AAR Bummers

[billwatson]

Re: AAR Bummers

"Hank,

The officers were not given any maps. We were not given any objectives. At one point most of the foraging parties of 3rd Div did strike out on their own. The problem was we were out of water and had no clue what direction to go. Additionally, when we did strike off on our own, we ended up being faced with crossing multiple hills and rough terrain with no water and even then it would have been a guess. We sent out scouting patrols only to have them come back with nothing found. We were way out of the game, lost and only got out because Jordan showed up and led us out. Next time, all officers need to be given a map (from the start).

Jim Butler "



Maps are a wonderful thing. I know of a couple of hundred Port Republic federals who would agree with that idea without any trouble at all. :-)

Jim, sounds like you applied some practical leadership and made the event come out right despite the obstacles. What's your big spring event? I'd like to tag along as a rear rank two again.

Also sounds like there was no context setting, eg, "Here's the situation and here's what we have to do about it and here's what your part of the whole big thing is." Some minor ambiguity is a wonderful element, but you guys seemed to be without an overall plan and without deliberate communication, the word seems to have gotten around almost accidentally. The solution remains the same: Whatever anybody is unhappy about is what that person needs to volunteer to help fix for the next time out of the box. When it gets right down to it, there isn't anybody but us.

[Bill]

Re: AAR Bummers

Was this for event related purposes ?

Thanks in advance.

Chris,

Of course this was an event related change in history. The participants had been climbing up and down hills for a day and a half. Many of us had to drive from 500 to a 1,000 miles to get home. Putting people on the road with only four or five hours sleep is just stupid. The Event Organizors made a common sense decision for the safety and welfare of the participants. I, for one, am very greatful for their decision.

[PogueMahone]

Re: AAR Bummers

Just a quick question: Who was the "creamy colored" fellow calling himself "Winthrop"? He had some of the best first person I've ever encountered. I never got his full story, but he appeared to be playing an escaped slave. His demeanor and speech was everything I would have expected of a "house servant named after the master".

[Hank Trent]

Re: AAR Bummers

Chris,

Of course this was an event related change in history. The participants had been climbing up and down hills for a day and a half. Many of us had to drive from 500 to a 1,000 miles to get home. Putting people on the road with only four or five hours sleep is just stupid. The Event Organizors made a common sense decision for the safety and welfare of the participants. I, for one, am very greatful for their decision.

Wasn't that an advertised and expected part of this (or any) campaign event, though?

So was the truce in the plans from the very beginning? Don't know why, I just thought it was a last-minute decision based on various unexpected issues that cropped up.

Otherwise, it sounds like picket duty should never be held Saturday at any nationally-advertised campaign event that's not on flat ground.

Military reenacting isn't really my thing, but my absolute favorite part is standing picket duty at night and the realism of an active enemy nearby instead of the mainstreamism of the other side camped in view and wandering over to visit. If enemy threats are eliminated from the hobby Saturday night, geez, there goes my last incentive. :(

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[Bill Cross]

Re: AAR Bummers

The solution remains the same: Whatever anybody is unhappy about is what that person needs to volunteer to help fix for the next time out of the box. When it gets right down to it, there isn't anybody but us.

Sadly, too few of us are willing to do Kabuki and not play. For that I take my hat off to Messrs. Tipton and Cornett and all the others who put on "Bummers." While looking cold-eyed at mistakes helps us all learn, hunting heads for blame is counter-productive at this point.

But to your point, Bill W, several of us Rowdy Pards have been talking for some time about an Early War Peninsula Campaign event. We would be happy to apply our learning from "Bummers" and other events, and are actively looking for anyone who would like to help us. Anyone ready to roll up their sleeves? Simply PM me here if it looks like your thing.

[PetePaolillo]

Re: AAR Bummers

So flat ground...no marchng and no picketts on sat night? Nahh!

[Matthew Young]

Re: AAR Bummers

Let me start out by thanking all the event organizers. I have put on events before and I can tell you it is no easy task!

I enlisted as a Private in Co. A (Poythress) of the 11th Georgia Militia. We were originally going to have 23 men and 2 officers. Instead, once we had all mustered up Friday evening, we had 11 men and 2 officers.

I have only done a few campaign style events before- Westville, Immortal 600, and Chickamauga, so it is still fairly new to me. I probably over packed a little bit. I had two haversacks (one for my modern medication and one for food), my knapsack which had a change of socks and long underwear, two groundcloths, and a blanket, my accoutrements, my canteen, and my 1842 musket. All in all, probably about 40 pounds.

Our designated 1st Sgt. could not come due to a family emergency, so Captain Poythress asked me to take over his duties. It didn't start well as I was having a little trouble remembering my Gilham's since I had used Hardee's the previous weekend and Scott's about three weekends before that.

At any rate we mustered up on a dark road, and the officers speechified while I handed out some small pieces of cornbread to the 11 enlisted men in Co. A. After a brief moment for torch lighting, we began our march up the hill and towards who knows what.

As I was now 1st Sergeant, and we were heading into unknown territory, the Captain placed me on point for the pickets that were on the road in front of the battalion which was marching in column behind us.

Let me say that that was a pretty steep hill. It was also pitch black which didn't make it much easier to see where we were going. I am only 31 years old and in fairly decent shape, but I had to stop to catch my breath a time or two. I found that it wasn't so much that I had trouble breathing, it was more like my legs began to feel like they were about 200 pounds each.

Being at the head of the column, it was an awe inspiring site to be able to get up to the top of the hill and look back down the road behind me and see the entire battalion behind me. All of them with knapsacks, bedrolls, and correct uniforms.

As we reached the top of the hill, we could see a campfire off in the distance. Not knowing whose it was, I was sent along with two privates to go down the road an explore. As we were walking down the road, it sounded like a heard of buffalo was on the loose. I didn't know if there were pickets around, if there were cavalry, or if there were Federals. My heart skipped a few beats until we ran into a picket post of two soldiers who reported that they were part of Reese's battery attached to Wheeler's Cavalry.

I reported back to my Captain, and then to the Battalion commander what we had found, and we were ordered to Bivouac near them. It was some of the worst ground around. I had a very hard time in the dark finding a decent spot to lay in. We were told no fires, but the other companies didn't seem to have received that order and little camp fires popped up all around the area.

I lay down on my patch of earth with a groundcloth below, and the blanket and other groundcloth above. It was a cold night with no fire, howling wind blowing across the barren hill, and rocks and sticks in my back and side all night. I MIGHT have gotten an hour of sleep all night. Finally, about 4:45am I got up and started gathering up my belongings and packing them. Reveille was at 5am and I conducted roll call. Finding all of us still there, I reported into the Adjutant and then issued rations to the men which had been drawn the previous evening. There was plenty of bacon to go around, though it didn't seem like we had a lot of time to cook it.

We moved out right at dawn and came to a crossroads where there was a broken down wagon. We were ordered to search the wagon but the officers told us not to go in the wagon itself for there was a woman in there who was still changing. I tried to keep a watchful eye on the militiamen as we rummaged through the items near the wagon. I was tempted to pocket a sweet potato or some corn but decided not too. Instead, the family offered us two hams!

One was issued to Company B, the other was kept by our company. Many of the men took turns holding this ham on our subsequent march. I think they grew quite attached to it!

We soon came across a cabin, but did not stay long. We continued moving and the company spread out as a skirmish line as we advanced. Finally, we came to a steep hill with fallen timber on the left and a cabin on the road in front of us that had several women around it.

Company A was ordered to guard the hill, which we did. We heard cavalry in the distance, but nothing else. It was only 8:30am when we were pulled off the hill and towards the commissary cabin where the women were cooking.

I tried to make polite conversation with one of the ladies, Brandy, who was traveling back to her home nearby. The Major ordered us to turn over our ham to the commissary...something the men were NOT happy about. The Ham had almost become the 12th enlisted man in our unit, and we were reluctant to turn him over. But, orders are orders and we did as we were told.

By 9:00am, we had our orders. We were to clear a path up the hill for the artillery piece, build two positions on the hill for the piece, and then dig about five or six rifle pits for the infantry to provide cover fire for the artillery piece.

We dug, and chopped, and moved branches and limbs until about 11:00. A group of four of us cut down a dead tree and used it as the base log for protecting the cannon. It was great to see the guys working on building actual rifle pits and gun emplacements.

By noon, we were moved to another side of the hill and were given chicken and broth. The chicken was rubbery and the broth was like drinking hot unflavored water, but it was food. It was now nap time for most of the unit since most of us had little to no sleep the night before. By 2:30pm our Captain wanted us to go on a patrol, which I was on.

As we moved down the road, heard some firing off to our right and low and behold, the cavalry had captured about a dozen Federal troops. It was the first blue we had seen all weekend. Further down the road, I saw a group of ladies and one man who were from Louisiana and trying to make their way towards Milledgeville. I asked Lt. Gangler if we could escort these civilians back to the commissary area, and he agreed. I had a good conversation with them and they seemed to appreciate the protection that we offered to them.

We moved back to our positions on the front of the hill about 4:00pm and saw a few Federals emerge from the wooded crossroads below. B company immediately opened fire as did our cannon and the Federals soon retired.

About half an hour later, were ordered to make as much noise as we could. We hammed on trees, beat branches into other branches, and talked loudly for about 20 minutes while the rest of the militia formed up and marched out to meet the Federals.

It seemed to me to be a sharp engagement, but it was soon over and the militia was back in camp by about sundown. It was then we received word to stand down for the evening while the event organizers sorted it all out and tried to track down lost units.

We bedded down for the night, had fires, and ate ham, peas, corn, and CHEESE! I had also brought a jar of strawberry preserves, and the Captain, the Lieutenant, and I shared the jar until it was empty. What a treat it was just to have some jam!

Saturday night was better then Friday, as I was able to get some sleep and stay mostly warm near a campfire. We had not lost a single man that day or that night, so we still had 11 enlisted and 2 officers for morning report.

We were soon moved back down the road that we had marched up on Saturday morning and were posted along with another company to defend it. We waited for about an hour, and the Federal columns came with a fury.

They were on our front, to our left in the ravine, and to our right on the hill. We were almost surrounded. We fell back to the commissary cabin, and all of a sudden, the Federals were behind us too! It was prisoners who had overpowered the militia guards. We got the order to about face and drive them off, which we did.

It was a sharp, but brief fight. We were ordered to fall back, and it seemed as if we didn't stop for a while. Finally we were ordered back forward again when the Federals were using militia prisoners as human shields. But we got the best of them when the order to lie down was shouted at our prisoners and we charged the Federal column.

That was the last fight we had before exiting near our initial muster area at about 10:00am.

As I have seen a few others post, it was the best two days I may never do again. I was hot and cold, tired, sore, hungry, thirsty, scared, and unsure about what was going on; all of which I am sure my ancestors when through.

Thanks again to the staff!

Matt Young, 1st Sgt.
A Co., 11th Ga. Militia

[Pvt_Sullivan]

Re: AAR Bummers

Gentlemen,

Here is the kicker... There should have been no pickets for the Federals on either night. Were we not supposed to be foraging parties inside the lines of the 15th Army Corps? Not grand guards placed to protect the 15th Army Corps? I questioned placing the pickets on Friday night.

I really wonder now how many of the selected event commanders and participants delved into history to contemplate what the role of a foraging party really was? Those who were expecting opposing picket lines or a stand up battle for Bummers should have been as dissapointed as those who didn't get to forage liberally.

Please don't blame the Armory Guards or Mess No#1 for any historical inaccuracies. Any blame belongs on us participants for not living up to the ideal of Man-Method-Materials we strive for.

[billwatson]

Re: AAR Bummers

"Sadly, too few of us are willing to do Kabuki and not play."

Yes. I expect to be doing more Kabuki at events involving extensive marching. The warranty has run out on my knees and I'm on borrowed time. Trucks, wagons, odd jobs, schlepping stuff, even heavy stuff, is easier, on my knees, anyway, than extended marching. It should extend my time/number of weekends in the hobby. I'm already down for Kabuki whatever is going on at Port Republic next spring. Someone else will have to bring the map.

[Hank Trent]

Re: AAR Bummers

Sadly, too few of us are willing to do Kabuki and not play.

Wait... what?

While I am in complete awe and deeply appreciative of the incredible amount of Kabuki and scene-setting work that the organizers put in for Bummers, it seems that more of that wouldn't have solved the problem.

Wasn't the issue 1) a need for maps which would lead to 2) the ability to find the abundant food and water which was on site, just not in the same place as the troops?

I'd be glad to volunteer to draw up period-style map(s) which could be copied and issued to necessary participants, for any event I'm attending, if I'm given modern topo map(s) or whatever to start from. Attached is the scan of the little scrap of paper that saved our behinds.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

[Bill Cross]

Re: AAR Bummers

Wait... what?

While I am in complete awe and deeply appreciative of the incredible amount of Kabuki and scene-setting work that the organizers put in for Bummers, it seems that more of that wouldn't have solved the problem.

I am unclear to what extent the problems with the event were due to deliberate decisions by the organizers (e.g., to march down a road they knew was flooded) vs. lack of help (in other words, did they not have enough folks to do a run-through of all the roads? Were there not enough runners to get help for the injured man in my party?). I hesitate to speculate about things I don't know. I'm sure the organizers will explain things when they are ready.

Wasn't the issue 1) a need for maps which would lead to 2) the ability to find the abundant food and water which was on site, just not in the same place as the troops?

I don't believe there was a lack of maps. I have been told they were withheld from the Federal officers. At least this is what I have been told, and I certainly did not have one. It's why, to echo Bill Rodman, I was genuinely happy to see your home-made map Saturday afternoon.

Additionally, it wasn't we couldn't find the forage; we had spent too much time getting past the flooded river road to get to the place where the forage might be hidden. The daylight was going to run out, and the men were wore-out and without sufficient water. Not knowing where we were vis-a-vis the forage made any attempt to go looking for it border on the stupid.

I have discussed this very topic with your lovely wife, Linda, before: if you're going to have an "Easter egg hunt" (finding forage, interacting with civilians, whatever), you either have to hide the eggs where the hunters are, or make sure they will stumble upon the eggs by sending the particiapants to the place where the eggs are hidden.

[BrianHicks]

Re: AAR Bummers

I am unclear to what extent the problems with the event were due to deliberate decisions by the organizers (e.g., to march down a road they knew was flooded) vs. lack of help (in other words, did they not have enough folks to do a run-through of all the roads? Were there not enough runners to get help for the injured man in my party?). I hesitate to speculate about things I don't know. I'm sure the organizers will explain things when they are ready.

It is my understanding that some of the men of Mess No. 1, whom had done site visits, and familiarized themselves with the routes of the Federals, were not able to participate due their real lives interfering with this peculiar hobby of ours. This resulted in Eric and Marvin, both of whom knew the area, but perhaps not as intimately as the others, having to step forward and carry on.

So yes.. there was a challenge on number of Kabuki players in the background as their numbers where diminished at the start of the event as compared to from they had planned to have available.

[BrianHicks]

Re: AAR Bummers

I'm not cool, tough or liked enough to do your events.......

but I am all about the history and have invested some serious book time into "the March to the Sea"..... can you advise where Sherman's forces negotiated a truce which allowed US forces to pull their pickets between ATL and SC ?

or was this for event related purposes ?

Thanks in advance.

It is my understanding that the truce was called due to the lack of accountability on the whereabouts of a certain Federal participant who seems to have walked off without notifying anyone else in his column. With fears of an injured man lost in a ravine, it seemed prudent to stop all aggressive actions, hold men in place, within their lines, and thus free all event staff and kabuki types the freedom to go into the wilderness and try to locate the missing, and perhaps injured man.

[BrianHicks]

Re: AAR Bummers

Wasn't that an advertised and expected part of this (or any) campaign event, though?

So was the truce in the plans from the very beginning? Don't know why, I just thought it was a last-minute decision based on various unexpected issues that cropped up.

Otherwise, it sounds like picket duty should never be held Saturday at any nationally-advertised campaign event that's not on flat ground.

Military reenacting isn't really my thing, but my absolute favorite part is standing picket duty at night and the realism of an active enemy nearby instead of the mainstreamism of the other side camped in view and wandering over to visit. If enemy threats are eliminated from the hobby Saturday night, geez, there goes my last incentive. :(

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com

Hank... in my previous life, a certain real world military school which I was soon to take charge of, had a student who after returning from the field after five days of stress, sleep deprivation and less than one meal a day, against orders to spend 8 hours at rest in the school room, decided to drive the 1.2 miles between the school house and his parent command and his old barracks room. 1.2 miles.... he had a one car accident and did not survive. Now... this Marine was not a boot. He was a SSgt. who should have known better, but... he thought he could tough it out and make the short drive. Many Officers and Orderly Sgts at events have no idea whether the men they are putting on picket or guard duty live nearby, or have a 12 hour drive to get home, and sadly... many don't look close enough at their men, or ask the right questions to know when it is more prudent to give the men the opportunity to rest or atleast assign to duty those who are best rested, or live closer to the event site.

Who amongst us would like to be the unit Commander of more likely, the Orderly Sgt. who is informed that one of their guys didn't make it home... he fell asleep on the drive back, and in the back of your mind you can't help but think... was he one the fellows I put on Guard duty last night between 12 and 4?

By the way.... I'd like to take you up on the offer to make period maps for an event.

[Hank Trent]

Re: AAR Bummers

I am unclear to what extent the problems with the event were due to deliberate decisions by the organizers (e.g., to march down a road they knew was flooded) vs. lack of help (in other words, did they not have enough folks to do a run-through of all the roads? Were there not enough runners to get help for the injured man in my party?). I hesitate to speculate about things I don't know. I'm sure the organizers will explain things when they are ready.

I agree about the organizers, but coming at this from a participant's viewpoint, it seems that it's worth discussing how to proceed with the hand that was dealt, for whatever reason.

This was my kind of event. I want to see a lot more like it. It was fun. So that's why my interest in this is strong.

I don't know about military reenacting so maybe my basic premise is wrong, but I'm picturing that a handful of people can make consensus decisions for their group, while a large military party has officers who make the same kinds of decisions for their group, which the privates (theoretically) just follow without input.

If so... when you came to the flooded part of the road, if the goal was to get to the roads with civilians and presumably forage, would a map with houses not have allowed the officers to choose the easiest alternative route to get to the goal?

It looks like the steep face along the river road was only about a mile long. Turning back a mile, if you'd had a map, you could have climbed the hill where it was easier, entered the site via the ridge road, dropped down a ravine, and started on the same easter egg hunt on moss falls trail with only a couple of extra miles of walking. It would have reversed the path we took out of the falls following the map Saturday morning, so I know it was accessible.

If the goal was to deliberately climb the steepest bank to challenge the men, then finding an alternate route obviously wouldn't have accomplished that. Dunno what to do in that case, other than hope that only those who love climbing steep banks sign up for one's event. :D

I don't believe there was a lack of maps. I have been told they were withheld from the Federal officers.

If that would have solved the problem and still keep the event within the organizers' vision, then even easier. Simply issue the maps in the future.

If it wasn't within the organizers' vision for the event, I dunno what would be the solution. Better conditioning of the men? Longer time frame to allow less efficient movement toward the planned objectives? Beats me.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@gmail.com