jacket issued sizes

[kirklandaustin]

Hi i was wondering on the way Richmond depot sized there jackets to issue to the troops. I know that not every jacket fit perfect and some times did not fit at all, but what i was wanting to find out is what where the sizes issued to the troops, or a better way to put it is what sizes did they make at the depot. Where all the depots making the same jacket size variations, or was it that north Carolina made a size 40 as its medium and Richmond made a size 42 as its medium. Last i just to through out there, why do sutlers not make there uniforms this way? i just ordered a new jacket and they wanted all my measurements, and me to come out with a jacket that fit like an officer would have a jacket fit instead of an enlisted man.

Austin Kirkland
"just a poor man fighting a rich mans war"

[Michael McComas]

Re: jacket issued sizes

Austin,

I can't answer the first question, but I can answer the second.

Original jackets were issued to the troops, at government expense. The soldier could take it or leave it. Reproduction jackets are made for people who are paying $150-200 for them. When they get a garment that doesn't fit, life gets unpleasant for all involved. Also, few people today fit the "issue size" profile of 1861.

[rmilstead]

Re: jacket issued sizes

Austin,
See the attached link. I believe your question is answered as best it could be:

http://www.blueandgraymarching.com/articles/dear-richmond-depot-please-.html

I'm sure the definition of the comparable US Army system sizing that is referenced is available if you do a search on this site.

Hope this helps.

Dick Milstead
Hardaway's Alabama Battery
Baltimore Light Artillery
The Company of Military Historians

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: jacket issued sizes

Hallo!

The "concept" was based on a system of common sizes with larger or smaller being made as special requisitions. A man was expected to wear what he received regardless of size, self-tailor or have it modified, or trade up or down with another man for a better size fit in the exchange.

Although, believing in a very short war, and not wanting to get into the expense of uniform production and distribution, in 1861 the Confederates used the "commutation" system where the individual units or the individual men supplied their own. But by 1862 that had proved inefficient and ineffective, and they largely adopted the Federal depot system (although some men opted out with private purchase as well as "home sent."

Most lads, NUG, want uniforms that fit so makers meet that demand. Some few lads, like myself at times, have been known to purposely order sizes up or down to reflect that aspect of CW issuances at times.

And last is another side discussion where some segments of the CW Community want uniforms that fit and feel like the modern clothes the are familiar with every day. Say for example, they do not like historically accurate trousers that are high waisted so they prefer more modern day styled trousers that are hip-huggers (and then ponder why there is a back draft in the gap between trouser top and jacket bottom).

Curt

[Bill]

Re: jacket issued sizes

Hallo!

And last is another side discussion where some segments of the CW Community want uniforms that fit and feel like the modern clothes the are familiar with every day. Say for example, they do not like historically accurate trousers that are high waisted so they prefer more modern day styled trousers that are hip-huggers (and then ponder why there is a back draft in the gap between trouser top and jacket bottom).

Curt

Curt,

Some of us have a problem that rarely existed for the "real" soldiers. Our belly's turn every pair of trousers into "hip-huggers"! :confused_

[Elaine Kessinger]

Re: jacket issued sizes

The concept of a "standard size" is just introduced during this time-frame.
Prior to this, ready-mades were made up in the "size" the cutter cut out. The cutter used the measurements of the pattern he had on hand. Some manufacturers varied their "sizes" and some didn't. Some ready-mades dealers sought varied "sizes" for purchase and some didn't pay much attention.

The average man of this time was very accustomed to having a professional tailor fit his garments specifically to him. Officers were still expected to provide their uniforms. This allowed them to patronize tailors for garments that fit them. The average man of the time was also accustomed to ready-made garments needing to be tweaked by a renovator for optimal fit.

When a tailor is drafting a garment, he needs a variety of specific measurements or the fit will be very off. He is literally starting from a square box and using those measurements to draw out the pattern pieces.

Modern ready-mades purveyors generally manufacture with sizes based on clothing industry standards. Thus, you could buy coats in a 38, 40, 42, 44, 46, 48 chest in example, or regular or tall length.
Bespoke tailors will need all the measurements to draft a garment that fits.
Each are catering to a different market.

Has Mr. Arliskas covered "sizing" in his book "Cadet Gray and Butternut Brown"? Anyone know? That book is a wealth of information on Confederate uniforms and how they were acquired.

[hireddutchcutthroat]

Re: jacket issued sizes

Has Mr. Arliskas covered "sizing" in his book "Cadet Gray and Butternut Brown"? Anyone know? That book is a wealth of information on Confederate uniforms and how they were acquired.

I must say the Arliskas book is a must read. It really changed how I look at the appearance of the rebel soldier.