Horse Breed

[ridinshotgun]

Re: Horse Breed

To my knowledge the stud book for the Hanoverian breed was't established until the 1880's. While there may have been a breeding program for them prior to that they were not a recognized breed.

The modern breed Hanoverians are also vastly different than those bred back in the mid-1800's. The modern horse is really the result of breeding that took place after WW2 to steer what was a stout farm horse to be more of a modern competition horse for the show ring. Hanoverians are also much more of a "type" than a "breed" since the breeding lineage is more of selection for sport. It allows various other breeds to be introduced if it increases the breeds overall performance traits being sought after.

I believe but can't confirm that Hanoverians didn't even come to the United States until the 1950's when competitve riders inported them for use in various sport horse competitions.

[Mark Choate]

Re: Horse Breed

Pete,

My wife does a lot of dressage and hunter/jumper type of events and I know I hear them drooling over the Hano's like they were the Holy Grail. I also agree with Eric that I had heard that they weren't around until the late 19th century.

Mark Choate
7th TN. Cav

[csabugler]

Re: Horse Breed

Got a lead on a 7 year old , 15/2 hh grey gelding for $1500. Sounds too good to be true.
Little old lady rode it to church on sunday....:wink_smil

[volcav]

Re: Horse Breed

If it fits the body type you're looking for and is the right size and color then go for it. I personally don't think registration papers mean much one way or the other with a war horse. It sounds like a good deal.

[csabugler]

Re: Horse Breed

I reckon as long as he's not multiple colors and all spotted up...

[csabugler]

Re: Horse Breed

Pics of the Hanoverian if anyone wants to look. The damned horse jumped my 4' fence sunday afternoon.. Oh Boy.

[Mark Choate]

Re: Horse Breed

Well, like I said earlier, Pete, those Hanoverians are "Jumpin' fools", ha.

He looks pretty nice. How does he ride and do your saddles fit him properly??

Mark C.
7th TN

[RJSamp]

Re: Horse Breed

Well Hanoverian warmblood's had been around...and used as war horses....since the 1730's.... your Saxony cavalry unit would most likely be mounted on them....

but you'd have to get some quotes on numbers used by cavalry or raised in the south to come up with a PEC breed for cavalry use in the 1860's...... Canadian Warmbloods much more prevalent in North America than Hanoverian Warmbloods....

[RJSamp]

Re: Horse Breed

Pics of the Hanoverian if anyone wants to look. The damned horse jumped my 4' fence sunday afternoon.. Oh Boy.

I always thought they were darker......

http://www.foals.com/2007_foals.htm

[csabugler]

Re: Horse Breed

Well the good news is that he doesn't have any glaring physical features that make him innapropriate. More correct than a quarter horse, at least the breed existed in the 1860's..

[Outrider]

Re: Horse Breed

I did a quick google search for Hanoverian Breed. The first site I clicked on had this;

"In 1888 the Hanover breed registry was founded, in 1922 its functions were taken over by the "Provincial society of Hanoverian horse breeders" which is today the "Society of breeders of the Hanoverian warmblood horse". I looked up them up in a modern book I have called Great Horse Breeds Of the World and it gives the same dates and says basically the same thing.

Not unlike the much maligned QH IMHO. The breed registery was founded post war therefore there was no "breed" as such yet but the type was around and bred for specific characteristics. As has been stated in this thread already, the same holds true for nearly all of our "modern breeds".

I would again say that IMHO body type is more important for a good representation of a mid 19th century horse than what "breed" it is. If that fits than everything else is kind of irrevlevent to me. I aint askin anyway. I usaully have enough to think about than what kind of horse someone else is mounted on.

Just my opinion

[littleforkranger]

Re: Horse Breed

Hail Romans, this has been an excellent thread. It's nice to deal with gentlemens who can stay gentlemens while discussing their horses. Rare.

I believe Aden to be correct about beating this dead horse of a topic and Todd is right on the TBs. I find TBs the best fit in the Eastern Theatre particularly, as many of the cav were from foxhunter mentality always running and jumping at the full tilt. I also find them tedious and recommend potential riders to look hard at QHs for adaptability issues. I agree with Patrick that every soldier or citizen should make up their own mind. I found this QH SB cross that for some reason fits me well, and it seems to assauge my thoughts on what a fine Va mount might have looked like as the opportunities for good pre-early war historical impressions abound.

[volcav]

Re: Horse Breed

I just reviewed this thread and wanted to bump it up for the new guys. Lots of good information from many sources.

[agintomboy]

Re: Horse Breed

This is a rather late comment on this excellent thread:) With regards to the breeds that were contemporary in the Civil War, besides the TB and gaited the breeds, one horse I can personally recommend is the Canadian. I have been the proud owner of Zephyr who is 28 years young today for the last 4 years. He was retired from Colonial Williamsburg and was given to me by Joyce Henry head coachman and the head of the Coach and Livestock division. I use him lightly for driving only. The Canadian is a rare breed of which there are no more than 7000 head in the world. Norman, Spanish and Friesian horses were imported into New France (Quebec) during the 17th century from the stables of the King of France. These bloodlines merged into one as the breed was isolated from any new blood for 200 years. They were called the "Little Iron Horse" as they were hardy and versatile. They did everything from riding, plowing and driving. They are intelligent, quiet but aren't dead either :D They range from 14-16.2H, have "warmblood" bones, are mostly dark brown or black from the Friesian ancestry, have a very classic spanish or baroque body type with flowing wavy mane and tail, light feathers, rounded hindquarters with low set tail, arched neck and a flat side head profile. They have quite high action when trotting and cantering. The Morgan has been proven by DNA to be descended from the Canadian making the Canadian the great granddaddy of all North American light breeds. By the time of the CW, they numbered a quarter million but were devastated by the war and the subsequent mechanization of agriculture. By the 1970s there were only 400 purebreds left when concerned breeders started to organize and make a concerted effort to save the breed. As I indicated earlier, they are now close to 7000 but are still considered a threatened breed with regards to extinction. They make an excellent reenacting horse and one would be exactly accurate having one on the field. I believe Ken Morris rides one in the field. I have enclosed a couple of pics of Zephyr below.

Anita L. Henderson
Atlantic Guard Soldiers' Aid Society
13th Va Cavalry, Co. H., Light Sussex Dragoons-bugler

[agintomboy]

Re: Horse Breed

I forgot to add, Zephyr is only 14.3H but looks and feels like a much bigger horse! He is quite a ham as you can tell having been a liberty horse for several years prior to his 13 years at CW. He is a real schoolmaster and lets me know if I am doing something wrong, lunges with out a lunge line on voice command, loads well, no vices. No horse is perfect even Zephyr (thought he comes close!) The two problems with him is that he can spook to sound which means you don't totally relax on this guy ESPECIALLY if you are driving and he hates dogs! No foxhunting for him so I ride the g#$ d#%%## pony Fuzzy when in the hunt field!! All in all though, I feel honored and blessed to be the owner of this rare breed.

Anita