Religion-Catholicism??

[Stonewall_Greyfox]

After reading a thread on cwreenactors.com I am full of questions regarding Catholicism during the civil war. Questions about scapulas, chaplets, rosaries and other holy trinkets. I am also curious would there have been a Catholic Bible written in the vernacular available to the masses? Any information people have would be greatly appreciated.

Paul B. Boulden Jr.

RAH VA MIL '04

[Spinster]

Civil War Holy Name Society

Head for this link, apply for membership, and ask away. Its a small listserve, and rather quiet except when we are working on something. Mostly real-life Roman Catholics, some with seminary training, who also live their faith in a CW setting, plus a few outlanders like me, well familar with the mother of all Christian churches, but having a different religious profession in real life.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CWHolyName/?yguid=56047633

"The Civil War Holy Name Society is an organization of Civil War reenactors dedicated to researching and portraying the lives of Catholics during the American Civil War. It is our hope that through our activities will manifest a greater Catholic presence at reenactments through period correct religious services and derive a greater appreciation for the history of our Catholic faith."

[Jefferson Guards]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

I have read that thread and there are a lot of 20th century concepts that found their way into it.

The official English translation of the latin vulgate of the Holy Bible was what is commonly called the Douay-Rhiems version. The task of the translation was undertaken by the English College at Douai. The New Testament was translated first while the college had migrated to Rhiems in 1582. The Old Testament was printed in 1609 after the college had returned to Douai. In 1749 and 1752, Bishop Challoner revised the texts. The "Challoner Edition" was what would have been the Bible of the majority of English-speaking Roman Catholics. It was suplanted in the 20th century by the Confraternity version, which is sometimes incorrectly refered to as "Douay-Rhiems" but is not, as it was a new translation utilizing the Greek texts as well as the Vulgate.

[BishopLynch]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Yes, the Douay-Rhiems version would be the acceptable version for that time period as well as the present day. I myself am a Traditional Catholic attending the Latin Mass, the Mass codified by the Council of Trent, evrything that we have received has been handed down since the time of Christ so if you have any questions let me know. I can find alot of things for you. regarding scapulars and rosaries, I carry my rosary in my jacket pocket. It is hard to date vintage rosaries, but if you get a wooden one then its fine. You might want to file off the word Italy or the name of teh country its made in, MAKE SURE YOU DO THIS BEFORE IT IS BLESSED!!!! Other than that you shoulkd be ok with a store bought one. There was a site that had a picture of an original scapular on it, but it has since gone off. I wear my scapular and medals in the field, I dont care if the medals are stainless, or if their is polyester thread holding the brown wool together...this is just a hobby, it is not reality.....religion on the other hand is reality. Besides I really dont think that there are many people who are even going to know what a scapular is anyway. If you get a chance, stop by the Irish Brigade gift shop in Gettysburg. They have some great orginal Catholic artifacts there.
Unitas Veritas Caritas Aequitas

[1stMaine]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Comrade Greg,

I would offer you the idea of considering making some period-correct scauplars and Saint's medallions for folks to use in their portrayals, as wll as in real life. Even though this IS a hobby, the purpose of those who frequent this forum is to come as close as possible to what was available to those we portray. Yeah, folks won't know it's polyester thread, but YOU will, and being able to avoid as much modern intrusion into our portrayals is a big part of remaining in character.
Anyway, the period-correct religious items might be a small source of income for someone who wanted to produce them, and would certainly add an element to the hobby thast hasn't been adequately addressed. besides that, you could set aside a portion of any profits for preservation or any other similar cause you might consider worthy.
That's just my two-cent's worth, and you can take it as you wish. I was raised Catholic, and know full well how much a part of my life the medallions, scapulars and rosary was. My mother passed away with her scapular in her hands, and when in the hospital, kept it pinned to her pillow so it was always nearby.
best wishes, and I remain, sir,
respectfully,

[Robert Braun]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

One general comment...

The devotional items listed by participants in this thread are not trinkets or "toys." Neither are they objects of worship in and of themselves. They are meant to be a help and assistance to the faithful in their daily prayer and devotions.

Because most of these items have been blessed by the Church, they are to be handled with both care and respect.

Regards, Bob

[1stMaine]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Comrade Robert,

Thank you for posting this caveat. It is important to remember that what might seem as a mere artifact or collectible to one person is an object of great value, veneration and reverance to another.
respects,

[markj]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Greetings,

For whatever it's worth, here's an extracted section from a circa August 1863 image reportedly depicting men of Company D, 93rd New York Volunteer Infantry (then attached to Meade's HQ, Army of the Potomac). Given that no known army corps used a "Roman" cross device, the man shown is likely wearing some kind of Catholic religious badge. You be the judge.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[James Brenner]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

The following is an abridged account of the archaeological excavation of four NY, Irish Brigade soldiers killed at Antietam. The full account is in the book, Archaeological Perspectives of the Civil War, Clarence R. Geier and Stephen Potter, editors. (ISBN: 0-8130-1834-X).

"[In Grave 1] only one of the man's personal belongings was left in the grave -his Roman Catholic Miraculous Medal ... A Miraculous Medal also was found in the plow zone near Grave 3 and may have been associated with it ...The soldier in the fourth grave had both a Miraculous Medal and a Rosary. The lower length of the Rosary, consisting of two large Our Father beads and three smaller Hail Mary beads and a small brass crucifix, was discovered in the area of the upper torso and neck."

There is a picture of the artifacts from Grave 4, but it's difficult to make out the details of the Medal. However, the caption cites the Smithsonian Institution

[markj]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Hi James,

Yep, "Archaeological Perspectives..." is pretty good. The article on the dig at the Brawner Farm is alone worth the rather steep price of the book.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[J. Donaldson]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

To reopen this thread, I have a question about prayers. I'm a post-Vatican II Catholic, so I've never attended a Latin Mass, nor have I heard the language uttered in Church, save for the Kyrie. Would a Catholic say their daily prayers (ie. the Our Father, Hail Mary, prayers of the Rosary) in Latin or in the vernacular? This thread is the closest I've found with the search function that might answer this question.

Thanks in advance.

[Elaine Kessinger]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

My Grandfather, raised pre-Vatican II Catholic, said his Our Father, Hail Mary, Act of Contrition, and Mass prayers in Latin, he blessed his meals in English and his Bible and prayer book/catechism books were in English. (he was born in 1914). Post-dates our era, but does show how long some practices held on. :)

[stx]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

I know that during church the congregation would respond in Latin, but I think because pre vatican II mass was almost like the priest was communicating with god while everyone else watched on the sidelines that latin prayer would be reserved for the clergy and everyone else would pray in the vernacular. I can't say this is a fact but after being in the Catholic School system for eleven years it seems to follow what we've been taught about the early church.

[J. Donaldson]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

Tim-

That's my understanding of the Mass at the time as well. It wasn't important that the lay person understand everything that was being said, but that they knew when to respond correctly at certain time.

[ley74]

Re: Religion-Catholicism??

...nor have I heard the language uttered in Church, save for the Kyrie...

The Kyrie is in Greek.