fake jacket on ebay

[rebyank]

If this is original, I'll eat my great coat.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=36035&item=2244761665&rd=1

enjoy

[JimConley]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Just curious here friend, what leads you to believe this jacket is not an original? I don't think your accusation can be affirmed until the item is looked over first hand by someone who can prove it is not a relic or could counter by linking this jacket to a soldier. You may be chewing wool in the end.

[1stMaine]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Just curious here friend, what leads you to believe this jacket is not an original? I don't think your accusation can be affirmed until the item is looked over first hand by someone who can prove it is not a relic or could counter by linking this jacket to a soldier. You may be chewing wool in the end.

Comrades,
Well, I wouldn't touch that with a ten foot pole. Simply put, the dealer selling this item is attempting to make money off the gullibility of the buyer, through his "as is" caveat. Just because it's from an estate sale doesn't mean it's old. Original jackets start in the 5-figure range and go up, and there is no way this fellow would take a jacket like this, alledgedly ID'd to a specific regiment, and not have it appraised. He know's it's a fake and so do we.
respects,

[JimConley]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

I did not look over the literature on the item, but as I said in the last post, what is it about this jaket that would lead you to believe this is a fake? Outside the price? I do not claim to be any afficiando on the subject, but curious.

[Iron Scout]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Jim C,

I'll bite...

First off, I think it's a simple act of deduction from the writing in the jacket. I highly doubt a service jacket would have lasted 1861-1864 in the field. Second, just a set of NC starburst buttons alone would fetch much more than what the jacket is going for right now. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out. Why don't you request some higher quality pics from the seller and we'll discuss the nuances a little further. I think Ian's and Tim's assessments are completely on target.

Regards,

Neill Rose
Palmetto Living History Association

[JimConley]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Neill,
Thank you. I've gotten my lesson for the day.

[Gallinipper]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Aw darn, and this was just getting good. Personally, I was uncomfortable with the machine-stitched buttonholes and the omission of Sharpsburg in that list of "Battle Honors".... Anyone else? Bueller? Bueller?

Rich Croxton

[JimConley]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Aw darn, and this was just getting good. Personally, I was uncomfortable with the machine-stitched buttonholes and the omission of Sharpsburg in that list of "Battle Honors".... Anyone else? Bueller? Bueller?

Rich Croxton

Rich,
Not that I am stepping in to back this item, but those buttonholes quite possibly were done by hand. They do make one skeptical, but clothiers during that period did have guides (I believe some type of wire) that were placed over the hole itself and then sewn over, which would give it the appearance of perfection, but were done by hand.

[Gallinipper]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Rich,
Not that I am stepping in to back this item, but those buttonholes quite possibly were done by hand. They do make one skeptical, but clothiers during that period did have guides (I believe some type of wire) that were placed over the hole itself and then sewn over, which would give it the appearance of perfection, but were done by hand.

Well....
I should have said "appear to be" machine-stitched. I haven't seen the perfect buttonhole yet on a museum jacket, not as would compare to modern machining, albeit some were very nice. However, these look awfully similar to the ones on a certain Economy Line shelljacket I used to own many years ago (no, don't ask!)..... Too close for my comfort anyway. At any rate, I don't believe Ian's digestive tract has anything to fear on account of this thing. :)

Rich Croxton

[Vuhginyuh]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

There are three ebay dealers in the area this jacket is coming from and they all have offered too-good-to-be-true ''NC Jackets'', ''Tennesee flags'' and CS canteens. That is a red flag to me. This jacket appears to be similar to the other spurious examples from this area. The buttons look to me like early 1980's antiqued examples. The inked in battle honors are new too.

However...a client from Pinehurst asked to pay us to help him with his decision to bid on a NC Jacket from one of these guys three years ago. We could not verify that it was a period artifact and declined his offer, but based on what we thought we saw he purchased the jacket anyway for 10,000 and some change. He sent us the piece for conservation. We nervously opened the crate when it arrived and found the jacket to be in a bit poorer condition than what we expected but still an outstanding example of a hand rendered commutation piece*. Not NC at all. The jacket's local tin-backed block ''I'' buttons were all original, original to the piece and probably worth a good portion of what he paid.
He has since sold the jacket to a collector in Texas for six times his cost. He sent us a nice donation in return.

So you never know...every once in a while a jem shows up, but not this time.

* The States Rights Commutation Jacket from the Skillet Licker is a dead-solid match for the jacket we conserved.



(Geeeez, it's my 300th post... guess I need to do some work too.)

[1stMaine]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Comrades,

Yup, I agree with the post that you never know. However, You sometimes lo9ok at an item and you just KNOW that it isn't "right". Yeah, there were a LOT of uniforms left over in North Carolina after the war, and there is always the chance this is the real McCoy. But I just can't believe that this is the real deal.
For one thing, although the buttons are aged, with a deep patina, there's no way that they would have a worn highlight like that with brighter brass showing through unless the jacket was being worn on a regular basis. The buttons would have a solid overall patina if it had just been stored.
Likewise the darker thread on the buttonholes. I knopw that the maker would have used what was on hand, but a deep blue/black on this jacket? Why didn't the thread fade like the rest of the coat, and why are the buttonholes so neat when the rest of the coat is worn and frayed?
Respects to all,

[Skeet]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

I would have to say the first thing that jumped out was the ink, along with the price. Ink does not hold up that well. Bully, Cpl Dan Morgan 10thVA(IVR)

[FC Barlow]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Another thing. The list of battles seems spurious. Bull Run is listed but the 16th North Carolina DID NOT fight at First Bull Run - it was called the 6th North Carolina in July 1861- redesignated the 16th North Carolina in November 1861. Most CS soldiers referred to that battle as Manassas, not Bull Run.

Many other key battles are missing as well - like Frayser's Farm, Second Manassas, Wilderness, Spotsylvania, to name a few.

[PrettyBoyDonovan]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

I believe the Bull Run in question is 2nd Bull Run, which makes even less sense as I've never heard Confederates refer to it as 2nd Bull Run.

[FC Barlow]

Re: fake jacket on ebay

Ah, yes, Second Bull Run. My mistake. Also, I don't know why the list skips from Gettysburg to Cold Harbor. There were may engagements in between.