Zouaves

[yankee]

Why?? Why were there Zouaves in the Civil War. Was wondering what their purpose was. Why wear the outrageous uniforms. I don't know, was it for intimidation??? Were they suppose to be like shock troops?? I am just kind of confused with the whole thing. Please would love some good inquiries on this subject. Just Why??

Best,

[rebpvt1864]

Re: Zouaves

Hello "yankee"! Zouave were not shock troops but merely regular everyday soldiers. There were A LOT of zouave battalions and regiments. The uniforms were french/European influenced and were usually flashy. People always ask "why would thay wear those uniforms into battle and stick out like a sore thumb?" You have to think about it, if there was a full regiment of zouaves the enemy soldiers would be looking at hundreds of red clad men. So no one really stood out. Not like reenactmens where the zouaves are so few they are just thrown into a battle line and really do stand out! I hope this very vague discription will be of help!

[GreencoatCross]

Re: Zouaves

It had to do with the "French craze" that was sweeping the United States at the time. Not only were zouaves considered to be fashionable in the domestic military, chasseurs (French light infantry) were as well. The QM Department ordered several thousands of sets of chasseur uniforms and equipment early in the war; many were too small to be worn and were thus cut into zouave uniforms for the 155th Pennsylvania Infantry. The French military craze also brought domestic soldiers the kepi as well as the shelter tent half.

Keep in mind that most of the domestic zouaves were not wearing the "real" uniform of a true-blue French or Algerian zouave; they were Americanized "copies" of the authentic zouave uniform. Many Europeans visiting the army camps noted that the American zouave uniforms looked poorly made, cheap, or otherwise lacking the details of the real thing.

Others here are dyed in the wool zouave experts so I hope they speak up to add their knowledge!

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Zouaves

Hallo!

In the 1850's, interest in things "Zouave" reach a peak, especially after the French exploits in the Crimean War, and particularly after a Frenchophile captain named George McClellan served as an observer and came back sinigng their praises.

;) :)

Because of the fashion, a number of local militias adopted the French Algerian costuming, which followed into some companies and regiments in the Civil War.

(ACW Zouave uniforms came in more than red. ;) :) )

Curt

[yankee]

Re: Zouaves

Okay, I think I get it. So basically the united states military just wanted to see how our troops would seem like with this type of military uniform and I guess it just never stuck ( thank God). Though flashy, I just thought that they had a purpose, such as light infantry or some other type of service. I appreciate the input guys!! would like more if more still want to post.

Thanks,

[Ian McWherter]

Re: Zouaves

What ultimately ended the "Zouave Craze" in America was the crushing defeat of Emperor Napoleon III's Army during the Franco Prussian War of 1870-71, and who's army did America immediately start copying with the new 1872 regulations?

The exploits of the French Zouaves during the Crimean War, particularly the Algerian Tirailleurs, were well known in America at that time. It was the French Light Infantry's heroic capture of the Russian Malakoff redoubt during the siege of Sevastopol, that ultimately led to the fall of the city, the British troops that took part in the assault threw down their weapons and fled.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Sevastopol_(1854)

Less well known today but very well known at the time was the ferocious assault of the Algerian Tirailleurs at the Battle of Solferino during the Second War of Italian Independence.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Solferino

There was a perceived cockiness and swagger about the French Zouaves that was especially appealing to fashion conscious young men. Even the General staff of the British Army acknowledged (with some envy) the tremendous fighting spirit of the Zouaves.

[erik]

Re: Zouaves

The assault on the Malikoff was a French endeavour. The British assaulted the Grand Redan. The French were gloriously victorious. The assault on the Redan certainly less so.
I suppose when you are shot you throw down your arms or huddle in the ditch or mewl in fear. Then again after Inkerman and the winter I can see that.
But Wikapedia as a source?
The Victory at the Malikoff Tower was a French Army triumph including The Guards, Infantry of the line, Chassuers and Zouaves.
The fame of the zouaves derives from the legend that they brought to the Crimea from their exploits in Algeria. By the time of the Malakoff they were primarily Metripolitan French. Certainly dressed in the style and drilled in that way.
The American enthusiasm certainly derives from that tradition, capitolised by Col. Ellesworth and others in their endeavours and success.
The style of Zouave and Chassuer lived throughout the WBTS and was part of the fabric of the war.
To dismiss it as a fashion is counter productive and an insult to the men who gave their lives while wearing this uniform, not a costume, like the 140th New York at Gettysburg. To allege, feebly, that an allied army threw down their arms while being slaughtered in front of an impregnable fortification is churlish.

Erik Simundson

[rebpvt1864]

Re: Zouaves

Hello "yankee"! There was still a whole battalion of zouaves("the zouave battalion") present at the surrender of the army of northern Virginia. The zouave uniform was around for a bit as seen with militias after the war, but most wartime units were disbanned from service because their service was no longer needed, the rebelion was crushed and national troops could handle the demiliarized reconstuction districts of the south. The real last combat use of the famed zouave uniform that i can think of was in World War 1. The French had white panted zouaves, but the tedious trench warfare and needlessness of the uniformed caused it to fade out.

[Dignann]

Re: Zouaves

http://www.zouave.org/craze.html

http://www.zouave.org/origins.html

Eric

[yankee]

Re: Zouaves

Well Erik,

No one is trying to bag on the men that fought in the uniform. I just thought that soldiers called zouaves were like a special force of infantry and so I thought they had more of a purpose than regular infantry, because of their outrageous uniforms. You know somewhat like the Berdan Sharpshooters wearing Green. The uniform seperated the men from the regular infantry by the color of their uniforms, but also served a well purpose in blending with terrain. And yet that is why I asked the question. I never made the statement of what they were, but what I thought which is why I asked the question, better to have facts backed up. And yes they may have been dismissed as a fashion statement because that is what most people look at, no matter what time period. I bet hardly any citizen of the United States, during the Civil War, knew about the Crimean War, but those officers that went down to France. So the soldiers ,of those zouave regiments, probably thought," what and why the hell am I wearing this ridiculous uniform." They probably never knew until there officers told them of what these brave French soldiers did. The bold is my thought, not supported by facts or research.

Just my extra two cents,

Best,:sarcastic

[yankee]

Re: Zouaves

Eric Mink,

Thank you so much for the inquiry. I take back all that I said during the last post in bold. Thanks this helps me out a lot.

Thanks,:D

[erik]

Re: Zouaves

Yankee,

I quite understand your reaction, but please note that my comments were directed at another post not yours.
The zouave phenomenom was a result of 19th century Military fashion derived from the exploits reported during the Crimean War.
You are quite correct that the major portion of the American population may not have known much about the Crimea, but the major urban centres where news papers were published did. These are the places where this new fashion took hold.
You are quite correct that the new recruit must have thought twice when given this odd assortment of clothing to do the job that everybody else in normal uniform was asked to do.
After Fredrick The Great won his wars everybody marched at b70 beats per minute and doing the goose step. When The British Guards drove away the Old Guard at Waterloo, Bearskin caps denoted Guardsmen. And so on.
The zouaves built a reputation and their lore and costume was adopted.
One might ask why the US military wears berets. A totally useless headress that does not protect against anything nor shade the eyes. British Paras, SAS, Royal Marines, Special forces with Green berets bought from Canada. You see where this is going.
Your question was valid, though I do not understand why anyone would wear such a costume. They did and covered themserlves with glory.
My deepest regrets for your misunderstanding of my remarks.

Erik Simundson

[yankee]

Re: Zouaves

Thanks Erik,

I do get the pattern. They started a "trend" and the military now award their best with this same type of "trend". I guess it was a good way to make people notice," hey!! we are pretty freakin' good at what we do!" and those "outlandish" uniforms make them stand out as one of the best soldiers in the Army. I would probably say that that could somewhat be the same with the famed Iron Brigade and their black hats. Thanks for clearing that up for me Erik!:)

The Best to you and the great Zouaves,

[csuniforms]

Re: Zouaves-Elmer E. Ellsworth

The Zouave craze took off through the hard work and desire by one man Elmer E. Ellsworth and his Chicago Zouaves. They were national drill champions in 1859 and many US Militia Companies changed their drill and uniforms to compete with Ellsworths boys. He was the match that lit the flame!! He died in Alexandria taking down the Confederate flag and was shot by the hotel owner.

Tom Arliskas
CSuniforms