Those suffering hypothermia

[PogueMahone]

I'm curious to know if any of those that were evacuated with hypothermia were wearing cotton socks or shirts vice the wool versions?

[David Dalton]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

I was one of them and i did what ever i could do to keep warm i have wool sock an issue shirt(wool) I had been taking care of my self along with the other 2 but we spooned like no other but still came down with it...

DD

[NewHopeChurch]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

I was wearing wool socks - however they'd been soaked through. When the rain came into our shebang, that got the rest of my socks, too, both cotton and wool.

My shirt was cotton. The wool one I had ready for sleep also got drenched with the leaky roof that plagued DD, Annis, and myself that night.

I'm really not sure if either material would have been preferable given the circumstances.

[Silas]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

As a dry blanket was thrust upon one of the three hypotherms, someone had him shuck his soaked jacket. I noticed he had a wool shirt beneath the jacket which was a good thing, but he had a cotton shirt beneath the wool one. I told him to shuck that, too, then put on the wool shirt. It seemed to help him because the cotton shirt was wet.

But for the pre-event planning to evac folks like the frozen five, the saying that cotton kills could have been proven true once again. People think I'm odd for wearing wool shirt and wool drawers, but nights like that prove the wisdom of the idea. I swear by 'em.

[Old Reb]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

Silas, I just think you are odd and it ain't got nothing to do with your drawers. Now, I mean odd in a good way like with some folks I say they are special in a good way. I am wearing wool drawers as I type. I like wool drawers. Oh, I was wearing a wool undershirt and had a wool blanket and was looking for a sheep to spoon with, but I still got right chilly. I did find Fred and he was almost as good as spooning with a sheep but probably smelled worse. Not that I was not foul of odor. Just saying.

[Spinster]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

In looking at what happened further down in the bottoms in our cold camp, the main factor seemed to be water and 'build'.

One member of the group was an EMT, without any diagnostic equipment, but with excellent professional judgement.

Those in worse straights were male, thin, and under a piece of canvas with seams that opened occassionally as the rain got heavy. The one in worst condition was well dressed in woolens, but very wet. One who was poorly dressed for the weather solved his problems by walking up and down the path vigorously, despite the rain.

Fairing somewhat better, were the women. Two were wearing all cotton, with the exception of stockings and shawls or coats. Our shelter was somewhat more water resistant than the men's but they were still soaked, as I had made the shelter with one occupant in mind. I was by far in the best position for the weather--with a wool dress, two wool petticoats, two pair wool stockings, a wool coat, oiled silk bonnet and coat--and the worst homemade leather shoes for any sort of journey.

There was a cotton petticoat in that mix that I would have ripped off with a knife, if my hands could have held one. How a cotton garment gets dripping wet between two layers of slightly damp wool is an interesting point for thought.

All had good head covering and wool socks. Build (ahem, amount of body fat), and the degree of soaking seemed to have more influence on the ability to stay warm than the presence of absence of any particular clothing item.

[LibertyHallVols]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

There came a point on Thursday night where I realized that there was no room in the shebang for me and the rain would be with us all night. I decided that the only way for me and my gear to stay somewhat dry would be to wear it and put on my gum blanket and make ready for a sleepless night. I then bellied up to a hot fire.

I don't really know of anyone that night who was able to sleep AND be warm. Silas probably came the closest, he caught a bit of sleep leaning against a tree next to the Company B inferno. Those sleeping (or trying to sleep) in tents said they were shivvering and cold. Those who were warm were mostly huddled around a fire.

[Will Eichler]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

Count me in the "huddled around a fire" crowd. I did spend a great portion of the night with my fellow sergeant Andy Roscoe drying (or partially drying and then warming) socks, blankets and other items and handing them back into the shebang we were in front of. It really seemed to make a difference with the fellows inside.

Quite the experience......

Yours,

Will

[unclefrank]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

The only thing that kept me from hypothermia were the heroic actions of Will and Andy. Those two saved more than a few of us, and I'm thanking them for it.

[yankee]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

Frank,

The only thing that wasn't any help was the Irish Redsnake!!!:sarcastic

LOL!!!

[Mgreer]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

I think I may have been the only person who was both dry and warm. I slept under the fly with the Fred Baker, Mr. Heath, and the Wagon folks. and i know i stayed quite dry. If they hadnt come to tell me my pard was near death i would have stayed that way but i braved the elements to help a friend out so the 4 of us DD. Annis, Scotty and I camped pout in my horseless wagon over night.

[PogueMahone]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

Thanks for the input folks.

I do think there is something to be gleaned from this.

[Charles Heath]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

I've spent more than a few miserable days and nights outside, and it isn't the first wet-n-cold night that gets you, but the second night when you start off sopping wet and chilled to the bone with dim prospects of a good warm fire. Our little shelter half roof extension off the teamster's fly was helpful during both Wednesday and Thursday. For a fellow who had never buttoned up a pair of shelter halves before, Will "States Rights" Tatum did a fine job. Overhead cover is good. Relearning not to touch overhead cover is priceless. The "no dig" restrictions prevented us from digging (some dug anyway) diversion ditches around the fly and extension, but trenching around tentage and shebangs is an excellent practice where and when allowed. I'm glad Marvin/Del stayed relatively dry and warm, as he was wearing a whole bunch of cotton. Changing shirts between rainstorms just before sunset was a good idea on his part. That green shirt hanging on the diagonal log was certainly wet. The spare blanket Nate-The-Teamster loaned Marvin had to help with the sleeping situation, too.

When we put out the blazing fires and picked up the trash Friday morning in the federal camp, we found not one but two pair of black mid-calf dress socks abandoned, and justly so. The men wearing those likely had cold feet. Wet wool retains 80% of it's insulative value. Wool wicks, cotton absorbs. The company level pre-event information about wool vs cotton was excellent. I hope folks read it, and I strongly suggest saving that excellent company level pre-event information for future use even if you do hear this type of advice at nearly every COI you attend.

Terre mentioned something worth noting earlier in this thread, and is a layer of cotton betwixt layers of wool absorbs water, as the wool naturally wicks in that direction. You'd think it would work the opposite, as it does for just one layer of cotton. Linen, by the way would have been a bad choice, but linsey-woolsey would have been useful. The fellows with canton and domet flannel drawers were likely doing fine, but the fellows with muslin or checked cotton drawers were probably not doing as well. I gave up on osnaburg drawers a long time ago, as they are the first cousin to wet-dry sandpaper even when damp. Your abrasive situation may vary.

Even for those who are experienced campaigners (that number grew thanks to ITPW), take the time this week to sort through your uniform and equipment items to assess what worked, and what did not work for you during the event last week. You may wish to add or subtract a few items in that old kitbag. For example, I'm glad we opted for the bacon grease soaked oil cloth instead of the happy little hand sewn fly (left in Will's Subaru back in camp), because the former - along with one of our gum blankets - kept the ammunition dry. When we had a choice between keeping the food or ammunition dry, we opted for the ammunition. Why? Not that history has anything to do with it, but black powder isn't $4 per pound anymore. That is also why the ammunition boxes went directly into the masonry outhouse during the final unloading of the wagons Friday.

Bottom Line: Gitcha some extra wool socks.

[ohpkirk]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

Linsey woolsey was indeed useful as both my pants and jacket were made of it. The pants were dry within moments of being next to a fire and the jacket (excepting the cotton lined sleeves) was warm also.

[Wagoneer]

Re: Those suffering hypothermia

Ok I am trying to get smarter here... Ok it might be a hard trip.

As most know With the wagons I prefer to do a civilian impression. It is easier to take the wagon behind either line.

I need to get a better impression as far as clothes.

My civilian frock is a wool blend. My shirt, and trousers are Cotton.
I have my Military Cav Clothes, Both US and CS. But that messes up the Civilian impression we want to lean toward. Many Wagoneers were hired out Civilians.
Suggestion?