The Monster Enfield Defarbing Thread

[Jimmayo]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

Out of idle curiousness, most of the references I've seen indicate that the "JS over anchor" stamp was placed on the bottom side of the stock -- in the wood -- and not on the lockplate...

I wondered about that also. I have also seen a few with that stamp and all were on the bottom side of the stock behind the trigger guard.

That being said, you can never tell what will show up on original enfields and they did say they copied an original. One of the lockplates in Geoff Walden's article on enfields does have a Birmington Small Arms Trade stamp on the lock plate.

If I had to make a generalization I would say the fewer stock markings the better.

IMO, the best way to do it is to find an original with markings and copy that one.

[HighPrvt]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

The stamp is also on the stock.
They said that they copied an original, I dunno. Maybe Tim Prince will chime in on this?


Not using this as any kind of proof, or anything but here's what is said about the stamps on their site.

Just in and ready to go. We now have the stamps for the Confederate contract Enfield. You can now order your enfield with the Charles Swinburn stamp rather than the Joseph Wilson stamp and the JS over the anchor stamp signifying that your Enfield was a Confederate Contract Enfield that ran the blockade! No one else offers these stamps.

The JS over the anchor is thought to be the initials of London Armory Co. employee, James Smiles. Smiles would have been given a leave of absence to be an inspector of arms for the CSA and would then have stamped the guns he approved for purchase.

On the original rifles you will see his stamp on lock plates, just behind the trigger guards and on the butt plates. But not always stamped on all three places.
We will also stamp the last 3 digits of your weapons serial number on the tang of the butt plate as the majority of the surviving weapons which have the JS over anchor and the C. Swinburn stamp also have a rack number stamped on the butt plate.

[HighPrvt]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

Look at your mainspring on the inside of the lock. If memory serves me correctly, the Armi Sport has either a silver/metallic mainspring whereas the Euroarms have a black mainspring. Anyone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Chris

Mainspring is silver, so everything is consistent with the Armisport, except the weight. Apparently from a search I did the weight of the Armisports can fluctuate while all the Euroarms are heavy. Oh well, I'm used to toting around a '61 Springfield, so I'm used to the weight, I was looking forward to a lighter musket........

[C.R. Henderson]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

I've started to do a defarb on my Euro Enfield and after recontouring the stock (using several pics from 5 different originals) I can definately tell a difference. I weighed it against my father's Enfield (Euro) and it is considerably lighter. Next, the stamps and new lockplate....:D

[Jimmayo]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

Here is the JS anchor stamp on my P58 euro. Doesn't look like the one in the other picture. It looks big in this picture but it is the right size.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Frequently asked questions that drive you batty

Ah yes, good point. Perhaps even a general treatrise on "if they'd a had it they'd a used it".

That should be an easy piece to write:
"If they used it, they had it" :tounge_sm ;)

More Peeves:
"Should I buy an Armi Sport or a Euroarms?"
Fundamental questions asked in the Research forum: "Can anyone tell me about the XXth (Insert State) Regiment in 186X?"

[HOG.EYE.MAN]

Re: Frequently asked questions that drive you batty

How about this one?

"I've got a Jarnigan (Or other sutler row crook) coat that I've torn up to look like I've been on campaign, how is that any different from a correctly made coat? I can look just as hardcore with my cheap S&#@ as the rest of you fellows."

About time to eliminate that mentality...

Good point, Jim.

Should I defarb, or re-buy? Unless it's a weapon issue, the defarbing questions drive me nuts.

[Tim Prince]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

Since my name has been brought up.....A few notes.

Yes, I provided the first P-1853 that thye copied the stamps from, a Joseph Wilson made Enfield with a nice BSAT stock cartouche and great makers mark. The gun had NO Confederate markings at all. They did a good job with the stamps, and Todd uses an arbor press to stamp the guns, which is why the stamps are nice and deep and clean, unlike the hand struck stamps that most other de-frabers (is that a word???) use.

I have never seen the JS/Anchor on a lock plate (that does not mean it did not happen) and it does not seem PEC to me. Also, the number on the buttplate (which should also be on the rammer) should be 4 digits (not 3) and individually engraved, not stamped.

Just my 2 cents. I still have not seen one of the guns in person, so it is difficult to pass a final judgement.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

Hallo!

I have never encountered a "JS anchor" stamp on a lock plate myself, but my "pool" of Enfields I have owned or seen is not much more than a hundred or so...
Throw in some pictures in reference books, and..

PEC/NUG, IMHO it seems the stamp exists in two forms, a long front stroke "U" and a short front stroke "U" that looks more like a "J." And they seem to be stamped at the trigger guard end.

Love those arbor presses. I have a 2 ton and wished we had gone 3... ;-) :-)
(and it also can help to soften the hard modern steel and reharden it after striking...)

Curt

[SCTiger]

Re: Frequently asked questions that drive you batty

We used to call this spoon feeding, any topic could become irksome if the questions aren't completely answered and made in to a good article. I guess Paul wants more serious articles that address these issues squarely and relate them to the type of issues we most commonly encounter, most stem from reenactorisms that are practiced at mainstream events. We need articles that treat the subject in a realistic manner, i.e. take a topic like "women in the ranks", instead of preconceived and biased articles that want to "justify" female soldiers, we need a fair and scientific article, that should demonstrate exactly how rare that was (hypothesis). Another would be soldiers without shoes or tent usage, Personal opinions are to be aruged with, good research teaches.

You can argue with beliefs and opinions but, facts stand on their own. Good specific articles with specific references, unbiased facts and solid empirical will kill the myths.

Provided that someone ever read the "primary resource" or article sections of this forums.

[Tarheel]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

A short note on Confederate "numbered" Enfields. I'm afraid it is not correct to state the hand-engraved butt plate numbers should be four digits not three. I have two such Enfields in my collection. The first, a Patt.1853 rifle musket, has the number 729 hand engraved on the butt plate tang. The second, a Patt 1856 short rifle with an iron butt plate, is numbered 693. This number is stamped into the underside of the stock one and a half inches from the end of the tigger guard tang. The numerals are 1/4" high. I believe that stamping was used with iron butt plates as the iron was too hard to hand engrave. This second Enfield also has the JS Anchor stamp which is 3/4" from the trigger guard tang with the "JS" being towards the butt plate. Both the Enfields are Birmingham weapons marked 1861 above Tower on the lockplates. I hope this helps.
Knid regards,
Patrick Reardon,
The Lazy Jack Mess, UK

[HighPrvt]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

The three number on my but plate are hand carved.

[Jimmayo]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

The three number on my but plate are hand carved.

Any markings on the stock?
What is the lock marking?
Is the ramrod marked or the ramrod channel?

Thanks

[HighPrvt]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

Jim,
The ramrod, and channel aren't marked.
I posted some photos on the first page of this thread, here are some more.






The bayonet

[CeeBeeRebel]

Re: Blockade Runner Enfield Defarb

North South Trader's Civil War has a six page article in this months edition (Vol. 32 No. 3/2007) that deals with the JS-Anchor Mark on Confederate Enfield Arms. It is written by Steven W. Knott if anyone is interested. It is titled "Will the Real "J.S." Please Stand Up?" and is located on page 47-52. If you have any specific questions about the article please contact me and I will try to help.