Why did the Southern Man go to war?

[LWhite64]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

As has been said there were many non-slaveholders in the south, but many were parts of families that were, and even those who didnt still might hire a slave from a slaveowner, they might be able get employment from a slave owner, the might get a loan from a slave owner or somehow benefit from those who did. Theres a reason many of the large slaveholders were elected to office by the common folk of their districts.

Lee

[LWhite64]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

A key to understand all of this though, and even Dr. Glathaar misses, is that ideology for fighting is STRONGLY connected to WHEN a soldier enlisted. Look at the enlistments in 61 and what do you see? Where do they come from? What families do they come from? What regiments will they be part of?

Lee

[LWhite64]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Also to tie in with what Hank posted from De Bow, here is an open letter from Gov. Joe Brown of Ga that addresses the issue of why Non-Slaveholders had an interest in supporting secession.

http://civilwarcauses.org/jbrown.htm

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Gentlemen, and those of you from Texas,

-Ian, You could not have put it better "Southern Intellectuals went to fair lengths to make sure that poor whites identified with the rich whites more than they did with the slave population"....better known as "Propaganda".
-Wars are fought over Economics, has been since time began. The Economic Ruling Class must sell the idea to the Bourgeoisie....who in turn will formulate the idea... while the "Wanting to be Bourgeois" will propagate the idea to the Working Class.
-Slavery was nothing more than an implement in the Southern Economy.

Once the above is accomplished...You must organize for Revolution, with the following:

1. Procurement
2. Supply and Services
3. Logistics
4. Mobilization
5. Battle Support
6. You must go through a phase called "Deterioration and Revision"
7. Reduction and Reorganization
8. Demobilization

War is an Art, and the Artist must know how to mix the colors....It sure as heck wasn't "The Cause"

The above source was: The Sinews of War: Army Logistics 1775-1953, written by Dr. James A. Huston, Office of the Chief of Military History , United States Army

[KPavia]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

-Slavery was nothing more than an implement in the Southern Economy.

I don´t want to ignite a firestorm here but I think, Mr. Beasley, you under-emphasize the importance of slavery to the Southern economy. Slavery was not only an implement of the economy but slavery WAS the Southern economy. James McPherson quotes in the book I've already mentioned on page 107

"This country without slave labor would be completely worthless," wrote a lieutenant in the 28th Mississippi in 1863. "We can only live & exist by that species of labor: and hence I am willing to fight to the last." A captain in the 8th ALabama also vowed "to fight forever, rather than submit to freeing negroes among us...[We are fighting for] rights and property bequethed to us by our ancestors."
Some Confederate soldiers welcomed Lincoln's Emancipation Proclomation for bringing the real issue into the open. "The Proclamation is worth three hundred thousand soldiers to our Government at least," wrote a Kentucky cavalry sergeant who rode with John Hunt Morgan. "it shows exactly what this war was brought about for and the intention of its damnable authors."

To see the ideological reasons behind the Confederacy starting the Civil War, it is good to look at what Southern leaders were saying, such as John C. Calhoun. And from looking at what Southern leaders were saying at the time, you'll see what McPherson says in his book- that the ideology behind the Confederate cause was to protect slavery.

I think to white-wash the importance of slavery to the Southern economy and Southern way of life is to mis-represent history. And as mentioned before, we need to look at it from an historical context and realize that 19th century ways of thinking aren't the same as our 21st century ways of thinking. But to be living historians and to represent the time period truthfully, we need to aknowledge both the things that make us proud of the past and the things that make us blush.

Slavery was more than an "implement" of the Southern economy. The core of the Southern economy was slavery.

And has already been stated, despite the ideology of the "cause," not all Confederate soldiers enlisted to fight for slavery. That may be true for the volunteers of '61 and '62 but with conscription starting in 1862 and the Union control of many border and Southern states, many men from the mid to late war period joined for a myriad of reasons besides slavery.

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

- I try to keep it short and to the point.
- Where were the large Asset Owned Banks located? In the North.

Bottom Line: if you ask the question why did the low middle and lower class go to war?
- They were protecting their homeland.
- They just didn't know better.

Why did the Nation go to war?
-Its the Economy.....

[LWhite64]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

The following is from a member of Morgan's Cavalry written in the unit's camp newspaper after the annoucement of the emancipation proclamation.

"Now any man who pretends to believe that this is not a war for the emancipation of the blacks and that the whole course of the Yankee Government has not only been directed to the abolition of slavery, but even to a stirring up of servile insurrections, is either a fool or a liar."

The following is from a resolution by a group of Louisiana students who were attending the University of North Carolina, the author, T.B. Davidson, became a Sgt in the 19th Louisiana.

"Where as, fanatics at the north after years of toilsome and untiring labor, to wrest from the South her most cherished liberties, have at last gained an influence and power, which if not promptly resisted, mst soon subvert her rights as free and reduce her to the mean condition of depending upon the North. Louisiana feeling this, has found necessary of resuming again her sovereign powers...Resolved, that being deeply impressed with sentiments of patriotism for the honor of our beloved state; we are ready to forsake the peaceful duties of a college life, and take up the sword in defence of that sacred Liberty, we have been to taught to cherish from our earliest childhood; and in defence of that Institution at once our pride, and the source of all our health and prosperity."

[LWhite64]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

And one of my favorites although from an unknown Tennessean in March of 1861,

"The man, wild, fanatical, unholy, outrageous warfare they have waged against the south and her most sacred institution, until its practical tendency has developed in the John Brown Raid upon the sacred soil of Virginia, and the recent conflagrations of towns and villages of Texas and the poisoning of her citizens."

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

I did and with regret use a modern source of comparison, from the Source that I used, The Sinews of War: Army Logistics 1775-1953.., Written by Dr. James A. Huston, Office of the Chief of Military History, United States Army, Washington D.C., 1966, Army Historical Series. The book that I reference compares theory of warfare, the art of warfare, economics of warfare, and the household support of the people who lived during the times during the period of it's title. I had hoped that the period of The American Civil War, which was covered during the period of 1775-1953, could be used and compared, I regret that it could not.


Regretfully Submitted,

[coastaltrash]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

"Why men fought?" and "What was the Civil War over?" are two totally different questions with two totally different answers. Actually the "Why men fought" question has as many answers as there were people in the war. The war itself was over slavery. Simple. The end. If you don't believe it, go read the articles of secession of a few southern states. Now that's not saying that my great great great Grandfather went off to fight for slavery, but the State Legislator of Mississippi certainly pulled the state out of the Union to protect the institution.

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Patrick,
Please refer to my post Number 19. There I described the process of which a Nation goes through prior to a war. Propaganda being a important factor in developing the classes of people to rally behind. There I described Slavery being as an implement of the economy.

In short, as most believe Slavery was the main issue, getting a Soldier to fight for something that he does not have a dog in the hunt....Lies the art of developing a mindframe of the population to follow. The two questions that you brought out, I feel should be compared, otherwise unless we study history we will repeat the same mistakes. For one brings and developes the other.

For me to compare this to the war in which is fought now would not be allowed on this forum, and I certainly do not want to go against the rules of this website.

Thank you for your opinion, and wish I could discuss this further with you at Ft. Gaines, but I will be at Ft. Devens.

Take Care.

[Jimmayo]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Lt. John Lewis of the 9th Va. had this to say after the war.

"We believed then that we were right and we believe now that we were right then."

Too bad we can't ask him what he was thinking. Maybe he just didn't like what had become a Northern Government.

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Jim,
I also regret we can not ask him following the war his opinion. But it goes back to the "Art of War".

[Dale Beasley]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Gentlemen, and those of you from Texas,

I believe that I also am fighting a loosing cause, in the attempt of explaining the process of preparing the populas (sp?) to wage a war. I respect your opinons, many are simply not what I have studied in the past 30 years. But your opinons are very interesting. With respect for the rules of this site and the moderators, please let us discuss this in a Private Message forum.

I am respectfully, yours

[coastaltrash]

Re: Why did the Southern Man go to war?

Dale,
My senior capstone was written about this subject, so I'm a little bit qualified on where I'm coming from. "What this Cruel War is Over" is a pretty good and short read on the subject and goes into some pretty good detail about "the cause" or rather lack thereof. Fast forward to 1864 and consider Loring's Division before the invasion of Tennessee. Kind of hard to convince a guy he's defending his home and cause when he's going through his home state trying to round up deserters. And why did my Grandfather go off, same reason yours did. They believed that their life and the safety of their family depended on it.