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  • 11th Illinois Cavalry...

    I hve been reading Ho! For the War by Mark R. Dawson on the Eleventh Illinois Cavalry Regiment... It's more of a secondary source, but it is well documented. I thought these would be interesting in light of the up coming Shiloh event where some of us intend on portraying the 11th...

    “Nothing but sabers and revolvers. More than three months passed before we were issued anything else, and then only ten carbines were distributed for the whole company.”

    “I carried one [a saber] for four years and never drew it from the scabbard, except for drilling, or on parade”


    Pg.59, Sergeant Allen and Private Renick : a memoir of the Eleventh Illinois Cavalry, written by Henry A. Allen, and from the papers of Mother Bickerdyke : a three volume Civil War diary for 1862, 1863, 1864, written by John H. Renick

    "We arrived on the battlefield about 10:20 o'clock [pm] and didn't know whether we were going into our lines or theirs..."

    "Badly armed, they sat on their horses with revolvers their only weapons"

    “Just at this moment two of the men sent with the first companies came riding furiously back to camp – both wounded and one of their horses fell dead – having been struck by a piece of shell. At this time there appeared to be a general stampede of our forces… We immediately put ourselves across the road to stop the panic which we succeeded in doing.” – Colonel Robert Ingersoll, 11th Illinois Cavalry, (in a letter to his brother) April 11th, 1862

    From the same letter as above: “Four killed, one 1st Lieut.- twenty wounded and missing and had sixty-seven horses killed or wounded so as to be worthless.”
    [B][FONT="Book Antiqua"][SIZE="4"][I]Zack Ziarnek[/I][/SIZE][/FONT][/B]
    [email]ill6thcav@yahoo.com[/email]

    Authentic Campaigner since 1998... Go Hard or Go Home!

    "Look back at our struggle for Freedom, Trace our present day's strength to its source, And you'll find that this country's pathway to glory, Is strewn with the bones of the horse." Anonymous

  • #2
    Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

    Man, Zack, you're on a roll!!

    Any mention of what type of Carbines were issued when they did finally get them??

    Mark
    J. Mark Choate
    7th TN. Cavalry, Co. D.

    "Let history dictate our impressions.......not the other way around!"

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

      Dang! Slow down! Shiloh's not until 2012 :)
      Andrew Verdon

      7th Tennessee Cavalry Company D

      Tennessee Plowboy #1 of the "Far Flung Mess"

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

        "Recruits commenced going into camp at Camp Lyon, Peoria, about Nov. 1, 1861. Twelve full companies were recruited and mustered into the United States service by Capt. C.B. Watson, of the Fourteenth U.S. Infantry, mustering officer, on Dec. 20, 1861, when they were mounted. They remained at Camp Lyon until Feb. 22, 1862, when they broke camp and marched to Benton Barracks, Mo., where they arrived March 3, and were shortly after armed with revolvers and sabres, one Battalion receiving carbines.

        On March 25 the first Battalion, under Maj. Puterbaugh, embarked on a boat, and on the 26th the remainder of the Regiment followed.

        The First Battalion landed at Crump's Landing, Tennessee River, April 1, and joined the forces of Gen. Lew. Wallace. The remainder of the Regiment landed the same day at Pittsburg Landing, and camped about two miles from there. On the 4th were out a short distance on a scout, and their first experience under fire was when the fighting commenced on the 6th. Early on the morning of the 6th the Regiment lost several men in killed and wounded; among the killed was First Lieut. Richard Burns, of Company F."
        -History of Illinois Regiments

        Seems half the boys had them before Shiloh. Smith carbines are what you find in most info on the 11th. Just do a Google search and you'll see several accounts.
        Matt Woodburn
        Retired Big Bug
        WIG/GHTI
        Hiram Lodge #7, F&AM, Franklin, TN
        "There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

          Matt, the Dec to March would fit the three months with no carbines quote ... The information about a battalion receiving carbines is from the Illinois Adjutant General's Report. Overwhelming the Smith carbine is what was used… 339 Smiths vs. 19 Sharps and 222 .36 Colt revolvers. I can transcribe the Quarterly Ordinance Stores from the 4th qtr. 1862to the 3rd qtr. 1864 for the 11th if anyone would like… Z
          [B][FONT="Book Antiqua"][SIZE="4"][I]Zack Ziarnek[/I][/SIZE][/FONT][/B]
          [email]ill6thcav@yahoo.com[/email]

          Authentic Campaigner since 1998... Go Hard or Go Home!

          "Look back at our struggle for Freedom, Trace our present day's strength to its source, And you'll find that this country's pathway to glory, Is strewn with the bones of the horse." Anonymous

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

            Zack,
            Yes, could you please transcribe that and do it in Latin, please???

            Seriously, so as to get a refinement for the impression for Shiloh, how difficult would it be to look at the carbine only for all four quarters of 1862??

            Like I said earlier, I had you in mind when we selected an Illinois cav unit for this. Glad I did! :wink_smil

            thx,
            Mark
            J. Mark Choate
            7th TN. Cavalry, Co. D.

            "Let history dictate our impressions.......not the other way around!"

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

              Zack, I ordered the book today along with several others from a company that specializes in out of print books. One I picked up is "Sherman's Brigade" which is an acount of the Western Theater. Study, Study, Study...
              Dennis DeAtley
              North Texas


              I think I understand what military fame is; to be killed on the field of battle and have your name misspelled in the newspapers.
              [B]William Tecumseh Sherman [/B]

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                Mark, It appears that the Quarterly Ordnance Stores reports didn't begin for Illinois until the 4th Qtr. 1862 or at least that's where Arming the Suckers begins... it's a pretty through book, so if there is anything before that, I'm sure Baumann would have included it. So it appears what is listed below is what would have been on hand for Shiloh. Z

                Q.O.S. [11th] Cavalry 4th Qtr. 1862

                Sharps carbines.____________.52_______19
                Smith carbines._____________.50______339
                Colt revolvers.______________.36______222
                Remington revolvers.________.36_______36
                Whitney revolvers.__________.36_______45
                Dragoon sabers._____________________122
                Light cavalry sabers.___________________96
                [B][FONT="Book Antiqua"][SIZE="4"][I]Zack Ziarnek[/I][/SIZE][/FONT][/B]
                [email]ill6thcav@yahoo.com[/email]

                Authentic Campaigner since 1998... Go Hard or Go Home!

                "Look back at our struggle for Freedom, Trace our present day's strength to its source, And you'll find that this country's pathway to glory, Is strewn with the bones of the horse." Anonymous

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                  what remington revolvers are they referring to?
                  Cpl. Joseph Lambert
                  7th TN Co.D

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                    The was a 1858 Remington made in .36 Navy...
                    [B][FONT="Book Antiqua"][SIZE="4"][I]Zack Ziarnek[/I][/SIZE][/FONT][/B]
                    [email]ill6thcav@yahoo.com[/email]

                    Authentic Campaigner since 1998... Go Hard or Go Home!

                    "Look back at our struggle for Freedom, Trace our present day's strength to its source, And you'll find that this country's pathway to glory, Is strewn with the bones of the horse." Anonymous

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                      This is from Chicago Tribune, January 30, 1862, pg. 4, col. 2-3.
                      TURNER & SIDWAY, NO. 208 RANDOLPH STREET.

                      Among the houses engaged in the manufacture of military equipments is that of Turner & Sidway, No. 208 Randolph street. This firm have for the last three years, and previous to the rebellion, been engaged in the general saddlery jobbing trade, making all articles in their line upon their own premises, with the exception of whips. In May, 1861, they abandoned their legitimate business and entered exclusively upon the manufacture of military equipments. The first contract filled was one for Capt. Barker’s Dragoons, on an order from the Quartermaster’s Department of the State of Illinois. Since that time they have manufactured and sold 12,260 full sets of cavalry equipments, of which number 5000 were the “McClellan,” and 7,260 the “Grimsley.” Of these 1,156 sets were furnished the 11th Illinois Cavalry, Col. R. I. Ingersoll, on an order from the United States; 1,156 went to the 3rd Iowa Cavalry, Col. Cyrus Bussey, on an order from the same source; 400 to the 2nd Iowa Cavalry, Col. Elliott, upon a Government order; 200 to the Iowa 1st Cavalry, Colonel Fitz Henry Warren; 200 to the 36th Illinois Regiment, Col. Greusel; (this was an Infantry Regiment with two Companies of Cavalry attached) 453 to the 3rd Wisconsin Cavalry, Col. W. A. Barstow, on an order from Capt. Trowbridge, U.S. Quartermaster; 176 to the U. S. Quartermaster’s Department at St. Louis, on the order of the late Col. Webb; 500 to the State of Ohio; 1,100 to Col. Dickey’s 4th Illinois Cavalry, on the order of the U. S. Quartermaster; and 6,909 to ex-Governor Wood, and by him distributed to the several Illinois Regiments. Officers’ equipments have been furnished, among others to Generals Prentiss, Paine, Pope, Palmer, Hurlburt, Colonels Wyman, Barstow, Ingersoll, Dickey, Greusel, Wood, Parker and Marsh. The amount received for ordinary cavalry equipments is $32.35 each. Officers pay from $75.00 to $95.00 each, according to the degree of ornamentation bestowed. They have furnished 1,000 sets since the 1st of January, 1861, at $29 per set__two dollars less than the army regulation price, as revised November 5th, 1861; and they are also at work upon a contract for 5,000 more, for supplying regiments and parts of regiments now being raised in different parts of the State. These are the “McClellan” equipments, and are furnished at the reduced rate above mentioned, showing a reduction to the State of the neat little sum of $12,500 from the regulation price.

                      Brian Baird

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                      • #12
                        Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                        Brian,

                        This is both interesting and timely as we prepare to portray the 11th Illinois Cav at Shiloh. I have read the above a couple of times and did not see how they divided out the issuance of the Macs and the Grimsleys. Of the 12,260 total sets, when they say the 11th under Ingersoll received 1,156 sets, do you know how many were which saddle?

                        Also, Zack on the side conversation that you and I have been having, I would say that the variance that the officers paid, mentioned near the end ("Officers pay from $75.00 to $95.00 each, according to the degree of ornamentation bestowed.") must be for the schabraque and how it was to be dressed out. That fits with Dougs explanation.

                        Nice post and thanks,

                        regards,
                        Mark
                        J. Mark Choate
                        7th TN. Cavalry, Co. D.

                        "Let history dictate our impressions.......not the other way around!"

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                          Mark,
                          Really not sure if the receive the Mac or Grimsley.
                          Brian

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                          • #14
                            Re: 11th Illinois Cavalry...

                            I can't say for sure, but I would be the 11th recieved McClellans... The 1st ILL and 2nd ILL were issued Mac's, the 3-8th ILL cavalries recieved Grimsleys. Unfortunately, the regimental history of the 11th has nothing much on horse equipments issued. I'm still hoping to get into some of the primary accounts that were used to write it... Brian thanks very much for sharing this... Z
                            [B][FONT="Book Antiqua"][SIZE="4"][I]Zack Ziarnek[/I][/SIZE][/FONT][/B]
                            [email]ill6thcav@yahoo.com[/email]

                            Authentic Campaigner since 1998... Go Hard or Go Home!

                            "Look back at our struggle for Freedom, Trace our present day's strength to its source, And you'll find that this country's pathway to glory, Is strewn with the bones of the horse." Anonymous

                            Comment

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