Horsemanship and Horsemastery

[ButtermilkRanger]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

I personally think that this conversation would have been a hot topic of debate even among the CW cavalryman. At least in the regular army where so many men were from different backgrounds and life experiences. In my opinion, it's the life experiences that really take us to the next level. Casey, coming from his background, has a different viewpoint in how to start a horse than, say, Bill or Mark. It's not that Casey's way is necessarily better, it's just that it's better for Casey. I'm sure if Casey left Montana and suddenly found himself in south Louisiana, he'd swear he was on a different planet because the difference in terrain. Yet our philosophies (and to some degree) and experiences with horses as tools are similar enough that we'd almost immediately have common ground.

I think so much of it has to do with what a horse is being used for. Is it just transportation like in a trail ride on a Saturday afternoon with the family? Is it your livelihood, like dragging logs out of the woods? Is it a tool, like working cattle? Or is it a pet? The pet part I can't comprehend, so don't ask me anything there. Dogs are pets. Horses are tools. Well, for most people dogs are pets. My dogs are tools as well. Maybe moreso than my horses, but that's a different subject.

Bill makes a good point about balance and the military seat, but I'm with Zack about the actual and practical application in the field. At least in the western Confederacy, I believe these guys (like my daddy says) "came a' knowin', not a' learnin'". They didn't "study" whether or not they had balance or if their feet were in the proper position. They rode how they rode because that's what kept them from falling off. Granted, that probably meant that they had the proper balance, but that was because they'd learned through a lifetime of trial and error while trying to do a particular job what works and doesn't work.

I also agree with Bill that leg pressure, but also the use of the spur as a tool, not a torture, is paramount to putting bend in a horse. It's the bend that makes for a reined horse.

[volcav]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

For those of us who by circumstance have to board our horses I have a theory that the more knowledge you have in your head the better use you can make of your time in the saddle. Taking Mark's comment early on in the thread about points for new cavalrymen/reenactors; I believe that while nothing beats actual time with your horse be it on the ground or on in the saddle, studying the proper (time proven) ways of achieving what you want out of your horse can't be stressed enough. If you don't have time for the three hour minimum trip to the boarding facility (1/2 hour there, half hour parking catching grooming and tacking up, one hour in the saddle, half hour cooling off untacking and speaking briefly with owner of the facility, followed by another 1/2 hour home) but you do have a half hour or an hour to spend reading a book on training, a horse magazine, or watching a training video take advantage of it so you'll know better what your doing the next time you do get hands on time with your horse.

Something else I'd recommend to a new person is to find a mentor who already knows what you want to learn and don't be too hard headed to listen to them.

[The Egyptian Homeguard]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Larry, You be suprised... there are Dorrance/Hunt proteges starting TB colt in Ky and Brannaman works polo ponies in Fla. every year... They were actually going to keep him from playing polo in a plain snaffle until they saw him ride...

Mark, 3 one hour rides are better than 1 three hour ride. A rider is more likely to be consistant and fresh insted of frustrated. We all need to ride with attentiveness. If we have a rough day at work, it's likely our horse will have a rough day of riding... they pick up on our moods...

Bill, you said "I would agree with you to a point. The fellers back in ACW did not have the luxury of being taught or instructed in the "perfect military seat", save for officers, etc. However we do. How you sit or ride in the saddle effects not only your balance, but it also effects the horse." I would suggest more people riding bareback for a while. It will improve their seat and balance... if they don't get better, the ground will help them become better riders.

I can't say for sure when I took my first ride I was too young... I'd guess somewhere around 30-35 years ago... (I'm 38 now) I've ridden a lot of horses, too many to count. The biggest issue most riders have today besides their weight (too many are over) is the same issue renacting has with farbs and mainstreamers. They (the reenactors and riders) don't know the difference or just don't give a rat's a**...

Just deep thoughts from a shallow mind. Z

[wavey1us]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Larry, You be suprised... there are Dorrance/Hunt proteges starting TB colt in Ky and Brannaman works polo ponies in Fla. every year... They were actually going to keep him from playing polo in a plain snaffle until they saw him ride...

Mark, 3 one hour rides are better than 1 three hour ride. A rider is more likely to be consistant and fresh insted of frustrated. We all need to ride with attentiveness. If we have a rough day at work, it's likely our horse will have a rough day of riding... they pick up on our moods...

Bill, you said "I would agree with you to a point. The fellers back in ACW did not have the luxury of being taught or instructed in the "perfect military seat", save for officers, etc. However we do. How you sit or ride in the saddle effects not only your balance, but it also effects the horse." I would suggest more people riding bareback for a while. It will improve their seat and balance... if they don't get better, the ground will help them become better riders.

I can't say for sure when I took my first ride I was too young... I'd guess somewhere around 30-35 years ago... (I'm 38 now) I've ridden a lot of horses, too many to count. The biggest issue most riders have today besides their weight (too many are over) is the same issue renacting has with farbs and mainstreamers. They (the reenactors and riders) don't know the difference or just don't give a rat's a**...

Just deep thoughts from a shallow mind. Z

Zack,
Amen to that. Riding bareback will help improve riding and balance. In fact, if you read a few US Army training manuals, they suggested recruits to start riding/training with a blanket and a surcingle, then moving to a saddle with the stirrups crossed over the saddle, and then moving to riding the saddle with the feet out of the stirrups. All this would be done through all the gaits.
To tell the truth, I have been riding for 20 years and never took a lesson; however, through trial and error I have found what works best for me and my mount. Riding manuals, viewing videos and putting those items into practice have helped me along the way. Not to mention my wife and daughter (who are the horse people) kicking me in the stones when I screw up. Am I a "perfect" rider? NO, not by a long shot, I still have room for improvement. Hence the riding lessons on that damn flat seat saddle.
Just this last year, in order to prepare for the National Cavalry Competition, I started jumping with my horse. I rode both my McClellan and 1936 Phillips Saddle "learning" how to do this. Believe me, this was an eye opening experience for me. I started out reading what and how the military trained riders to jump and then put that into practice. Did I make mistakes? Hell yes. Did I fall off? Let me count the ways. But, I come away with knowledge and satisfaction of being able to guide my horse to the jump, jump a 2-3 foot fence, land without being in his mouth, and prepare for the next jump.

[Tom Craig]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Hey All,

I have to weigh in from a couple of different angles on this one. First angle, as someone who has made a pretty thorough study on eastern Federal cavalry. In the east at least, exposure to horses was common and everyday, like our exposure to cars. Everyone either has one, or has been moved by one in their life. That said, the average northeastern trooper didn't do a ton of riding before the war, and many knew little about how to ride upon joining the cavalry. There were absolutely people who did, and many men, officer and enlisted, were actually skilled equestrians, but the average experience level was well below expert.

In the 1st Massachusetts Cavalry regimental, a fair amount of space is dedicated to annectdotal stories about horses and it is mentioned in more than one place that certain horses were given to certain men because others couldn't ride them. One trooper was described as having been a jockey before the war, and even still he managed to get run off with at one point during one of the regiments drills. The regimental does also discuss the fact that they trained at riding at the "ditch and the bar" which I would love to see done at a modern reenactment, to see how many of us could hang on, never mind doing it on a company front! There is ample evidence that jump training paid off as there are numerous stories of men escaping death or capture in combat by leaping over fences etc.

The second angle I have to take is as a modern rider. I started riding and reenacting as a teenager, who didn't own his own horse. I rode every crazy, one eyed, broken down three legged nasty horse you can imagine at events in order to have a chance to ride. In time, I did get my own horse, but I contend that those years spent riding whatever came along made me a MUCH better and more confident rider than if I had always ridden my own horse. Yes you form a bond with one horse. But you also come to depend and count on the quirks of that animal, and can fall back on "bad" bahvior because you know you can get away with it. When you ride different horses all the time, you have to be prepared for anything, and you learn to rely not on what your horse can/will do, but on your own skills to manage that animal in any given situation.

Several of the guys in my unit rent animals to do events, and don't get a chance to ride between events. That makes them low skilled and untutored equestrians at best. Still, inspite of that, they manage to not only stay on their animals, but to also be very effective reenacting troopers. I argue to some extent, that those guys, on their subpar animals are very authentic for Yankee troopers. CW cavalry horses were often ugly, and poorly treated beasts with a short life span, and the men who rode them used them as tools to accomplish a mission. Certainly many troopers formed relationships with their animals, and a very lucky few were able to ride the same horse throughout the war. But for most, the bond between man and beast was short in duration, and filled with a lot of misery and suffering, for man and beast. We, as modern riders have the luxury to become "skilled" riders and develop our technique, which is wonderful for our safety and enjoyment, but being a Civil War cavalryman was far from being safe, or very enjoyable on a regular basis.

Take care,
Tom Craig
1st Maine Cavalry

[Mike Ventura]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Tom -- Good points! Years ago, I read a report from the period regarding a green federal cavalry unit camped in the environs of Washington DC. If I am recalling correctly, early on, the troopers were assigned a horse and then were told to mount bareback. They rode something like 15-20 miles "out" and returned the same distance. Few made the entire trek mounted. It was said that troopers with horses, troopers, and single horses returned to camp over a period of a couple of days. Some troopers were battered and bloody and some horses never returned at all. That became the "bar" against which the rest of their training was measured, and nothing after ever seemed so severe.

[Doughboy]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

For those who don't have a horse but want riding experience may I suggest looking in your area for a horse rescue. There are many around the country and many will allow you to "foster" a horse for fairly little money. The horse will stay at the rescue farm. That fostering often gives the donor the opportunity to ride once or twice a week. This is a way to help both yourself and the animals. Here in MD I foster a horse and for 100 a month can ride twice a week. Trainers will usually match rider to horse. You will also work to maintain the animal. Valuable experience for little outlay of cash.

[Mark Choate]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Reading Tom and Mikes postings above caused me to remember a portion of the book, "Sherman's Horsemen" which gives the recollection of a Major with the 5th Michigan Cav (if memory serves me, I don't have the book with me at the moment) in which he describes forming the men and the horses up and "interspersing the green horses with the well-disposed ones" and then calling for the mount. At which time the most terrible clatter and jumping and bucking with blankets, cups, canteens and all going in every direction! It is a real hoot to read and any of you who have tried to slot in a group of new horses will feel for the good Major. :wink_smil

Mark

[Andrew German]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Greetings:

I'd like to endorse Tom Craig's points (and not just because he's my commander).

Any of us who care for horses would not treat them as was militarily necessary during the war. My great-granduncle (who was a farm boy familiar with horses) went through five horses in 1863 while serving in a Pennsylvania cavalry regiment in Virginia. Endless mud, lack of forage, various epidemics, remaining under saddle for days at a time, marching 35 dusty miles day after day, it's a wonder they were serviceable at all.

One of my favorite cavalry stories is the 3rd Pennsylvania's "appropriation" of another unit's horses during the Battle of the Wilderness. The other regiment (unnamed in the 3rd's regimental history) had come out from Washington with fresh horses and new equipment. On the night of May 7, as the two regiments passed on a woods road, many of the 3rd troopers jumped off their horses, knocked a rider out of the saddle, and rode off on the new, well-equipped horse.

I started riding ten years ago at a pretty advanced age. I quickly decided that English style puts one in close contact with the horse and requires one to develop the balance, light hands, and reliance on the leg that make for a light and agile rider. So I started riding hunter over fences. A good trainer or instructor can analyze and coach you into both the body control and the connection with the horse that will get you through a course. It's one thing to do it in the show ring, but the proof is in a real fox hunt (which I haven't had the opportunity to do yet), which is not unlike a cross-country cavalry chase. A couple of us in the 1st Maine are also trying polo, which can be rather reminiscent of a saber melee at speed.

I strongly agree with Tom that riding a variety of horses teaches the techniques and self-reliance necessary to be a thorough rider (and encourages the horsemanship aspect of being responsible to an animal even if you don't really like it). I've leased a few horses for a year or two, but overall I've ridden probably 75 different ones, and I can remember almost every one and what I learned from it. As Tom said, a number of us in the 1st Maine must rent, but we usually get the same batch of horses, and they are familiar enough with the owned horses that the group bonds as a cavalry company's horses would, and makes up the herd in which horses are most comfortable. At any rate, as Tom reminds us, "ride the horse!" We are the adaptable ones, and we'll only get more so by getting outside our comfort zones occasionally.

Finally, exhausted troopers were not the most gentle of men. I've read accounts of frustrated troopers breaking carbines and sabers over their horses' heads. But gentle firmness is the way to be with a horse. I am calm by nature and never blow up at a horse. I try to be consistent, and I do a good deal of ground work, leading, stopping, backing, pushing on the shoulder to sidestep. And in the saddle, serpentines, haunches in, shoulder in, sidepass, halt and back, all remind the horse to pay attention and make it feel confident that you won't surprise it. Verbal encouragement, a pat or scratch on the neck, these are other ways of communicating from the saddle to keep the horse relaxed and connected. And grooming is a very important way to develop mutual comfort and confidence between horse and rider. Whenever I have an hour lesson, I plan on a three-hour interlude with my horse.

So, perhaps ironically, we are probably better horsemen, in terms of understanding and properly caring for our animals, than those we portray.

Tallyho,
Andrew German

[Ken Knopp]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

By coincidence, David Jarnagin just sent me this link that has relevence here. It is from an 1850 British Cavalry Manual that goes into great detail about training horses for the saber, gunfire and the basics of horsemanship including mounting, bridleing, etc, etc. Good "early" stuff.....

Scroll down to section 11....

http://books.google.com/books?id=r1QBAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA10&dq=buff+sticks&hl=en&ei=1vlbTcXDDYW-tgfO6_jpCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCcQ6AEwADg8#v=onepage&q&f=false

Ken R Knopp

[Jerry Ross]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Boys,
I have been riding most of my life .Starting before I was out of my diapers. I have pictures to attest this . Never the less ,Dad showed me how to saddle a couple of times and told me to hang on tight and don't fall off.

Welllllll I have fallen off plenty of times and in front of many friends to attest to this too. I bought my first horse when I was 12. That mare kicked my tail several times, but I just got back on and kept getting on until I learned to stay on the horses back and not in the dirt.

Wellllll 31 years later I still get knocked in the dirt. This last time I got a concussion and black out for over an hour was found by a good friend who can attest to my loss of memory.

Wellllll Boys, we should all try to learn what we can to improve our skills, share skills and not look down at the fellas who don't posses the skills we have acquired over the many miles of trials, trails and tribulations.

Mark thanks for starting this thread it has been interesting reading ...

[Outrider]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Yes. What Jerry said. I have also been riding and familiar with horses from a very early age and have one way or another managed to make a meagre living with/for them much of that time and I always tell folks new to riding to ride as often as you can, and as many different horses as you can, learn to balance yourself so you are secure and not interferring with the horses movements, learn your cues, how to use them and always be deliberate and matter of fact in your manner around horses, be the kind boss, spend time just being around them on the ground making them move this way or that, always out of your way and that way you earn and keep their trust and I find you can get one to about anything you want him to do assuming he is sound and calm enough for you to begin with.

But this is all preaching to the choir here. but thats what I would have a newbie to horses/cav do before he ever thinks about toting a weapon and all manner of clnging things around in the field.

Outside of the obvious military training, I think we tend to overthink some of this stuff. I feel pretty confident that those guys didnt. If they new how to ride then they brought what they learned, or knew, with them, and it either helped them as cavalrymen or maybe they had to re-learn some things but either way, I think they were mostly were emotionally unattached to their mounts, used them hard, when it was killed, died or broke down then they got another and went on if they could at all.

Critter Company used to ride each others horses sometimes at drills. This was an excellent idea but not necessarily a good idea with larger numbers though that would be interesting and possibly entertaining.

[Mike Ventura]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Boys,


Wellllll 31 years later I still get knocked in the dirt. This last time I got a concussion and black out for over an hour was found by a good friend who can attest to my loss of memory.

Jerry - this explains a lot! ;-)

[The Egyptian Homeguard]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Jerry, you sort of summed up what I was trying to get across... Several of us (like the fellas of the 1860's) learned to ride the same way... hang on or eat dirt. We've ridden so long now it's natural to us. Ten years ago I'd ride anything with a mane and tail. Now I try to stay away from the bad ones, likely to try to split my skull or break my back , as I have little ones now. I don't mind a horse with a lot of spirit, I'd just like them to have about as much brains...

[Outrider]

Re: Horsemanship and Horsemastery

Amen to that Zack. Me too. No kids but I am trying hard not to add any new injuries to the collection. It happens and it can happen, and might, anytime anywhere with horses but I can at least tilt the odds in my favor a bit more nowadays.