D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

[emartinez]

Hi,

Something big and shiny that I have always wanted is a monster copy of a D-guard Bowie, authentic pattern of course. However, I cannot find any references to such a weapon/tool in a CS Western Theater cavalryman's kit.

Does anyone have any thoughts on the appropriateness of a D-Guard Bowie on the belt, on the saddle or in the saddlebag of a CS trooper?

If this is not authentic, what would a trooper have used for chopping (limbs, kindling, etc) and digging?

Thanks!

[Tom Craig]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Hey Ernie,

I will start off by saying that I know very little about CS cavalry and Bowie knives, so I won't even begin to address that part of your question beyond saying that your impression should be guided by the period record of the unit(s) that you are portraying at a given event.

You did ask about what they would use for digging and chopping and pardon the pun, I'll take a stab at that! Among the Federal services, and I am sure it was the goal in the CS there were stores of axes, shovels etc for use on the regimental if not company level. These generally were not carried by regular rank and file soldiers. They may have been carried by so called "pioneer" units, but I'm no expert in that so I want to leave that to someone who knows what they are talking about.

You'll really find precious little evidence or reference to cavalry troopers chopping wood or digging much of anything. I am certain that the odd fellow here and there carried a small hatchet or something like that, but that would be the exception rather than the rule.

You can ask yourself, beyond possibly a latrine what else would horse soldiers need to dig on a regular basis? You could suggest intrenching later in the war, but by then the Bowie knife would be pretty rare. In terms of chopping, the obvious answer would be fire wood, but I would like to see a reference or two about the need to chop wood while on active campaign. I can't say that I've ever seen a period reference to cavalry troopers chopping fire wood while on active service. Winter quarters yes, but by then they'd have ready access to actual tools.

In the experimental archeology of reenacting, my unit has been going campaign style for years at most events, and there has seldom been any need for a hatchet, shovel etc beyond using one as a hammer (which a Bowie knife doesn't do too well for).

Again, I'm no expert on CS stuff, so maybe the story is different on the grey side, but I am betting not so much.

Take care,
Tom Craig
1st Maine Cavalry

[ButtermilkRanger]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Ernie,

Welcome to the forum. IMO, less is more. Why would you want to add that extra weight to your kit when the knife really doesn't serve any added purpose? Personally, I have not seen any photographic or primary source evidence that big bowie knives were carried beyond the first few months of the war. As the war progressed, the cavalryman learned to travel extremely light and to make do with as few luxury items as possible. I would think that a big bowie knife would have been one of the first things to go. Just my opinion of course.

BTW, they do look cool, but why are we doing this? Is it for show or to portray the 19th century Confederate cavalryman as accurately as possible?

[Andrew Kasmar]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Here are a few photos of Confederate Texas cavalry, who appear to be carrying large side knives. The Confederate second from the left maybe carrying a sword or sabre bayonet. Not sure how common it was, but there are some photos.

[Mike Ventura]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

There are some isolated references of CS troopers carrying knives - Bowie models included - in some of the Texas CS cav units - specifically the Eighth Texas and Shannon's Scouts. While there may be some period CDV evidence, one must ask whether those are photographers' props or the actual equipment of the person being photographed. So, if you are portraying Terry's Texas Rangers, maybe.

In David Evan's excellent Sherman's Horsmen, documenting the campaign of Sherman's Federal cavalry during the Atlanta Campaign, there are several references of pack mules being part of the column to carry such equipment as axes and shovels. Shovels were more used for burying the dead than entrenching.

I vote with Larry, less is more!

[emartinez]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Gents,

Thanks all for your replies, and particularly the photos...very cool! I appreciate the observations about "historical accuracy" versus "so pretties"...my motivation for making the inquiry was based on my strong position on the former over the latter, and I direct...or divert as my wife would choose to view it!..a goodly amount of modern Greenbacks to stay historically accurate when "cheap and purdy" would be easier but at the sacrifice of authenticity.

Please keep the hard information coming on this issue, as I do not want to "saddle myself"...pardon the pun.. with inaccurate equipment. Now that I think of it, as I recall, when General Forrest was shot by one of his men in his office, he drug the fella over the desk, pulled out his pen-knife and killed his assailant!

So, maybe what I should carry is a period pen-knife! Anybody seen a period piece available lately!

Thanks again for your courtesy.

[Ken Myers]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Look in a book called "Collecting the Confederacy". There is a chapter on Bowie knives. In this chapter, you will find a number of Bowie knives that were carried by Confederate Cavalrymen. All items in this book have been documented.
Thank you,
Ken Myers

[csabugler]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Remember the "typical and customary" role. A few guys started out the war with steel breast plates, and one might do an early war event and portray fellas who were documented to have those. But that would not be considered t &c in the vast majority of events.
I have carried a small side knife in the saddle for years, maybe a 4" blade. It's usually the only one in our mess, possibly in the whole column. I've loaned it many more times than I have used it. My point is1 knife in a set, squad, or company has usually been enough.
Mike Ventura mentioned some texas units, but I see you do a Tennessee impression , so that reference would not be really justification.
"Typical and customary" and "less is more" will get you into the quality of events that most of here us get excited about.

[emartinez]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

They are BIG pieces of equipment, and one of the reasons I was asking was because in thinking through gear carry and placement, I was at a loss to see where something like that might go other than being attached to the saddle and/or carried like a saber...unless it was packed away somewhere, which wouldn't make too much sense.

So, the "less is more" approach is probably the most sound. Of course, taken to the logical conclusion, this philosophy could lead to the portrayal of one of the many Tennessee troopers who supposedly didn't carry ANY weapons - because they didn't have one - and presumably served as horse holders!

Not quite ready for that yet!

[csabugler]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Three banders or nothing at all was very common. Certainly for CS.

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Hallo!

Aside from the limited martial fad of the early War year(s), I might would add that if a bowie knife is not just for effect or "jewelry," in actual use aside from cutting down saplings or severing heads or limbs, the "weapon" is a very poor and heavy choice for a utilitarian "tool" for campaigning and living in the field.

;) :)

Curt

[ContinentalMorganGuard]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Not sure if this really applies but I know I was at the Harrisburg Civil War Museum and they had a VERY Large D-Guard Bowie used by an Eastern Confederate Cavalryman dated to 1864. I would say the whole thing was close to 30 inches. I'm not sure if the documentation said this part or was my inference, but he may not have carried a saber since his "knife" was so long and so wide. I know this may have been the exception and not the rule, but a very interesting item, wish I had a picture to show.

[ButtermilkRanger]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Ernie,

I must have overlooked it the first time, but I see you're a recruit with the 7th Tenn. In that case, I'd suggest you utilize your chain of command and see what your unit recommends. In our mess, if we are on a campaign that may require something out of the ordinary (like a knife larger than a pen knife), then we designate one individual to carry that item and we share it within the squad. It works great for us and I believe it is the most historically accurate way to do it as well.

I've been in the hobby long enough that I've got all sorts of neat little trinkets that I thought I just couldn't live without. Mostly they just sit in the closet collecting dust. I use only the bare basics and leave the rest at home. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[mslaird]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

Hallo!

Aside from the limited martial fad of the early War year(s), I might would add that if a bowie knife is not just for effect or "jewelry," in actual use aside from cutting down saplings or severing heads or limbs, the "weapon" is a very poor and heavy choice for a utilitarian "tool" for campaigning and living in the field.

;) :)

Curt

I would have to concur, though I have seen primary source evidence that large knives were carried more than just during the early war period. However, the huge d-guard bowies and bowies with the forearm length blades were not utilitarian and did go by the wayside.

I have my GGG Grandfather's side knife and I have seen many a knife from the period and the majority of them are the 5-7" blade length, utilitarian knives that one would have found on just about any rural farm. They do prove to be useful for quite a bit of idifferent camp functions and the weight is not so bad, however, it is a rather difficult proposition to find an authentic reproduction of one. Now if one knows a blacksmith and has a couple of old files handy, one could be made that is a very close approximate of that type of knife. Or, trying to obtain an old Sheffield from the mid nineteenth century is an option as well. Once in a while those go for a reasonable price.

[Bob McLendon]

Re: D-Guard Bowie in Cavalry Kit?

My great grandfather served in the 53rd Alabama Cavalry, and he went off to war in 1862 with a large D-guard bowie that he had made at the blacksmith shop in Ramer, Alabama in south Montgomery County. He carried it for a very short time before sending it home because it wasn't really useful for a cavalryman. I have a picture of it, with the leather scabbard, in my book on the 53rd Alabama.

Bob McLendon
Phillips (Georgia) Legion