be used for the various rations (for example, salt in 3lb bags) and how it should be made (bacon boxes should be 20X20X28 inches OM, of 1&1/4" boards, tonque and groove construction, for field transport.), etc.

respects,

[amazingkenneth]

Re: Vinegar Storage

Herr Pflum,
Guter Morgen-Sir, I thank you for your info. I love to find out about things like this. Any info can only help me do a better job on the field.

Ihr Bediensteter,
K.J. Reihl

Herr Riehl,

One thing I can guarantee you, it would not do well in a metallic container. If it were galvanized, it would eat the zinc right off of it. If it were iron, it would rust it badly. You should see what true vinegar does to the iron barrel bands of the wooden kegs that contains it! The stuff you buy today is usually "reduced to 10% acidity" or some other such nonesense. You should try a pull straight from a geniune cider vinegar barrel - it'll pucker you up at BOTH ends!

My guess is it would have to had been either a glass, copper, or wooden container to withstand the corrosive properties of the vinegar for any length of time. Especially the amount of time it would take to get it to the troops and then dispense it.

Anyone have any definative answer for this question?

[jaybird]

Re: Lard Containers???

Thanks for the excellent info....

What I have is a 5-gallon tin bucket, known by my grandparents to have contained lard. It's similar to what they knew they and their parents had used. There are no markings on the can, as it's very rusted.

[[[Snipped]]]
A bit later the _Grocer's Goods: A Family Guide_ by F. B. Goddard (1888) stated, "Lard may be had in barrels, wooden and tin tubs and pails, and in one pound tin cups. It is also retailed in bulk, like butter."[/QUOTE]

[Spinster]

Re: Vinegar Storage

Herr Riehl,

One thing I can guarantee you, it would not do well in a metallic container. If it were galvanized, it would eat the zinc right off of it. ............ The stuff you buy today is usually "reduced to 10% acidity" or some other such nonesense.

So true---I'm increasingly moving towards making mordants for period dyes by placing old iron or copper in a vinegar-filled glass or stonewear container. Nasty poisonous stuff occurs in a matter of a day or so. It makes a fine addition to a dyepot, but would be a really bad idea for a ration issue.

I am seeing the need for "real vinegar" for this process, rather than the watered down reduced acidity stuff--the stuff around here is only 5% acidity.

Do you know of any commerical sources for stronger vinegar?

[Hank Trent]

Re: Vinegar Storage

Unfortunately, I don't know where stronger vinegar is available commercially today, but just thought I'd add in a note on vinegar strengths in the 1860s. Vinegar was available in all strengths, and the writer below recommends 4% for cucumber pickles, which is actually weaker than the standard 5% sold today.

From Mrs. E.F. Haskell's Housekeeper's Encyclopedia, 1861:

Vinegar must be of proper strength; if too strong, it will eat the pickles; if not of sufficient strength, mould will form, and the pickles become soft and worthless. It is of no use to scald vinegar that moulds. It is want of strength that produces it; either add ten per cent. vinegar, until the percentage of the vinegar is raised to four per cent., or throw it away, and put fresh vinegar to the pickles. There is no better vinegar to be obtained for pickles than pure distilled high wine vinegar; this can be bought of the maker from ten to four per cent.; four per cent. is the proper strength for preserving cucumber pickles. Onions and mixed pickles require it much stronger. The strength of vinegar can be ascertained by the use of a glass tube called by vinegar makers Acetometer; the proper name for it is Acet-meter.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[MuleyGil]

Re: Vinegar Storage

This quotation comes from the book, A Revised History of the 33rd Alabama Volunteers-1862-1865, written by L B (Tex) Williams, printed by Auburn University Printing Service. On page 326, Pvt William E Preston, Co B, 33rd Ala writes from the camp at Pensacola FL.

"One dark, rainy night, Co. B and Co. I, and Co. 17 of the Mississippi regiments in command of Maj. Nelson were garrisoning Ft. McRee. There came up a great storm and ... tide that flooded a low, narrow and crooked strip of land a mile in length ... We had to guard it at night from the fort to the mainland- Along in the night a supply ship laying outside the bar ... threw overboard many barrels of vinegar, boxes of crackers and other things ... When they came floating across this neck of sand on which the sentinels were posted, they mistook them in the dark and storm for Federal boats trying to land from Ft. Pickens, and fired at them. All came to attention in the fort, took their places and loaded arms ... If there were any lights in the fort, they were soon extinguished."

Gil Tercenio

[RockCityGuard]

Re: Vinegar Storage

There aren't many options for liquid storage and transport in that era. A well sealed barrel will be quite sufficient for the task. Many people do not realize that a good number (I don't have statistics but would be comfortable saying half or better) were made with split wooden bands or even rope bands and not metal so iron or steel band degradation would not have been a problem. I found some information on barrels made for the oil industry in 1859:

“ The first barrels used for oil were made in the customary fashion of the day (1859) which was the same as for any other liquid requiring a tight container. The staves were prime white oak and the hoops were hickory. The barrel of that time was a work of art. As time went on oak for staves survived, but hickory was soon replaced by iron hoops.”

They could have transported in demijohns but mass transport of vinegar in glass containers would have been pricey. I have seen references to pickle barrels in the period accounts so I know vinegar was transported in them.

I don't know how solders would have been issued their ration but a small dose of vinegar has been considered beneficial to health since ancient times and I would guess was given as a ration similar to a whiskey ration though probably not as popular. There is a good site on the benefits of Vinegar that even mentions its use during the Civil War... "Even Christopher Columbus and his crew on his voyage to discover America in 1492 had their vinegar barrels for prevention of scurvy as did the soldiers in the American Civil War."

http://www.lacetoleather.com/wondrugpag2.html

I have spoken to older “country” people who still take a regular “dose” of vinegar each week as a homeopathic remedy.


Richard (Russ) Russell
Co. A 1st Tenn Inf CSA
Rock City Guards

[John Peterson]

Re: Vinegar Storage

Herr Riehl,


My guess is it would have to had been either a glass, copper, or wooden container

DO NOT store vinegar in a copper vessel - it will produce a poisonous compound!