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**DBVaughn** · 06-06-2009, 11:53 PM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Dave
here is the Skirmishing section of Poinsetts school of the platoon mounted
Skirmishing. Below are some more direct answers to your questions.

572. The platoon being supposed to form a part of the squadron, it is dispersed as skirmishers, in order to cover the front and the flanks of the squadron. The platoon being in line at the extremity of the ground, the instructor causes the schabraques to be raised, the holsters uncovered, and the arms loaded; he marches the platoon forward, and when he wishes to disperse the troopers as skirmishers, he commands:
1. Six files from right�as skirmishers.
2. MARCH.
3. Guide right.
(Pl. 76.) At the first command, the file-closer places himself in front of the six files of the left, of whom he takes command. These six files are destined to support the skirmishers and to relieve them. At the command MARCH, the file-closer commands HALT to the six files of the left, and causes them to draw the sabre. At the same command, the six files of the right continue to march forward; after going 10 paces, they disperse as skirmishers, extending themselves so as to cover the supposed front of a squadron, in passing beyond each of its flanks. The right trooper obliques to the right, the left trooper to the left. The troopers of the rear rank come up as soon as possible, abreast of the front rank, each one placing himself on the left of his file-leader, and as soon as they are in line, all take the position of advance�CARBINE, or raise�PISTOL. They continue to march until the signal halt, No. 2. The instructor causes the halt to be sounded when the skirmishers are at 100 or 150 paces from the reserve. The troopers keep at 5 paces apart, regulating themselves towards the guide during the whole time they act as skirmishers. The assistant-instructor places himself in rear of the skirmishers, in order to superintend their movements.
573. The chief of the platoon, followed by his trumpeter, places himself half way between the skirmishers and the reserve; he moves along the line wherever he thinks his presence most necessary. The reserve and the skirmishers execute their movements at the signals of the trumpeter who follows the officer. If the chief of the platoon wishes the skirmishers to move forward, he causes the forward, No. 1, to be sounded; each skirmisher moves forward, regulating his movements by those of the guide and preserving his interval; the reserve follows them, keeping at its proper distance. To move the skirmishers towards the right, to the right, No. 4, is sounded; each trooper turns to the right and marches in the direction of those who precede him, taking care to preserve his distance ; the reserve also turns to the right. To face the skirmishers again to the front, to the left, No. 3, is sounded; the skirmishers and the reserve turn to the left. To move the skirmishers towards the left, to the left, No. 3, is sounded ; each skirmisher turns to the left and marches in the direction of those who precede him, taking care to preserve his distance. The reserve also turns to the Left To face the skirmishers again to the front, to the right, No. 4, is sounded; the skirmishers and the reserve turn to the right. If, after having turned to the right, the instructor wishes the skirmishers to move towards the opposite side, he orders the about, No. 5, to be sounded; the skirmishers and the reserve turn to the left-about, and move forward. If, after having turned to the left, the instructor wishes the skirmishers to move towards the opposite side, he causes the about, No. 5, to be sounded: the skirmishers and the reserve turn to the right-about, and move forward. During the flank movements, if the troopers are to continue firing, they leave the column and face the enemy for that purpose. As soon as they have fired, they resume their places in the column in doubling the gait. (Pl. 77.) The skirmishers are marching to the front or at a halt; if the instructor wishes the line to move to the rear, the chief of the platoon orders the retreat to be sounded. At this signal, the troopers of the front rank move forward 5 paces, fire, then turn to the left-about, in order to move to the rear, and retire loading their pieces. When they have marched 50 paces, or more if necessary, the chief of platoon causes the about, No. 5, to be sounded. At this signal, the troopers, who were retiring, face to the front by turning to the right-about. The troopers who are in the first line fire and turn to the left-about, retire in loading their pieces, pass in the intervals of the line which is in rear, move 50 paces farther, and face to the front at the signal the about, No. 5. The troopers of the line which is in rear, move 5 paces to the front the moment the troopers who retire pass into their intervals; they then commence firing by the flank indicated. The alternate movement of the two lines, continues as long as the skirmishers move to the rear. When the instructor wishes the retreat to cease, the chief of platoon orders forward, No. 1, to be sounded. The skirmishers who are in rear move up, in doubling the gait, abreast of those the most advanced, and all march forward until the signal to halt, No. 2, is sounded. If the instructor wishes the whole line of skirmishers to retire at once, he orders the about, No. 5, to be sounded. The reserve retires and faces to the front, regulating its movement by that of the skirmishers, so as to remain always at 60 paces from the 2d line. It executes its rear movement at the moment the retreating line passes into the intervals of the line which moves forward.
574. The rallying of skirmishers is always made on the point occupied by the officer. To rally the skirmishers, the officer places himself habitually in front of the reserve, and causes the rally, No. 6, to he sounded. At this signal the skirmishers turn-about, rally on the reserve by the shortest route, and draw the
sabre. If the officer is not with the reserve when the rally, No. 6. is sounded, the skirmishers rally upon him, and the reserve comes up and joins them. The troopers are thus exercised to rally upon any point whatever of the line.
575. If a defile is presented in advance of the front of the line, and orders are given to pass it, the troopers who are opposite first enter it; they are followed at some distance by the other troopers, who turn by trooper to the left and to the right, in order to put themselves in file. As soon as the first have passed the defile, they move 50 or 60 paces to the front; the others come up abreast of them in obliquing, those of the right to the right, and those of the left to the left. The reserve enters the defile when the first skirmishers have reconnoitred it. If the skirmishers are to pass a defile placed in rear, they commence by approaching it; when the reserve is at a suitable distance it passes rapidly, and posts itself 50 or 60 paces from, and an the side of the passage. The two troopers who are on the flank, turn-about to the left, move to the rear so as to arrive together at the entrance of the defile, which they pass immediately. They are followed closely by the other troopers, who execute successively the same movement; the centre troopers, who cover the defile, enter it the last. At the going out of the defile, the two troopers who are in front turn, one to the left and the other to the right; and when all the troopers have passed the defile, they stop at the signal to halt, No. 2, and face to the front. The instructor sometimes rallies the skirmishers immediately after having passed the defile, either to the front or to the rear.
576. These movements are at first executed at the walk, then at the trot, and finally, at the gallop. When the troopers have learned to perform these movements well, they are exercised at them in executing the manual of arms, and in firing; and finally, with the overcoats rolled and carried over the shoulder. When the troopers are at the gallop, and the instructor wishes them to pass to the trot, he orders the trot, No. 7, to be sounded; when they are at the trot, and he wishes them to pass to the walk, he orders the halt, No. 2, and then the forward, No. 1, to be sounded.
577. To commence or to cease firing, the signal is sounded [No. 9 and No. 24]. All the troopers do not fire at once, but one after another, commencing on the side of the guide. They afterwards continue firing without waiting for, or being governed by each other. Each rear-rank man has an understanding with his file-leader that, as far as practicable, the piece of one may be always charged while the other is loading; the troopers of the same file should give a mutual support to each other. When the platoon skirmishes without gaining ground to the front, the skirmishers should nevertheless keep in motion always; each trooper of the front tank, after having fired, moves some steps to the rear, at the same time loading his piece; and as soon as he returns to the line, the rear-rank man of the same file fires, and moves in his turn to the rear. In the charge as foragers, the men of the rear-rank approach within one or two paces of their file-leaders, to be able to support each other mutually. As soon as the skirmishers charge, the reserve moves forward to support them. The skirmishers retire by turning-about to the left, and face again to the front by turning-about to the right. When they have reformed in platoon, they return the pistol to the holster, or drop the carbine, and draw the sabre. (Lancers carry the lance.)
578. To relieve skirmishers, the instructor commands to the reserve:
1. Six files from left�as skirmishers.
2. MARCH.
3. Guide right.
At the command MARCH, the reserve disperses and moves up upon the line of old skirmishers. The right
trooper of the front-rank passes on the right of the right skirmisher of the front rank; the right trooper of the rear rank on the right of the right skirmisher of the rear-rank, and so on throughout, each one passing to the right of the one he relieves, and 5 paces beyond him. The old skirmishers turn-about, and rally at a gallop on the officer, who during the movement is placed at the point where the six files now become the reserve should reform. The non-commissioned officer who commanded the six files of the left, now takes command of the six files of the right. If there are two non-commissioned officers with the platoon, each one follows the portion of the platoon to which he is attached.

As to your questions :
"Once the Number 1, 2, & 3 men dismount and the horses have been taken to the rear by the #4 man, other than the basic commands while in formation such as Attention, Left face, Rest, etc, ... while moving the dismounted men to, or around the field (before dispersing them as skirmishers), am I correct to understand that all maneuvers on foot are the same as mounted? -- Ie; By file from the right, Form twos, On left into line, Front into Line, etc."

Yes the command are the same and noted above.

"Once deployed on foot and in line as skirmishers, would the field commands for maneuvering be; Forward, Halt, Left/Right about, Left/Right oblique, To the right/left, Retreat, Rally, Left or Right Wheel, forward quick time, common time, double quick, Charge. Is this correct? Did I miss any?"

Iam not sure you missed some but read abovefor those listed-- NOTE however That the horse gait commands are used to signal the trooper a speed of movement on the ground. They are to move at the walk , trot, gallop,and charge.

"Is "Advance Carbine" a command used to move the men forward as a line of skirmishers, or strictly a "position" to take while moving, such as "Carry Arms"?"

Advance carbine is a position to take while moving. to go fore ward the command is FOREWARD
MARCH

"Would dismounted troopers ever fire by Rank, File, or Company? Or fire from the right or left in intervals? (I'm guessing not -- I can not find this as a cavalry tactic, and it seems this would defeat the purpose of having a carbine.) "

Firing is governed by paragraph 577 above.

"Am I correct to believe that the "rolling block" or "leap-frogging" (where 1's fire, 2's move past and fire, etc.) as used by so many dismounted cav re-enactors, is NOT an actual CW cavalry skirmishing tactic? I have found no reference to it."

The last portion of paragraph 573 covers this.

"Is "load at will" the CW command for the term "fire at will"? Do the troopers load and subsequently fire at will? Is "fire at will" an accurate fire command?"

Paragraph 577 says when the signal is sounded the skimisher will begin firing with his front or rear rank partner. You could call this "fire at will". I will look futher for refernce say in in school of throoper dismounted to see if there is a correct wording for this action -- We use "Fire at Will"

"Would there be a case in which troopers on the battlefield were given the command to load and fire by the numbers? That is using the commands; Load, Charge Cartridge, Prime ... Ready, Aim, Fire."

I cannot concieve of a situation where Skirmishers would take that much time to do so. I believe those are in the school of the troper dismounted for training purposes.

Happy training--
Mark Hess

**DaveGink** · 06-07-2009, 08:36 AM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Thanks Mark!! You helped greatly. I really appreciate that!!!

One question that I guess I wasn't clear on however, was regarding the "leap frogging" tactic. I understood that it was used in retreat, however I frequently see it used at reenactments in an advance towards the enemy. I guess my belief that this is inaccurate is a correct one.

Though this leads me to another question ... The retreat as taught in Poinsett's starts with the men in two ranks. The first rank moves forward 5 paces, fires, then 'left-about' to the rear, the 2nd rank fires, and repeats. If the men are in a single rank, would it be acceptable to move in retreat by their file numbers, 1, 2, and 3s?

EDIT: I reviewed the plate illustration for this and see that the wording was what was confusing me. When the manual spoke of the front rank men retreating first, it was talking about those 1,2,& 3 men who HAD been in the front rank prior to coming into line as skirmishers, not that the skirmishers were actually in two ranks.

Also, what do you think the point was in the reserve drawing their sabers? Wouldn't this be a problem if they needed to move up into firing positions quickly to replace the skirmishers?

As to firing, I now understand why there is no need to issue the command "fire at will", as 577 explains, after the command of "commence firing" the first volley is taken in turn one after the other, starting from the side of the guide, and then after that the men automatically go on to "fire at will" ("without waiting for, or being governed by each other"). though each file pair works as a team. (Thanks Mark for helping the light to go there.)

Another question; in section 572, the (in this case 6) files that are advancing as skirmishers, as soon as they are in line they take the position of "advance�CARBINE, or raise�PISTOL". Is this position (advance carbine, or raise pistol) pre-determined by a command, or dependent upon the weapon that the trooper is carrying? The manual doesn't really make this clear.

**DaveGink** · 06-14-2009, 07:56 PM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Well, I'll try re-posting these remaining questions and see if anyone can answer them ...

� In section 572, Poinsett's calls for the reserve to draw sabres even though they are in formation dismounted. Wouldn't this be a problem if they needed to move up into firing positions quickly to replace the skirmishers?

... Yet, In section 578, there is no mention of the reserve returning sabres when commanded to move up to relieve the skirmishers.

... And in section 574, when the initial skirmishers are commanded to Rally on the reserve, after falling in with them, they are to draw their sabres. Again, why?

� In section 572, as soon as the 6 files that are advancing as skirmishers are in-line, Poinsett's calls for them to go to the position of "advance�CARBINE, or raise�PISTOL". Which would it be and why? Is this position (advance carbine, or raise pistol) pre-determined by a command, or dependent upon the weapon that the trooper is carrying? The manual doesn't make this clear.

And I'm assuming that prior to coming in line as skirmishers (and before going to advance carbine or raise pistol) they are still at the position of carried arms?

� It's clear that the Instructor (also called 'The chief of the platoon') is an officer (I'm assuming a Captain in the field). I gather that the 'File Closer' (who takes command of the reserve) is an NCO. What rank would the Assistant Instructor be in the field (last paragraph of section 572, in position directly behind the line of skirmishers) ? A Junior officer or NCO?

Lastly, who would be holding the horses of the Instructor, Assistant Instructor, Bugler, and File closer in actual field practice? Would there be an additional man to take them, or would four of the horse holders take one additional horse?

**Swisscavalryboy** · 06-16-2009, 03:31 PM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Hello Dave

I will try to give an answer to your several questions:

1. You are right, section 572 is as well applicable for the school of the platoon dismounted as when mounted (section 239 refers to section 571ff). But nevertheless it makes no sense to stand in the countryside on foot with a drawn sabre, because you cannot charge without the mount. In my opinion, the school of the platoon (or squadron) dismounted was more an aid for the instruction without any great tactical use in the field. Dismounted fighting in the field was practiced in the "Dragoon-manner", prescribed after section 578 (there is unfortunately no extra section number) and in this kind of fighting on foot, the sabers were never drawn (again unfortunately not mentioned, but at least I cannot find any command to draw them). But there are any interesting sections in Cooke's Tactics: Section 75, the practice of field movements on foot is useful for the instruction of young officers and men, and when, for any reason, mounted exercises are not practicable....Section 425. If, in a squadron, one or two platoons are to dismount...... At the first command, the commander orders the sabres to be returned.....

2. The reason for the recurring orders for the reserve to draw the sabers in Poinsett's is in my opinion, that the main assault tactic maintained by this manual is the charge (Poinsett was published in 1841 and bases upon translated French manuals from ???, maybe 1825 or 1830 and at this time, the prospects to made a successful charge were much greater than in the times of the civil war).

3. Advance�CARBINE or raise�PISTOL? The reason for this option is in my opinion the fact, that the Poinsett's manual was initially written for all kind of cavalry (Dragoons, Cuirassiers, Lancers, etc.) which all were differently armed. Sections 402 to 405 would make clear the matter. But with that, the answer is not yet given, which command would be the correct one for the typical trooper in the civil war. Before reading Cooke I clearly intended to "advance-CARBINE", because they were weaponed with carbines. But Cooke, Section 296 mentions: ... as soon as they [the skirmishers] are in line they return sabre, and take the position of raise-PISTOL. So I am a little bit confused. But there is perhaps another one here who could find an answer.

4. The Instructor would be a Lieutenant (as all 4 platoons of a squadron were commanded by a Lieutenant). I assume that the position of the Assistant Instructor in this respect would not be occupied in the field as he supervises the movements only and is not responsible for any command.

5. The instructions about the horse-holders of the officers and trumpeters are mentioned (in respect of the squadron) just before section 756. I think that they were adopted for a platoon acting singly, while not mentioned separate for the platoon.

I hope that my answers are helpul for you.

Markus Ruegger

**Andrew German** · 06-16-2009, 07:38 PM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Hi Dave,

Haven't had a chance to check in since Gettysburg. Hope you're well.

I followed your discussion on the cavalry forum but will answer a few things here. First, a correction for one of the contributors over there: a pace is 3 feet, not 3 yards, so shorten the distances.

Second, fighting on foot became increasingly common, but at least a company, if not a full battalion or more, would be held in reserve with sabres drawn to charge if the skirmish line were broken. Individual troopers were not detached from the reserve to fill in on the skirmish line; if ammo were low one company would replace another.

Commands were conveyed by bugle from the unit commander down to the captain commanding each portion of the skirmish line. The captain was normally posted behind the line in the middle, with a company bugler to echo the commands ordered from above.

Notice that Poinsett's keeps the weapon hand toward the enemy. When retiring, you advance 5 paces, fire, and turn left about (right hand to the enemy), and then turn right about (weapon side) in the new position.

Here's part of how one participant later described the process:

"Numbers 1,2 and 3 of each set of fours,...dismounting, linked their horses,...No. 3 handing his reins to No. 4, who remained mounted, and three-fourths of the command became available for the work in hand. The men then formed quickly into line, and were deployed in extended order upon the center skirmisher or the right or left skirmisher, by each man obliquing at once to gain the interval....In less than half a minute a troop could dismount and deploy as skirmishers.

"When the cavalry was dismounted, the horses were sent to the rear to take advantage of the nearest shelter from the enemy's fire, No. 4 having no difficulty in managing the three horses intrusted to him, or in moving them from place to place at any gait. In case a retreat became necessary, portions of the dismounted men would fall back alternately, taking new positions in rear, assisted by artillery, until it was possible to mount and retire without interference."<Louis H. Carpenter, "Sheridan's Expedition Around Richmond, May 9-25, 1864," Journal of the U.S. Cavalry Association 1:3 (November 1888): 302-03.>

Hope it all works out in the field.

Andrew German

**1sgtscot** · 06-16-2009, 09:30 PM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Andrew,

Thanks for the correction. I knew one pace is 3 feet, but typed yards. My mistake, sorry.

Sgt Scott

**T.Kern** · 06-17-2009, 12:25 PM

Re: Dismounted Basics

excellent post by Mark and andrew, this is the kind of documantationb that all post should have. Poinsette's volumnes provide the answers for everything, if we could just get more people to read them.

Whenever you hve men fighting on foot you keep a mounterd reserve to be throw in where needed. This works quite well for regiments, especially in the south, who were short on arms. The regiment is dividied between sabre and sharpshooter companies.

firing- The command in Patton's, abreviated Poinsette's, for firing is, commence firing.

advance carbine or raise pistol- would depend on the weapon carried ( maybe differnece between pre-war cavalry proper or dragoons, the reader would know which for his regiment. ). I beleiev it would automially be the carbine for long range work, if they were equiped with them. Probasbaly drilled that way...SOP's. Now I need to go dig out my Poinsette's and look, just what I didn't want...more useless work.

Linking horses; at minimum, in fed cav, only the 2 and 3 man needs a link strap. As they are the ones who face their horse, unhook the strap and hook the curb ring of the horse to their left. I note, curb ring on the bit! This provides more control of the linked horses, stopping any who move forward but not when No.4 moves them forward. The southerners simple tied reins as directed in the manuals, 1 to 2's halter, 2 to 3's halter, and 3 hands his to 4.
Todd Kern

**Tom Craig** · 06-18-2009, 07:35 AM

Re: Dismounted Basics

Originally posted by DaveGink View Post

Well, I'll try re-posting these remaining questions and see if anyone can answer them ...

... And in section 574, when the initial skirmishers are commanded to Rally on the reserve, after falling in with them, they are to draw their sabres. Again, why?

� It's clear that the Instructor (also called 'The chief of the platoon') is an officer (I'm assuming a Captain in the field). I gather that the 'File Closer' (who takes command of the reserve) is an NCO. What rank would the Assistant Instructor be in the field (last paragraph of section 572, in position directly behind the line of skirmishers) ? A Junior officer or NCO?

Lastly, who would be holding the horses of the Instructor, Assistant Instructor, Bugler, and File closer in actual field practice? Would there be an additional man to take them, or would four of the horse holders take one additional horse?

Dave,

Good questions! On the sabre, remember that at the time of the CW the guiding philosophy was that that arm was still the preferred one for cavalry. The reserve guards against sudden attack or other military disaster, and exists to exploit enemy weakness as it develops. Cavalry's value as "shock troops" means that there is little more shocking to the enemy than a well executed sabre charge.

Based on the positions of the officers of a company I would say that the "assistant instructor" would be, in the case of a single company, a LT, or in the case of a squadron, the junior Capt. If you look at the break down of company officer positions that seems to make the most sense.

As far as holding the horses: From what I understand the commander and the bugler remain mounted, remembering that with a much larger unit than we use in reenacting that mounted command is more practical than dismounted. As far as the other file closers etc, I'm not sure.... anyone have any evidence either way?

Take care,
Tom Craig
1st Maine Cavalry

**rbruno** · 06-18-2009, 08:48 AM

Re: Dismounted Basics

I have read the 5 pace advance to fire and then fall back. What is the advantage/reason for the the 5 paces forward only to turn and retreat back to another location behind the line?

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