Interesting saddles

[Mike Ventura]

There are some interesting saddles in this collection. I particularly like the Texas/Hope shown here. Thoughts?

http://manions.com/bid/bid.aspx~itemid~6129593~pic~20130818

Here's the entire catalogue:

http://manions.com/catpages/itemsspecial2c.aspx~cattype~6~closingtoday~false~newtoday~false

[Jerry Ross]

Re: Interesting saddles

I like the artillery saddle on the site even more. Thanks for sharing Mike!

[IowaYank]

Re: Interesting saddles

Would the artillery saddle be the same thing as a wagon saddle? I picked one up off of ebay a couple months ago. Need to get a single billet girth on her and I should be able to take her for a spin. Hopefully can ride it at Chickamauga.

Dan

[Mike Ventura]

Re: Interesting saddles

Jerry - I agree! That artillery saddle is a terrific find and seems to be in great shape. I was interested in the tooling on the saddle bags. First time I've seen that.

[Mark Choate]

Re: Interesting saddles

Good post, Mike and some interesting photos.

I love the Texas saddle as well, although I am not 100% convinced that this particular one is not a post war saddle. There are a few things on it that lend me to think post war. When Herr Meister Knopp returns from sunny Sicily, (ya can't hide money, ha) then we will get his ruling on the matter as I pale in comparison to his knowledge.

Dan, as to your question, while they are usually similiar, the wagon saddle is not ALWAYS an artillery saddle and vice versa. While they will often share traits and characteristics (like longer skirting, etc.), they are not synonymous. Check out the photos below of a classic "wagon" saddle (Kilgore) which could serve as an artillery saddle and a Grimsley artillery saddle (which differs from the deeper seated and higher pommel/cantle of their dragoon version). I think the German arty saddle in Mike's attachment lends yet another angle on this matter. You would be good with using a wagon saddle at Chickamauga.

regards,
Mark

[Mike Ventura]

Re: Interesting saddles

Mark - My thoughts also on the Texas, but it sure is interesting! Can't wait to see what Ken has to say.

[Mike Ventura]

Re: Interesting saddles

Why is something in my brain screaming "REPRODUCTION" on this one? ANd what is the funky saddle-bag behind the 1859 bag?

http://manions.com/bid/bid.aspx~itemid~6129613~pic~20130808

[Mark Choate]

Re: Interesting saddles

Good eye, Mike.

While the tree looks pretty good, the pommel angle is a little different, but not enough to cause concern for an Allegany. What makes it scream to me is the gauge and weight of the leather used in the skirting, hoods, etc. Those are modern looking cuts, to me. I think you are correct in your assessment, Mike.

As to the bags in the back, I have seen "utility bags" of weird make and style that officers would have that were made to carry more awkward items, such as binoculars. These would be perfect in design for a good fit like that. If you remember that many if the items that the officers had were of private purchase and design (ie. many of the shabraues, the funky brass-heart breast strap, many pommel holsters, etc.) so, even with the Federal cav which is usually much more predictable than their CS counterparts, you cannot nail down all of those officers to absolute standards in all cases.

Well, I am rambling now.......

thx,
Mark

[Mike Ventura]

Re: Interesting saddles

Mark, my eye caught the same leather issues as you mentioned. Thanks for the explanation on the "utility bag." Had not seen that before.

[IowaYank]

Re: Interesting saddles

Thanks Mark. Seems very similar to the wagon saddle I picked up (less than $100 on Ebay awhile ago). Seems to be lots of variations in the shape and angles of the pommels/cantels.

The picture isn't the greatest but you can get the jist.
Dan

[Mark Choate]

Re: Interesting saddles

Oh that's a beauty, Dan.

A classic example. A few questions, if I may...

Is the understitching down below in pretty good shape or are you having to restitch? You mentioned converting it over to a single-billet. Are you doing the work or others? Also, is the leather on the seat and skirting fairly pliable and/or is there cracking? I am not trying to be nosy but have had several originals that those areas had to be dealt with and it can be important as to the recovery process. Additionally, having made my share of mistakes, I always like to hear how others handle these issues as it is a good learning experience.

Thanks for the photo.

Mark

[IowaYank]

Re: Interesting saddles

Mark, it is at Paul's place right now. He was doing the work for me. The leather on the seat and skirts are very dry. It will be used for Living Histories/easy events, not hard campaigning. It's been at Paul's place for a bit, but it seems like the stitching on the padding on the underside was pretty good. Paul could chime in here if he likes, as he is doing the work!

Dan

[IowaYank]

Re: Interesting saddles

Mark, if you (or anyone else) has some voodoo magic for helping bring leather back to life I'd be up for suggestions!

[Mark Choate]

Re: Interesting saddles

Yes,.......take a dried monkey paw and sprinkle it with graveyard dirt....... :wink_smil

Seriously, this is a very, very important step and one that many mess up big time (speaking from experience). Some say to immerse or saturate the old leather in needsfoot or some similar oil. That is not good for many reasons and things will fall apart. Using either a quality balm or good oil (do not use neetsfoot compound) work very gradually with the leather and apply light coats and let them soak in and come back next day and repeatl. You will probably have to replace the load bearing portions (ie. billets, stirrup straps, etc.) regardless.

Since he knows so much about leather and leather care, I might suggest that you discuss it with David Jarnigan who may see this post and reply. If not, I can supply you his email offline.

thx,
Mark

[Forrestcavalryman]

Re: Interesting saddles

What I have done with my three originals is this: First, take a damp cloth and rub down saddle to clean old dirt off of the leather. Next I use spray saddle soap for a cleaning and finally use several light coats of Mink oil. Has worked like a charm for me!