Pedersoli uh oh!

[maillemaker]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Yeah, well I am. :) I am spreading the news far and wide.

I urge everyone email Pedersoli and ask for the Enfields to be put back the way they were:

info@davidepedersoli.com

Steve

[McNally]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

The photo they're using on their website doesn't reflect this change. Can that be considered fraud?

[Craig L Barry]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

First of all, Pedersoli did copy an original (Tower 1861 WL Sargant & Son P53). I worked with them on it and we corresponded about a year and they got a number of details right. The larger hammer, the lockplate markings, the proof marks, the barrel bands, etc. They also bought two copies of The Civil War Musket which has quite a bit on the P53 Enfield. The mistakes, things like not having the round nut on the end of the barrel band screws, etc are partially an oversight but mostly because the Sargant P53 was missing those. I thought the short butt version was a good variation to offer even though the Sargant was not a short butt design. If I recall correctly, there were numerous "ideas" they had for various design "improvements" which I tried hard to talk them out of doing, and was mostly successful. Not always though. For example, they insisted on uniform depth button rifling when the originals (at least those made after 1858) had progressive depth rifling. I strongly recommended doing a reproduction of the P56 for their "two band" version, but they decided to go ahead with the P58 Naval rifle despite the lack of very much Civil War provenance, because it used most of the same hardware so it was cheaper to do so. All this was some years ago, and it's water under the bridge. Pedersoli said "thank you" and gave me the first one they made for my trouble and then did what they wanted to in the end. I think the consensus over time was that the Pedersoli was a step in the right direction compared to the other option, the ponderous and weird Armi Sport P53.

This move though...well it's a deal breaker. I was corresponding with Todd Watts about it and there really isn't anything you can do to remedy this other than weld over the clean out screw, in which case you won't be able to clean the flash channel in the present configuration. And therefore you can really no longer consider the Pedersoli P53 a viable option. If the N-SSA Small Arms Committee allows this in their competitions, well that's up to them. However, the (re)enactment community is very likely to react negatively to these changes and frankly, nobody in their right mind is going to buy one. You can write customer service all you want, the Italian gun-makers do not grasp our fascination with getting the details of these things right. A generation ago, Geoff Walden shared his monograph on "Authenticizing Your Reproduction Enfield" and tried to work with Euroarms to get them to make improvements to their P53, which then EoA President Paolo Amali said they were interested in doing, but never did.

My opinion on why the Pedersoli P53s are prone to clog in N-SSA competition? It's not the flash channel design at all. It's the incorrect vent design in an over hardened steel cone with a pin sized vent. The originals use a figure-8 shaped vent. The metal on the factory Pedersoli cone is too hard to drill out, and Todd Watts and I both broke the hardest drill bits we could find trying to enlarge the vent, so I gave up and went with a Regtqm steel cone with a larger vent and bingo. The problem was solved.

And I think if Pedersoli asks, I may tell them that...but trust me, they will not ask.

[maillemaker]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

They listened to us to re-tool the thing, perhaps they will listen to fix this problem. I encourage everyone to email them at: info@davidepedersoli.com

This is a trivial change for them as they were already making it the correct way before.

Steve

[MuleyGil]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Sent my e-mail 'bout 10 minutes ago.

[maillemaker]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Thanks, Gil!

Steve

[Brent Dacus]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Just bad..

[MuleyGil]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

I got this response from Pedersoli:

Dear Sirs:

It has come to my attention that your company has added a clean-out screw to your reproduction muzzleloading Enfields. This is historically incorrect.

I have been competing in the North-South Skirmish Association since 1970. I am also a re-enactor. I had been thinking of purchasing one of your Enfields, but will NOT purchase one that has the clean-out screw in the bolster. I request that you return to manufacturing your Enfields in the prior pattern, minus the clean-out screw. If you do, I will reconsider buying one of your Enfields.

Thank you,

Gil Tercenio


Dear Mr. Tercenio,

Thank you for your email.

We normally opt for solutions that guarantee the safety first and second ease the use of the rifle , of course we have to evaluate all the factors.

Somebody in the past days tried to insinuate that the clean out screw facilitates our manufacturing work. How a screw makes us save money in the overall rifle production is difficult to understand. It is an additional work, therefore it adds a cost to our manufacturing process, we were willing to take, to solve the misfire problems, often caused by the very different types of black powder used all over the world, not to mention the substitutes.

We have any problem to go back to the previous design, we want to reassure you and all NSSA shooters and re-enactors.

Best regards,

Customer service



DAVIDE PEDERSOLI & C.
Via Artigiani, 57
I-25063 GARDONE VALTROMPIA
(Brescia) Italy
ph. +39 030 8915000
fax +39 030 8911019

http://www.davide-pedersoli.com/guns...rsoli.asp?l=en

[McNally]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Somebody in the past days tried to insinuate that the clean out screw facilitates our manufacturing work. How a screw makes us save money in the overall rifle production is difficult to understand. It is an additional work, therefore it adds a cost to our manufacturing process, we were willing to take, to solve the misfire problems, often caused by the very different types of black powder used all over the world, not to mention the substitutes.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

You didn't bring that up. They said something similar when I asked them if they planned to update the photos on the website to reflect the change they made (a question they didn't answer). Which was weird, because I also didn't bring up the manufacturing process when I contacted them.

It's worth pointing out that the bolsters on their 1860 Volunteer and Whitworth rifles match the appearance of their 53 Enfield and also have clean-out screws. COINCIDENCE?!!

We have any problem to go back to the previous design, we want to reassure you and all NSSA shooters and re-enactors.

Also, what the hell does this mean?

[maillemaker]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Yeah, I got the same response. I wrote back asking for clarification.

Steve

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Hallo!

Translators universal, using on-line, be might they. :)

"It is an additional work, therefore it adds a cost to our manufacturing process, we were willing to take, to solve the misfire problems, often caused by the very different types of black powder used all over the world, not to mention the substitutes."

Seriously. IMHO...

Not using competition cones (nipples) with tiny apertures, and knowing how to clean an Enfield is cheaper.

Plus, competitive shooters like in the N-SSA tend to clean their arms at the end of each of the five or six live-fire "events" (targeting) after a few shots... versus the high volume of blanks (a different fouling "curve") fired by reenactors in the field.

Curt

[Sackcoat]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Response to my email to Pedersoli.

Dear Mr. Musgrove,


Thank you for your email.

We can reassure you, we reverted to the original design and the Enfield rifles will not feature the clean out screw, following the recommendations of N-SSA re-enactors.

Best regards,

Customer service


Joe

[thomas aagaard]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Craig L Berry posted similar on civilwartalk.

"Dear Mr. Barry,
You do not have to worry, we removed the clean out screw.

Best regards,
Stefano Pedersoli"

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Hallo!

Success, progress, "we" have been heard, or just a form letter email?

Here is my reply that just arrived.:

"Dear Mr. Schmidt,

Thank you for your email.

We can reassure you, we reverted to the original design and the Enfield rifles will not feature the clean out screw, following the recommendations of N-SSA re-enactors.

You can now buy a new Pedersoli Enfield rifle in line with your living-historian and re-enactment activity.

Best regards,

Customer service"
"

Curt

[maillemaker]

Re: Pedersoli uh oh!

Thanks to everyone who took the time to write Pedersoli and ask for the change. Now to wait for the old stock to work its way out of the pipeline! :)

Steve