Religion-Catholicism??

[Jubilo]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

(Mr. Corbett, Please do not insert modern politics into a discussion of religion. Elizabeth Clark, Moderator)

David Corbett

[J. Donaldson]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

I found out that the Kyrie was in Greek after I posted. Thank you for your correction.

[BishopLynch]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Catholics of the period most often would have prayed their normal prayers in their native tongue. The laity would not be required to say their daily prayers, rosaries, etc in latin. Its a matter of personal preference.

An example: After the war, Pope Leo XIII required all priests after the Last Gospel of the Low Mass to pray publicly with the congregation 3 Hail Mary's, A Hail Holy Queen, a St. Michael prayer, and 3 Most Sacred Heart of Jesus prayers. They can be said in Latin or in the mother tongue of the congregation depending on the priests preference.

That's my understanding of the Mass at the time as well. It wasn't important that the lay person understand everything that was being said, but that they knew when to respond correctly at certain time.

It wasnt and still isnt important that one understands every latin word, that would be an absurd requirement. A Catholic would have then and should now understand the Mass in the sense that they know what is going on and WHY certain things are done. It would make no sense to be a Catholic and go through the motions but have no notion or a vague one about why you are doing what you are doing. This would have been especially been true of Catholics during such an anti-Catholic time in America. With all the nonsense and propaganda directed at Catholics by many Americans in those days, why would one put up with it all if he didnt have a deep understanding of the Faith and the Mass.

This reminds me, I have quite a few original late 1850's newspaper clippings which I found in an old book filled with anti-Catholic reasoning which I would like to post soon for everyone's reading pleasure. Ill get to it soon I hope.

[BishopLynch]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

WOW! I was a REAL FARB when I wrote post # 4 way back in 2004. Its scary and a bit embarassing reading it now.

[J. Donaldson]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

I truly appreciate everyone's help. My grandmother is the only person I have left that would remember Latin prayers/mass, but let's just say that her mind is not as trustworthy as it used to be. Thank you all for your assistance.

[GermanDraftee]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

I would suggest that, along with the responses above and utilizing the resources offered there and elsewhere, that you take into consideration the ethnic/cultural context of the soldier you might be portraying. (Whether a generic or specific person.) The customs, prayers and practices would have some variation. For example, personal devotions involving a patron saint would be different for a German immigrant/descendant, than for an Irish one, and both would have differences from a Louisiana Cajun. As with any impression, you can get as detailed as you desire and the refinement can be quite rewarding.

(As an aside, I grew up in the pre-Vatican II Catholic Church and memorized the Latin prayers for mass as an "altar boy". I can still recite many of them from memory. Just don't ask me where I set my car keys 30 seconds ago. :)

[Fenianboy]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Boy, Can I identify with that! The benefits of a Catholic School education........but where are those keys!?!:)

[Curt Schmidt]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Hallo!

Mine are out in the snow in the yard somewhere.

My car "clicker" is in a snow drift in the front yard somewhere after it fell out of my pocket in the 12-14 inch snow and the snow thrower, "threw" them.

My metal detector is broken, but a friend is bringing his over tomorrow...

Curt

[J. Donaldson]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

This is an article of my own faith rather than my first person soldier. The gentleman (a relative) that I portray was a Methodist-Episcopalian, whereas I'm Catholic. I just feel that I should remain true to my own religious beliefs rather than pretending to have other beliefs. (This isn't meant as some diatribe against religious portrayal, just my own personal belief.) My family converted to Catholicism in the 1870s by marriage, and I actually have a very interesting letter in my papers where the woman my relative married lays out on the line that she is Catholic and WILL have her beliefs respected in the marriage. It makes for an interesting read and how Catholics stood up against anti-Catholic sentiment.

[Salt Pork]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

My Father was an Alterboy also and attended catholic school, and still knows all the prayers in Latin(this was after second Vatcian Counsal), Also Regarding the Medals. What would be the approprie chain for our era, I have heard that the curb chain(one on most medals) has been around since roman times same with the Rolo(just round links) But my question is does anyone know what clasps where used? Info on this stuff is impossible to find. The Medal is a holy object but the chain is not and it would be nice to have a historically correct chain to wear it with.


William Summe (Salt Pork)

[Jubilo]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Dear Madame Moderator ,
Yes ma'am. My apologies ; I had not thought it a modern topic but after your admonishment , I agree. Thank you.
all for the old flag,
David Corbett

[Campjacksonboy]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Here in St. Louis we have a church that does the Latin Mass it seems the Vatican Councl 2 ban has been lifted.
It's something else but there are missals that have the prayers in Latin and English. If you want an idea what the mass was like hit up your older relatives for these missals. I was surprised to find that the Alter boys had a part in the prayers in the mass.
As to people not understanding the mass I'm sure this is true but even in Antebellum St. Louis there were Catholic schools and Latin was part of the curriculum.
Frank Aufmuth

[Salt Pork]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

From my understanding the Church is able to have masses in Latin just not only in Latin.

William Summe (Salt Pork)

[Hairy Nation Boys]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Our church in Iowa City has two "normal" masses and one mass in latin.

[ley74]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Our church in Iowa City has two "normal" masses and one mass in latin.

This may be a little technical but, the post Vatican II Order of Mass "Forma ordinaria" is said in the vernacular (the country's native tongue or Spanish, etc.). The pre Vatican II Mass is now referred to as " Forma extraordinaria", and may be said using Latin at the approval of the individual Diocesan Bishops.

His Holiness can explain this far better than I. See his letter to the Bishops from June 2007

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/letters/2007/documents/hf_ben-xvi_let_20070707_lettera-vescovi_en.html

In short... "It is not appropriate to speak of these two versions of the Roman Missal as if they were “two Rites”. Rather, it is a matter of a twofold use of one and the same rite." BENEDICTUS PP. XVI

Hope this helps.